What engine damage can be caused by contaminated petrol?
Discussion
520TORQUES said:
DId you authorise them to carry out any work not covered by the warranty?
Taking the engine to pieces then refusing warranty, leaving you with a pile of scrap seems rather out of order.
No authorisation was given by us. They just followed VW/Skoda UK warranty dept instructions. Then at the end of the process Warranty said NO and the dealer came on to us asking for us to pay for everything.Taking the engine to pieces then refusing warranty, leaving you with a pile of scrap seems rather out of order.
SkodaIan said:
Have you been anywhere near Chippenham recently?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-68...
I only noticed this story because I used to live just round the corner from that petrol station. There are probably others in the news I've not seen so worth a good search on Google to see if any petrol station you've used has been affected.
So much time has passed before we got the 'contaminated fuel' story out of them that I really think too much 'water' has passed under the bridge. It will be an insurance job if we cannot get the dealer to accept liability and if the contaminated fuel idea is true (which I am presently suspicious of)https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-68...
I only noticed this story because I used to live just round the corner from that petrol station. There are probably others in the news I've not seen so worth a good search on Google to see if any petrol station you've used has been affected.
Bobupndown said:
What's with the 2 seperate fuel tests weeks apart?
Was the car with them the whole time, why did they get 2 tests? How have they produced 2 different results?
"Appears to be contaminated, possibly with diesel" does not sound too scientific or conclusive to me.
Absolutely - these questions the dealer has not answered.Was the car with them the whole time, why did they get 2 tests? How have they produced 2 different results?
"Appears to be contaminated, possibly with diesel" does not sound too scientific or conclusive to me.
520TORQUES said:
The fuel could be spiked whilst in the dealers. Alarm bells are going off about how they have handled this.
I have considered this point but they would be doing the work under Skoda UK warranty if it wasn't fuel contamination. It could be the fuel lab give the answer Skoda want to hear, that is another possibility. It is a sad sad story of utter incompetence at the dealer level.Panamax said:
That's not really relevant. Either,
(a) Your car broke down under warranty and the manufacturer/dealer need to fix it, or
(b) Your car was killed by fuel contamination and it's not their problem.
The point is that the dealer advised 'drive on' when clearly that was not good advice. The reason why they advised that is because, it appears, the dealer thought it was the known issue that caused these symptoms (and could be reset by re-starting the engine) and didn't consider it could be something completely different that would cause damage to the engine. Like calling the doctor with chest pain and they say 'have a massage' when in fact you are having a heart attack.(a) Your car broke down under warranty and the manufacturer/dealer need to fix it, or
(b) Your car was killed by fuel contamination and it's not their problem.
EUbrainwashing said:
520TORQUES said:
The fuel could be spiked whilst in the dealers. Alarm bells are going off about how they have handled this.
I have considered this point but they would be doing the work under Skoda UK warranty if it wasn't fuel contamination. It could be the fuel lab give the answer Skoda want to hear, that is another possibility. It is a sad sad story of utter incompetence at the dealer level.Sadly you cant trust people these days, so ask for proof of the warranty work being authorised by Skoda before they took your engine apart. There should be a warranty reference number with an audit trail of work authorised.
As you didn't give them authorisation to do outside of warranty work, it's on them to put it back to how it was as a minimum. IMHO the fuel issue is bulls
t.Caddyshack said:
Odd, you can inject water in to an engine to cool engine temps, if it hasn’t hydraulic locked I would be interested to know what damage has been done. Similar with diesel, if it hasn’t blocked injectors then I can’t see it harming a piston?
They are saying the contamination washed the lubrication from the bores - not enough volume of contaminant to cause hydraulic locking.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Insurance claim? From whom for what?
From the vehicle's insurance. The insurance co may not cover misfueling but that is not the case with this car. The dealership is just saying it was contaminated fuel. That is an accident not negligence so should be a viable insurance claim. We will see.Megaflow said:
^ What he said.
It is highly unlikely that bad fuel would physically damage a modern petrol engine, that have a lot of sensors and strategy to make sure they are emissions compliant. One of the big advantages to that is they are also very good a protecting themselves.
Lets roll with the dealers theory for a moment, that there is water in the fuel and that has somehow effected the combustion and ended up with a lean condition that has damaged cylinder 3. Why has it only damaged cylinder 3, the same fuel has been fed to all other cylinders.
I've got a pint on a bad injector leading to lean running and damage to cylinder 3.
Yes. This is looking like a sound theory. It is highly unlikely that bad fuel would physically damage a modern petrol engine, that have a lot of sensors and strategy to make sure they are emissions compliant. One of the big advantages to that is they are also very good a protecting themselves.
Lets roll with the dealers theory for a moment, that there is water in the fuel and that has somehow effected the combustion and ended up with a lean condition that has damaged cylinder 3. Why has it only damaged cylinder 3, the same fuel has been fed to all other cylinders.
I've got a pint on a bad injector leading to lean running and damage to cylinder 3.
Edited by Megaflow on Thursday 15th February 08:58
Would a failed PETROL injector cause such an issue?
Could contaminated fuel cause an injector to fail?
If so could a single injector fail?
kambites said:
A misfuel could certainly damage an injector which in turn could cause the engine to run very lean or I suppose very rich. However, as someone said above, as soon as the emissions parameters drifted out of whack, the dashboard would light up like a Christmas tree and you'd have to drive quite a long way with it like that to do any appreciable damage to any part of the short-block.
I see, thanks Tango13 said:
Another vote for a dodgy injector, some modern petrol engines use a 'redundant spark' system so the spark plug fires whenever the piston is at TDC regardless of where it is in the cycle. If the injector is leaking slightly then you'll be getting fuel burnt at the wrong time.
Bit late now but was the car using more fuel than normal prior to it playing up?
The car was running fine between the first 'kangarooing' incident then a few 100 miles and the second one when it was recovered (though still driving starting etc).Bit late now but was the car using more fuel than normal prior to it playing up?
EUbrainwashing said:
Megaflow said:
^ What he said.
It is highly unlikely that bad fuel would physically damage a modern petrol engine, that have a lot of sensors and strategy to make sure they are emissions compliant. One of the big advantages to that is they are also very good a protecting themselves.
Lets roll with the dealers theory for a moment, that there is water in the fuel and that has somehow effected the combustion and ended up with a lean condition that has damaged cylinder 3. Why has it only damaged cylinder 3, the same fuel has been fed to all other cylinders.
I've got a pint on a bad injector leading to lean running and damage to cylinder 3.
Yes. This is looking like a sound theory. It is highly unlikely that bad fuel would physically damage a modern petrol engine, that have a lot of sensors and strategy to make sure they are emissions compliant. One of the big advantages to that is they are also very good a protecting themselves.
Lets roll with the dealers theory for a moment, that there is water in the fuel and that has somehow effected the combustion and ended up with a lean condition that has damaged cylinder 3. Why has it only damaged cylinder 3, the same fuel has been fed to all other cylinders.
I've got a pint on a bad injector leading to lean running and damage to cylinder 3.
Edited by Megaflow on Thursday 15th February 08:58
Would a failed PETROL injector cause such an issue?
Could contaminated fuel cause an injector to fail?
If so could a single injector fail?
If the injector stops working completely, then no fuel/fluid is injected, so that cylinder just pumps air, on the over run, say off throttle going down hill or when on the brakes, the injectors are switched off completely, and so no fuel is pumped into the engine. It's perfectly normal and safe.
Where you can get issues is if the injector is blocked, or sticking, then you can have the ECU asking for 50mS worth of fuel, but you may only get 25mS injected, in that situation the cylinder will run lean, but in such a case the engine will usually create a knock event and the cylinder will be switched off completely. You would also notice a lean lambda signal, which again will cause the ECU to go into safe mode.
Did they give you any photos of the damage?
EUbrainwashing said:
FMOB said:
Suggest you find any receipts you have for the fuel purchases you made up to the date of the fault.
You also need a better understanding of the damage done to the engine and exactly what they have determined as the cause. The fuel testing seems to indicate possible water/diesel contamination, considering you can't fit a diesel pump nozzle into the tank of a petrol car it could down to the fuel station cocking it up.
We have considered this but there is no record or memory of where the last fill-ups took place. If it really is all as a result of contaminated fuel we hope the insurance company will pay-out.You also need a better understanding of the damage done to the engine and exactly what they have determined as the cause. The fuel testing seems to indicate possible water/diesel contamination, considering you can't fit a diesel pump nozzle into the tank of a petrol car it could down to the fuel station cocking it up.
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