FIAT 500 - gearbox failure at 30,000 miles. Dealer sorts it?

[Soov535]

PhillipM said:

Soov535 said:

Warranty's expired and you've tampered with it.

No chance.

Tampered with it? Does your engine warranty expire when you check the level on the dipstick too?

He should have taken it to the dealer and let them drain the oil.

If you want goodwill then just leave it alone. They can quite legitimately claim that the low oil might have caused it.

[TooMany2cvs]

PhillipM said:

Tampered with it? Does your engine warranty expire when you check the level on the dipstick too?

So how often does your owner's handbook suggest the owner should drain the gearbox oil? Weekly, as with the dipstick?

[gtidriver]

On the other side, my panda100hp in its 4th year of warranty(extended)died at 3.8yrs and 65000miles. It was recovered to the main dealer and driven out a week later with a factory reconditioned engine, the cambelt tensioner had failed.Cost to me £169 as I had them change the clutch as well, this work on the car was at the supplying dealer that I only use for servicing. This is the same dealer that replaced my whole steering wheel after the volume button became a bit sticky. Loyalty to a dealer sometimes works. Plus the service manager likes beer

[Craikeybaby]

FIAT dealers seem a bit of a lottery. My wife took her 23 month old 500 to the dealership who supplied it with an exhaust rattle, they gave her some guff about it being cold and told her to come back in a month if it was still doing it. Then when she took it back she was told that the 3 year warranty was actually a 2 year Fiat warranty then a 1 year dealer warranty, which covered next to nothing. We were pretty pissed off, but despite pointing out that we brought up the issue with them whilst the car was under warranty they refused to help us.

4 Fiat garages later we've finally found a decent one, a family owned garage, rather than part of a larger group. Although recently they have had their Fiat franchise taken away and moved to the notoriously bad Renault garage down the road.

[Moominator]

Did you admit to opening, looking at to Fiat or their garage?

If you have, or hinted I wouldn't be surprised if they are cold.

[glasgowrob]

Poor show

And it's blindingly obvious that it's a manufacturing fault from what your saying

[Gilhooligan]

A mate had a gearbox fail at 27k in a fiat bravo 150. Fiat offered to pay half the bill on a brand new gearbox. He ended up just getting the original box refurbished as it was cheaper (about 4K for a new box).

[Richyboy]

I had a low mileage panda that would crunch into second gear. Dealer said nothing wrong.

[PhillipM]

TooMany2cvs said:

So how often does your owner's handbook suggest the owner should drain the gearbox oil? Weekly, as with the dipstick?

It's not drained, I just took a sample from the hole that there's for checking the fill level. You know, the plug that's there exactly for the specific purpose of checking the oil level in your gearbox.

Edited by PhillipM on Wednesday 10th February 19:54

[PhillipM]

Soov535 said:

They can quite legitimately claim that the low oil might have caused it.

They can, but since it's not at the age where a gear oil replacement is required and it's quite obviously the old original oil, I'm not sure how well that would work out for them. Because it would have had to be low or leaking from the factory...

[gtidriver]

Does the car have any/full service history with FIAT or has it been serviced out of the dealer network.???

[Kolbenkopp]

Think legally you are out of luck, but I'd try to get something out of them if I was in your situation.

Perhaps it helps a bit putting yourself in FIAT's shoes? Imagine the guy being in charge of goodwill operations there. His goal is probably only to help with the most obvious and/or damaging (reputation wise) cases. I also assume such a guy will get presented a lot of crap -- people blaming failures where clearly the product is not at fault but the user is.

So first up would be to clearly establish the fault is a result of a manufacturing defect. Is the main dealer the best place for this? Not sure, but if they are interested in future business with you they might be.

Once that is established a written complaint to FIAT HQ telling them you are quite disappointed with the product and expect some help. Worth trying IMO, since this is not *that* much work.

[PhillipM]

gtidriver said:

Does the car have any/full service history with FIAT or has it been serviced out of the dealer network.???

I think everything bar the last service (although that might be because it's only just due, not sure), but I'd have to check the book.

Edited by PhillipM on Wednesday 10th February 20:27

[PhillipM]

Kolbenkopp said:

Think legally you are out of luck, but I'd try to get something out of them if I was in your situation.

Perhaps it helps a bit putting yourself in FIAT's shoes? Imagine the guy being in charge of goodwill operations there. His goal is probably only to help with the most obvious and/or damaging (reputation wise) cases. I also assume such a guy will get presented a lot of crap -- people blaming failures where clearly the product is not at fault but the user is.

So first up would be to clearly establish the fault is a result of a manufacturing defect. Is the main dealer the best place for this? Not sure, but if they are interested in future business with you they might be.

Once that is established a written complaint to FIAT HQ telling them you are quite disappointed with the product and expect some help. Worth trying IMO, since this is not *that* much work.

I can imagine, yes, but given the cost to diagnose and then remove the box is the same as fitting a new gearbox anywhere else but a dealer would be....it wouldn't be that hard for them to just say 'Yes, IF it's a manufacturing defect we'll cover it, if not you'll foot the bill' rather than 'sorry, can't comment on what we might or might not do'

Basically that means we could take it down, pay for diagnosis, pay for the gearbox removing, for Fiat to turn around and go 'yes, manufacturing defect, but out of warranty, sorry' - in which case we're no better off but the car is now stuck at the dealers with no gearbox and a fair bill.

[Rick1.8t]

The OH had a KA with the same gearbox - 2nd gear failure at around 60K, you couldnt even hold it in 2nd while under load - other gears fine.

We didnt have the box stripped, just ordered a box from a breakers and had it changed as it was by far the cheapest option, cost around £650 inc the box, new clutch, cambelt, waterpump, welding to exhaust bracket and full service so not the worst thing in the world - Would not be happy if it was under warranty / 30k miles though.

Plus point with them being cheap tat is that they are cheap to fix - but they are what they are, a cheap peice of ste in a 'girly' frock.

Edited by Rick1.8t on Wednesday 10th February 20:32

[PhillipM]

We had a Brava do that at 60k a couple of years back, 2nd gear let go on the way down the box and it spat the bits out of the bottom of the casing
At 60k you can just about stomach it, and with it being 2nd gear just put it down to previous abuse.
Funnily enough it would still just about drive in first with a lot of clonking and squealing noises. Not bad for a big hole in the box where the teeth had fallen out...

[Moominator]

gtidriver said:

Does the car have any/full service history with FIAT or has it been serviced out of the dealer network.???

This. Plus (eg) two stamps in three years isnt the best FSH.

[MrBarry123]

Being as honest as possible OP, how kindly do you think the car has been teated?

Whilst gearboxes shouldn't go that early, treated badly they quite easily can.

[PhillipM]

MrBarry123 said:

Being as honest as possible OP, how kindly do you think the car has been teated?

Whilst gearboxes shouldn't go that early, treated badly they quite easily can.

Honestly? It's perfect, the rest of the car is spotless, there's not a mark on it, it's got decent matching tyres on, etc, etc.
I can understand mistreated gearboxes doing synchros, or lunching a diff, but not an input bearing.

[havoc]

MrBarry123 said:

Whilst gearboxes shouldn't go that early, treated badly they quite easily can.

Genuine question - if the synchro is intact (as suggested by OP), how else could a gearbox be abused?

Not surprised by the OP's story - Fiat still have an appalling reputation for customer service and seem ill-inclined to improve it. Any 'shaming' should be done by the owner really though...