Remap is done

[stevieturbo]

Yanayaya said:

He said that the engine was detecting knock and pulling timing yes.

This is not the same thing as there being detonation, hence I asked how was he determining whether there was this mysterious knock ?

I'd be rather concerned that an experienced tuner has been blindly relying on what he sees on a laptop screen...on a car he's never worked on before, with an ecu system he's not familiar with where there is something that appears to him as a random detonation problem....and at no point actually listens for detonation to confirm this.

Even more concerned if this genuinely is his daily job....of which it should include that very operation when tuning all cars.

I can understand things not going smoothly etc because of a lack of experience with a particular setup, that's fair enough. But that doesnt explain not performing basic check ups during tuning, even more so given he thinks there is a strange problem.

[Yanayaya]

MyM8V8 said:

Ok, so your tuner used your original tune a the baseline. Did you download and save a copy? This is really important if you need to get back there when things turn to st. If he did, you can load the new and the original maps into efilive and use the comparison feature to show all the modifications made cell by cell.

If you have knock, its probably the spark tables if he did only that and left the VE table alone. All these differences in those tables can be seen in a 3D rotatable graph.

If you have copies of both tunes (which you should), I'm sure Rich (and the other efi guys) would have a quick gander for you.

Ok I'll put that question too him and see what he says.

[Yanayaya]

wormus said:

The alternative would be to ask Ringram if he has a tune for your car. Assuming everything else is standard, we are talking about a new intake?

The modifications are listed in the OP mate

[anonymous-user]

Yanayaya said:

The modifications are listed in the OP mate

I meant modificaions that make a difference to airflow. Not sure how you tune for new plug leads.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 26th July 07:10

[Yanayaya]

wormus said:

I meant modificaions that make a difference to airflow. Not sure how you tune for new plug leads.

Edited by wormus on Tuesday 26th July 07:10

Ahh right got ya.

[MyM8V8]

wormus said:

Yanayaya said:

The modifications are listed in the OP mate

I meant modificaions that make a difference to airflow. Not sure how you tune for new plug leads.

Edited by wormus on Tuesday 26th July 07:10

LOL!

[MyM8V8]

stevieturbo said:

Yanayaya said:

He said that the engine was detecting knock and pulling timing yes.

This is not the same thing as there being detonation, hence I asked how was he determining whether there was this mysterious knock ?

I'd be rather concerned that an experienced tuner has been blindly relying on what he sees on a laptop screen...on a car he's never worked on before, with an ecu system he's not familiar with where there is something that appears to him as a random detonation problem....and at no point actually listens for detonation to confirm this.

Even more concerned if this genuinely is his daily job....of which it should include that very operation when tuning all cars.

I can understand things not going smoothly etc because of a lack of experience with a particular setup, that's fair enough. But that doesnt explain not performing basic check ups during tuning, even more so given he thinks there is a strange problem.

My comments were made assuming no mechanical knocks induced from catching exhausts or the like. But Stevies right, tuning is not all about using a computer. (In my younger days dialling in a Magneto dizzy and four barrel holley didn't need one either). You can actually hear detonation (pinking). Heard that loads of time before on my boys kart, just before it seized and chucked him off the track.

[SturdyHSV]

I just thought it was worth clarifying, detonation and knock are different things. (although having googled it, I am possibly completely wrong here!)

Detonation is pre-ignition, where the mixture goes bang before the spark plug fires. This generally means a LOT of force on the piston as it tends to still be on the compression stroke and there's a very big pressure spike. This tends to destroy things pretty quickly, you may get one detonation and it's toast, you may get a few, but it's very bad.

Knock is after the spark plug fires, the mixture goes bang in various areas outside of the flame front created by the spark plug (proper combustion the mixture doesn't explode, it burns in a controlled manner). This also causes sharp spikes in cylinder pressure, enough to make a pinging sound in the block, but generally is a lot less damaging than detonation. Motors can go for many miles with some knock without destroying themselves.

You're likely getting knock as opposed to detonation, else you'd probably have chunks of LS on the floor by now

Edited by SturdyHSV on Thursday 28th July 09:51

[stevieturbo]

MyM8V8 said:

My comments were made assuming no mechanical knocks induced from catching exhausts or the like. But Stevies right, tuning is not all about using a computer. (In my younger days dialling in a Magneto dizzy and four barrel holley didn't need one either). You can actually hear detonation (pinking). Heard that loads of time before on my boys kart, just before it seized and chucked him off the track.

I would never rely solely on listening from the car, you must use a stethoscope, det cans, whatever you want to call them, whether mechanical or electronic versions.

Used correctly you can hear even the minutest onset of any form of knock with no risk of damage.

[minime68]

Well, to be fair you don't have much done for power mods there. You shouldn't be seeing detonation though. Curious as to why you ditched the factory coils for MSD?

[TheLeatherman]

In Oz we never used the MSD coils as they failed quite quickly. Standard coil packs were easily good for well over 600 hp. No performance gains were ever noted either with MSD, just marketing hype I'm afraid.

388bhp = 280 kilowatts.......at the wheels......sounds quite high for those mods in truth. Does it still have the MAF??? All of this is very dyno dependent, and the acid test is terminal speed down the 1/4 mile in my experience.

Knock retard is definitely possible, in my experience, from high intake temps, although that is not looking to be the case here, although I'd like to know what your IAT was saying and what knock retard figures you saw, if any. You have the regular CAI as opposed to OTR style which make a genuine difference where the OTR is better.

AFR data is crucial really.....