110 3.5 to 4.6 maybe
Discussion
Hi, I've been on ph for a while but have never posted anything so here it goes.
I recently bought a 110 v8 and I feel like it could do with a bit more POWER, so woulc like to know how much it would cost to put a 4.6 in there with the ECU sorted and what would need to be done in regards to the ecu or could it run on carbs without too much hassle?
Samee
I recently bought a 110 v8 and I feel like it could do with a bit more POWER, so woulc like to know how much it would cost to put a 4.6 in there with the ECU sorted and what would need to be done in regards to the ecu or could it run on carbs without too much hassle?
Samee
Samee said:
Hi, I've been on ph for a while but have never posted anything so here it goes.
I recently bought a 110 v8 and I feel like it could do with a bit more POWER, so woulc like to know how much it would cost to put a 4.6 in there with the ECU sorted and what would need to be done in regards to the ecu or could it run on carbs without too much hassle?
Samee
I think Real Steel do a stroker kit that takes it to 5.0 or so ? maybe a bit more ?I recently bought a 110 v8 and I feel like it could do with a bit more POWER, so woulc like to know how much it would cost to put a 4.6 in there with the ECU sorted and what would need to be done in regards to the ecu or could it run on carbs without too much hassle?
Samee
Oddly dont see a price for it on their terrible website
http://www.realsteel.co.uk/section1.pdf
Or V8 Tuner
http://www.v8tuner.co.uk/category.php?id=29
Whilst I do think a stroker kit would be nice I think it would be a little too much as I just want a relatively easy way of making more power and think that buying a 4.6 engine would be much cheaper.
I think I read that the front timing cover has to be replaced with one from a p5 if you want to convert a p38 rv8 to carbs, or am I starting to make things up?
I think I read that the front timing cover has to be replaced with one from a p5 if you want to convert a p38 rv8 to carbs, or am I starting to make things up?
If i were going to the effort and expense of a higher capacity engine swap, i'd want to make the most of it with fuel injection and critically, mapped ignition, which will allow the engine to return significantly better MPG and running smoothness etc! Plenty of the usual LR modifiers/converters offer Megasquirt or similar systems pretty much off-the-shelf.
Samee said:
Whilst I do think a stroker kit would be nice I think it would be a little too much as I just want a relatively easy way of making more power and think that buying a 4.6 engine would be much cheaper.
I think I read that the front timing cover has to be replaced with one from a p5 if you want to convert a p38 rv8 to carbs, or am I starting to make things up?
yes....but finding those 4.6's...and finding one that has a good block is another matter.I think I read that the front timing cover has to be replaced with one from a p5 if you want to convert a p38 rv8 to carbs, or am I starting to make things up?
you have been warned I wouldn't consider using an unknown 4.0/4.6 block unless it was top hat linered 1st IMO I´m building 110 300TDI to 4.6V8 EFI conversion to my customer right now..
Fully rebuild gearbox and transfer box in place R380/LT230 1.22 ratio..
Thor engine to 2001 range rover..
I made a fully engine rebuild just in case, Cylinders are honed, new Glyco bearings inc cam bearings. Piper 270cam.. Roller rockers. Home ported stage 3 specks heads.. Inlet manifold slightly ported.. Thor manifold is limiting porting to mutch..
4-1 hedman headers, home made 3" SS 316L exhaust pipe, 2x mufflers.. Also it will use Magnaflow SS CAT`s to get MOT test.. Also we have DECAT pipes to get engine run in first.. I do not want to burn those cats in the first start if engine is over fueling..
We are hoping to see +270hp/450Nm of torque.. Customer want to use THOR manifold, not plenum like older V8 has.. Car is not finished yet.. Coolant hoses make some meditation, and also fuel lines because old has got some corrosion.. I do not want to lift body of.. Also nee some wiring etc..
Fully rebuild gearbox and transfer box in place R380/LT230 1.22 ratio..
Thor engine to 2001 range rover..
I made a fully engine rebuild just in case, Cylinders are honed, new Glyco bearings inc cam bearings. Piper 270cam.. Roller rockers. Home ported stage 3 specks heads.. Inlet manifold slightly ported.. Thor manifold is limiting porting to mutch..
4-1 hedman headers, home made 3" SS 316L exhaust pipe, 2x mufflers.. Also it will use Magnaflow SS CAT`s to get MOT test.. Also we have DECAT pipes to get engine run in first.. I do not want to burn those cats in the first start if engine is over fueling..
We are hoping to see +270hp/450Nm of torque.. Customer want to use THOR manifold, not plenum like older V8 has.. Car is not finished yet.. Coolant hoses make some meditation, and also fuel lines because old has got some corrosion.. I do not want to lift body of.. Also nee some wiring etc..
If use at least 2000 year block, it is better than old ones.. My friend has 2000 range rover 4.6 witch has been cooked at least 10times before it went crak..(not diagnosed yet if it is craked, it might be a gasket also? i do not have time yet to diagnose it) He dosen´t understand nothink for engines, and he run last time without bottom hose, because thermostat craks and blows bottom hose out.. He didin´t notice that before it is to late..
If you find a good one, it wont need top hat liners.. I build this defender engine without top hat liners, because all pistons look good without any sign of coolant leak, and cold and hot pressure test didin´t show any leak..
But if you want to sleep your night, go for top hat liners..
If you find a good one, it wont need top hat liners.. I build this defender engine without top hat liners, because all pistons look good without any sign of coolant leak, and cold and hot pressure test didin´t show any leak..
But if you want to sleep your night, go for top hat liners..
If the later rv8's have the issues with the liners then would it be possible to use a buick 300 crank in the 3.5 rover v8 and not increase the bore. Surely this would avoid the problem with the liners. But from what I've heard the 300 crank is a bit longer than the crank in the rover v8 so would it be possible to mill it down?
PaulKemp said:
Megasquirt is not an option for the hobby tuner you have to get very involved, many rolling roads won't touch it.
I would consider a supercharger on the engine you have
I have thought about going down the Supercharged route but I would like a unit which wouldn't come out over the bonnet.I would consider a supercharger on the engine you have
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Samee said:
I have thought about going down the Supercharged route but I would like a unit which wouldn't come out over the bonnet.
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Plenty of centrifugal blowers out there....whether or not there are any kits...and kits to fit your specific vehicle is another matter, and they arent usually cheap.Any suggestions would be appreciated.
I'm sure a lowish rootes style valley mounted blower could be done too, but again, whether anyone makes a kit or not is another matter.
A turbo setup can be built fairly cheap though
Do you have a budget in mind? Tbh all this talk of super chargers, 5.0 litre blocks of Chevy engines is likely in the realm of £5000-15,000+ and a shed load of work. Which is fine if that is the budget you are looking at. But I got the impression it wasn't.
Also some of these things will require you to be a highly proficient home tinkerer with the right tools. And may well be beyond the realm of a lot of home mechanics.
In terms of engines. Is you have a carb 3.5 then they are low CR and only made 137hp stock. With age and miles and a worn cam/followers then you might be nearer 110-120hp. Don't get me wrong, they went quite well for the era in such a vehicle. But I can see why you want more.
Buying any engine used is risky. But tbh I think it's not as bad as painted above. You just have to take your chances. The other summer I went from an SD1 cammed 3.5 in my TR7 to a 3.9 serp from a late Disco 1. All in I think it cost me around £1000 or so. But that was my labour, if you are paying someone to do the work, expect it to cost more.
And it's the little things, new engine mounts, clutch, hoses etc that can all add up.
I already had a 4 barrel Edlebrock carb and Luminitions. So ditched the EFI. Carbs are certainly an easier bolt together option. But I wouldn't want to run SU's. They will strangle a bigger RV8. And 4 barrel carbs aren't exactly cheap.
Mega squirt is certainly an option. But will add a fair chunk of money to the build and also complexity in getting it fitted and working. My advice would be to try and get the full stock EFI setup and run that initially. If you want to go Megasquirt do it after you've got it running and enjoyed it first.
EFI should make for a smoother and more fuel efficient setup. Although PEAK power over a good carb setup is not likely to be massively different.
A 4.6 obviously has the displacement advantage. But tbh a good 3.9 or 4.0 litre would likely be a pleasing result too. Classic Range Rovers and Disco 1's go well with these and would be a marked improvement over a tired low CR 3.5.
Don't be tempted to swap in an auto though. A manual will be faster and more fun.
If you want to spruce the engine up a little, good bolt ons like a good full exhaust, intake and a mild cam and new followers are probably worth it. And will give good gains for the outlay. I wouldn't spend big on a Rover V8. You can sink £1000's into them and still only make average power.
My cammed 3.5 was rolling roaded at circa 230hp fly and 219ft lb. It had a nice 'on cam' kick to it. The 3.9 has stock internals, so in theory shouldn't be making as much Peak HP. But tbh the seat of the pants feel is actually better. And it seems plenty quick.
If you are wanting big power and don't mind spending. Then a Chevy LS is probably the way. But you'll need to upgrade loads of other bits too.
Also some of these things will require you to be a highly proficient home tinkerer with the right tools. And may well be beyond the realm of a lot of home mechanics.
In terms of engines. Is you have a carb 3.5 then they are low CR and only made 137hp stock. With age and miles and a worn cam/followers then you might be nearer 110-120hp. Don't get me wrong, they went quite well for the era in such a vehicle. But I can see why you want more.
Buying any engine used is risky. But tbh I think it's not as bad as painted above. You just have to take your chances. The other summer I went from an SD1 cammed 3.5 in my TR7 to a 3.9 serp from a late Disco 1. All in I think it cost me around £1000 or so. But that was my labour, if you are paying someone to do the work, expect it to cost more.
And it's the little things, new engine mounts, clutch, hoses etc that can all add up.
I already had a 4 barrel Edlebrock carb and Luminitions. So ditched the EFI. Carbs are certainly an easier bolt together option. But I wouldn't want to run SU's. They will strangle a bigger RV8. And 4 barrel carbs aren't exactly cheap.
Mega squirt is certainly an option. But will add a fair chunk of money to the build and also complexity in getting it fitted and working. My advice would be to try and get the full stock EFI setup and run that initially. If you want to go Megasquirt do it after you've got it running and enjoyed it first.
EFI should make for a smoother and more fuel efficient setup. Although PEAK power over a good carb setup is not likely to be massively different.
A 4.6 obviously has the displacement advantage. But tbh a good 3.9 or 4.0 litre would likely be a pleasing result too. Classic Range Rovers and Disco 1's go well with these and would be a marked improvement over a tired low CR 3.5.
Don't be tempted to swap in an auto though. A manual will be faster and more fun.
If you want to spruce the engine up a little, good bolt ons like a good full exhaust, intake and a mild cam and new followers are probably worth it. And will give good gains for the outlay. I wouldn't spend big on a Rover V8. You can sink £1000's into them and still only make average power.
My cammed 3.5 was rolling roaded at circa 230hp fly and 219ft lb. It had a nice 'on cam' kick to it. The 3.9 has stock internals, so in theory shouldn't be making as much Peak HP. But tbh the seat of the pants feel is actually better. And it seems plenty quick.
If you are wanting big power and don't mind spending. Then a Chevy LS is probably the way. But you'll need to upgrade loads of other bits too.
Edited by 300bhp/ton on Monday 30th May 00:09
So I am in the same predicament and some research took me down this path with my V8 3.5 twin Stromberg carb engine
1) How old is the 110 V8 ? - Early engines had restrictors in the carbs and google will show these are less than 100bhp - you can remove the restrictors.
2) When you take a rocker box off is it full of black tar or nice and clean ? If it's black it's not been serviced and its likely the cam is shagged and timing chain stretched.
Land Rover V8s are normally low compression and will run even though they're really worn ... mine ran ok but was also utterly gutless
I had the above and decided ...
1) Heads off and cleaned
2) New cam and followers
3) New timing chain
4) Holley 500 carb manifold and inlet.
5) New rotor arm distributor cap and leads (all Lucas)
Off to the rolling road in a couple of weeks so will let you know the results ...
1) How old is the 110 V8 ? - Early engines had restrictors in the carbs and google will show these are less than 100bhp - you can remove the restrictors.
2) When you take a rocker box off is it full of black tar or nice and clean ? If it's black it's not been serviced and its likely the cam is shagged and timing chain stretched.
Land Rover V8s are normally low compression and will run even though they're really worn ... mine ran ok but was also utterly gutless
I had the above and decided ...
1) Heads off and cleaned
2) New cam and followers
3) New timing chain
4) Holley 500 carb manifold and inlet.
5) New rotor arm distributor cap and leads (all Lucas)
Off to the rolling road in a couple of weeks so will let you know the results ...
Edited by 838HNK on Friday 3rd June 16:02
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