What Engine for 500BHP
Discussion
Mikey G said:
Any chance of the name of the book please? 
Electronic Engine Tuningwriting engine maps for road and race car
by Cathal Greaney
it isnt the most in depth, but was very good at filling in some of the basic gaps in my knowledge and has helped me read and understand my map a lot better.
I wont however be able to start mapping my car based off the knowledge from the book, well I could, but I think Id be a little silly to try
turbonutter said:
Just for some comparison I looked in the default maps in the haltech software & dug out the one for a Subaru WRX.
That has the Fuel and ignition using MAP as load and both maps start at -100kpa.
That is bizarre - a negative kpa value? It doesn't exist, at least it didn't when I took physics. That has the Fuel and ignition using MAP as load and both maps start at -100kpa.
ampor said:
That is bizarre - a negative kpa value? It doesn't exist, at least it didn't when I took physics.
I think the reason they do it is aimed at dumb americans who cant comprehend.As I said, a lot of US based ecu's will use 0psi at atmospheric and down to -14.7psi as vacuum sites ! lol
I run a 6x6 pwr cooler with two pumps , one right at the front just before the pre rad and the other just before the inlet to the cooler . It's wired to run one pump at half speed under 30% throttle then full speed above that with the second pump coming in when running high boost . I have a dash guage for cc water temp and I've not seen coolant temp go over 40c on a really hot day .
Without the second pump running in high boost the water temp creeps upward but still below 50c .
I had similar issues with my engine coolant until I added a Davies Craig pump to the rad inlet with a controller .
Without the second pump running in high boost the water temp creeps upward but still below 50c .
I had similar issues with my engine coolant until I added a Davies Craig pump to the rad inlet with a controller .
mighty kitten said:
I run a 6x6 pwr cooler with two pumps , one right at the front just before the pre rad and the other just before the inlet to the cooler . It's wired to run one pump at half speed under 30% throttle then full speed above that with the second pump coming in when running high boost . I have a dash guage for cc water temp and I've not seen coolant temp go over 40c on a really hot day .
Without the second pump running in high boost the water temp creeps upward but still below 50c .
I had similar issues with my engine coolant until I added a Davies Craig pump to the rad inlet with a controller .
What about air intake temps? How much heat does it remove? Temps before and after the cooler?Without the second pump running in high boost the water temp creeps upward but still below 50c .
I had similar issues with my engine coolant until I added a Davies Craig pump to the rad inlet with a controller .
On a 32c ambient day I saw peak ait of 54c , and cc coolant temp of 48c measured just before the entry to the front rad .
Average around 20c above ambient running 1.6 bar 480hp from a 2.3 4 pot with a Holset hybrid very similar to a gt3071 .8 ar
I use a vw polo front rad which is very similar to the one pwr spec but a lot cheaper and is used in lots of kit cars as it has a very fine fin arrangement . From my experience you need to move the water pretty quick to take advantage of the air flow at the front .
Average around 20c above ambient running 1.6 bar 480hp from a 2.3 4 pot with a Holset hybrid very similar to a gt3071 .8 ar
I use a vw polo front rad which is very similar to the one pwr spec but a lot cheaper and is used in lots of kit cars as it has a very fine fin arrangement . From my experience you need to move the water pretty quick to take advantage of the air flow at the front .
Edited by mighty kitten on Wednesday 2nd October 13:08
In a closed loop charge cooling system, heat transfer performance is surprisingly unaffected by system water flow rate once it is above a basic level. This is because the ally->water and water-> ally heat transfer co-efficients are NOT the limiting factor in the system. Typically, increasing the flow rate above about ~15 l/min provides little extra performance, and all it does is reduce the system delta temperature.
I would imagine the op has a very similar layout to mine with pipes running down the centre of the car to go back and forth . I looked at running 25mm is pipework but already have a lot going on down the tunnel so stuck to the 19mm id to suit the pump fittings , no idea on flow rates but a single pump is not really up to the job especially if the cooler is mounted high up at the rear .
mighty kitten said:
On a 32c ambient day I saw peak ait of 54c , and cc coolant temp of 48c measured just before the entry to the front rad .
Average around 20c above ambient running 1.6 bar 480hp from a 2.3 4 pot with a Holset hybrid very similar to a gt3071 .8 ar
I use a vw polo front rad which is very similar to the one pwr spec but a lot cheaper and is used in lots of kit cars as it has a very fine fin arrangement . From my experience you need to move the water pretty quick to take advantage of the air flow at the front .
Thanks for the figures, not very often someone checks these things so comprehensively! What would you say turbo exit temps were, about 100'c?Average around 20c above ambient running 1.6 bar 480hp from a 2.3 4 pot with a Holset hybrid very similar to a gt3071 .8 ar
I use a vw polo front rad which is very similar to the one pwr spec but a lot cheaper and is used in lots of kit cars as it has a very fine fin arrangement . From my experience you need to move the water pretty quick to take advantage of the air flow at the front .
Edited by mighty kitten on Wednesday 2nd October 13:08
Its been a while since I have had access to the 'net', so just catching up on my various threads.
Charge cooling wise I run the 6x10 PWR cooler with a custom PWR pre-rad, made to match my main rad size. Pipes are 25mm all the way front to rear & run down the outside of the sills. Pump is a Davis craig EWP 115, so plenty of flow pump is at the bottom of the engine compartment fed by a 3L swirl pot.
I dont have any logs of temperatures, but i have air in and out sensors fitted + water temp. When its back on the road I will get some data, as I will be logging more numbers!
I can have a guess at in and out temps from my memory, but that would be pointless. all I know from one dyno plot is that the IAT was below 18C with a dyno cell temp of 15C from 2000rpm to full boost, which means the cooler works, what i dont know is how fast the water heated up. all I know there is that i never saw it move the 40-120C gauge it was connected to (Obviously I need a gauge with a lower range) IIRC the day the engine blew the Water temp was still below 40 with an ambient of 20-22C.
Charge cooling wise I run the 6x10 PWR cooler with a custom PWR pre-rad, made to match my main rad size. Pipes are 25mm all the way front to rear & run down the outside of the sills. Pump is a Davis craig EWP 115, so plenty of flow pump is at the bottom of the engine compartment fed by a 3L swirl pot.
I dont have any logs of temperatures, but i have air in and out sensors fitted + water temp. When its back on the road I will get some data, as I will be logging more numbers!
I can have a guess at in and out temps from my memory, but that would be pointless. all I know from one dyno plot is that the IAT was below 18C with a dyno cell temp of 15C from 2000rpm to full boost, which means the cooler works, what i dont know is how fast the water heated up. all I know there is that i never saw it move the 40-120C gauge it was connected to (Obviously I need a gauge with a lower range) IIRC the day the engine blew the Water temp was still below 40 with an ambient of 20-22C.
I will be monitoring everything i can.
Was also checking the Haltech's engine protection page, that I set up when I installed the ECU, but it had been turned off by someone....
Plenty of safety options if its active, even differential fuel pressure, if i connect my fuel pressure gauge to the ecu...
Was also checking the Haltech's engine protection page, that I set up when I installed the ECU, but it had been turned off by someone....
Plenty of safety options if its active, even differential fuel pressure, if i connect my fuel pressure gauge to the ecu...
Liquid Knight said:
Have you given any thought to the UK Power Tour?
I made an honest observation about PPC and they're not talking to me yet.
The Power tour would be great, but I doubt that the Engine will be rebuilt by then I made an honest observation about PPC and they're not talking to me yet.
I havent been in touch with PPC for a while - must remember not to mention your name!
turbonutter said:
I will be monitoring everything i can.
Was also checking the Haltech's engine protection page, that I set up when I installed the ECU, but it had been turned off by someone....
Plenty of safety options if its active, even differential fuel pressure, if i connect my fuel pressure gauge to the ecu...
That's nice.Was also checking the Haltech's engine protection page, that I set up when I installed the ECU, but it had been turned off by someone....
Plenty of safety options if its active, even differential fuel pressure, if i connect my fuel pressure gauge to the ecu...
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