Discussion
Just out of interest are there any other cars out there that lose 100bhp through drive train or more even? for example what about 4 wheel drives? It seems unbelievable to me that a Monaro loses that much but I know from Roger it's fact, is it purely the fact that a Monaro is rear wheel drive? Sorry for so many questions, love to know which cars lose the least and why
stu vxr said:
Just out of interest are there any other cars out there that lose 100bhp through drive train or more even? for example what about 4 wheel drives?
yup, My AWD car makes 385.9 at the wheels, which the dyno calculates back too 489.3 at the fly, so just over 100hp gone. This dyno is pretty damn accurate and I have know plenty 100% stock daily run of the mill cars to go on there and the flywheel guesstimate be bang on what the factory suggest.
Edited by fastbikes76 on Thursday 10th November 20:10
Its an interesting comparison thanks for posting. Assuming all things equal it looks like your bigger cam makes slightly more power all through the range than the smaller cam with the higher ratio rockers and that its fairly consistent through the revs.
Which leads me to another question, FI aside what could I do with my existing spec to get a better midrange? I've considered heads but i'm not sure that would do much specifically for the low/mid range. I'm open to ideas...
Which leads me to another question, FI aside what could I do with my existing spec to get a better midrange? I've considered heads but i'm not sure that would do much specifically for the low/mid range. I'm open to ideas...
I'd be careful about perceptions on what happens with mods to normally aspirated cars. There're loads of schools of thought and lots of clever people out there. My understanding was that tuning for torque pushes the top end horsepower down a bit AND that tuning for horsepower pushes the entire power band up the rev range. You shouldn't fixate on the biggest BHP number, as this is only part of the story.
At the end of the day, people get good results without more capacity or FI, but there's only do much that can be done. Personally, I'd go FI with forged internals...
At the end of the day, people get good results without more capacity or FI, but there's only do much that can be done. Personally, I'd go FI with forged internals...
The thing to remember is that although it all gets lumped together as "drivetrain" losses, the major loss is at the tyre/roller interface.
When you are putting 300+ horsepower down, the tyres distort as they are pressed into the rollers, and that's where a fair bit of the power goes.
Coastdown figures don't really reflect this, as there is a lot less torque going through the system.
When you are putting 300+ horsepower down, the tyres distort as they are pressed into the rollers, and that's where a fair bit of the power goes.
Coastdown figures don't really reflect this, as there is a lot less torque going through the system.
Z0m81e said:
I've considered heads but i'm not sure that would do much specifically for the low/mid range. I'm open to ideas...
Looking at your spec, you've got the flow in through the OTR and the FAST intake and you've got the flow out through the headers and you've got a cam, so heads would be the next logical step to make it all breath better and work with the induction. You've got more air passing in and then a cam with added duration and lift of valve openings and extra flow out so I would have thought that your heads would be the bottle neck at the moment as the flowed and ported heads are matched to the cam etc to let the induction/cam & headers work properly. Nobody will be able to give an exact bhp gain as each engine is different but the way I see it is, you've done three quarters of the job so you may as well finish it now. As for bhp/torque I understood it pretty much as ARNIEVXR has said it. If it was mine I'd get the heads done and then get it mapped for torque, as bhp is generally, but not exclusively, quick on a track where you rev it to within an inch of its life and torque is what you feel on the road. As someone has previously said about your dyno results, it's at the wheels where you feel it and that's what gets you down the roadEdited by Aitch 'H' on Friday 11th November 11:50
Any one who works in science, engineering or manufacturing will know how important quality and traceability are, conforming to international standards etc.
So piss poor excuse to say every rolling road is different - will the tuning industry ever tell you other than what you want to hear!
Testlas should be 0.1% consistent so could be used as an easily portable calibration standard.
If having spend lots of very precisely quantified hard cash then one should expect the results to be more quantified than just how it feels on the road. We've all heard the moans of people who thought they had a fast Monaro only to complain they could not keep up with a 535d etc.
Anyone serious about knowing what they've got need to do before and after comparisons of work packages. Environmental factors such as pressure and temperature can be corrected for.
So piss poor excuse to say every rolling road is different - will the tuning industry ever tell you other than what you want to hear!
Testlas should be 0.1% consistent so could be used as an easily portable calibration standard.
If having spend lots of very precisely quantified hard cash then one should expect the results to be more quantified than just how it feels on the road. We've all heard the moans of people who thought they had a fast Monaro only to complain they could not keep up with a 535d etc.
Anyone serious about knowing what they've got need to do before and after comparisons of work packages. Environmental factors such as pressure and temperature can be corrected for.
ArnieVXR said:
Yeah but aren't 535 diesels powered by infinity stones or warp drives or something unholy that makes your head spin round?
Yes, and they are exceptionally economical.https://youtu.be/J9Y-dmRGAkE
ArnieVXR said:
Interesting thoughts on dynos (see bottom of the page):
http://www.john-sleath.com/dyno.htm
Which is why I have never put mine on a dyno what is the point?http://www.john-sleath.com/dyno.htm
As said above I wouldn't care what figure I got pub talk.
It's real world driving that counts and boy would I love to murder a 535...
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