HSV forum members -The performance chart...
Discussion
Hi All,
So often on the forum, the question gets raised of what mods give what level of power on a dyno, and performance enhancement in the real world. I have taken actual figures achieved on our forum event days, and combined them into a comparative chart. This information has all been taken from posts already on the forum. I have purposely left off the number plate details for each car.
Obviously, the more events we have the more this table will become increasingly accurate and effective as a tool. But before the barrage of 'that's not what my car does!' comes in, I'll explain where this data has all come from...
1 - Dynos
It seems to be a general concensus that results to compare vehicles are best conducted on the same dyno, in the same gear, by the same operator, and preferably on the same day. Even then, the results are indicative of actual power, but most importantly give a decent comparison between cars.
Given we have now held 3 forum dyno days at Vixpys SRR dyno, it suggests have a reasonably good basis for comparison. I know there are always individual issues which mean the results aren't what we had hoped for or know the car can achieve (ie: state of tune/ fuelling/ belt slip/ air temperature/ etc). Because of this, I suggest that we add in an additional column or figures in brackets for what your car has achieved on another dyno or day (your thoughts please?) NB: For those that have attended more than 1 day, I assume the latest figure will have had the latest mods.
2 - 1/4 mile
Given we had such a great turnout for the last day Gareth organised at Shakeys (despite the rubbish weather), and already have 30+ cars for the 4th July, it won't take long to get an accurate picture of the achievable times for different models and mods. In the table I have used the results from the last day at Shakeys.
Although traction, air temperature, driver ability, and weather obviously affect results, it is arguably less variable and subjective than different dyno results are. A number of members have had previous runs down the strip at RWYB days and events such as PVS, so if you want to post them up here we should have a fairly good amount of data to start with.
3 - Class differentiation
This is to show the cars which have had superchargers fitted or are NA with internal work done, versus those with stock engine internals. Therefore by description it that means Air filter, remap, minor exhaust changes cars can fit into the stock class. These are achievable for under £500, without ever opening the engine, which brings them well in reach of mass market.
When you look at the table, It will be obvious that I am unsure of some of the modifications and details on your car, and I am also missing a few results from the second dyno day. The more accurate the details, the more use this is to everyone, so please post them (and any other info, or suggestions) up on the thread, and I will update the table on the original post.
Updated Table: 07/07/09 - following Shakeys Drag Day
Holden/ HSV/ Monaro:
Other LS Powered, and cars with no ET's available
So often on the forum, the question gets raised of what mods give what level of power on a dyno, and performance enhancement in the real world. I have taken actual figures achieved on our forum event days, and combined them into a comparative chart. This information has all been taken from posts already on the forum. I have purposely left off the number plate details for each car.
Obviously, the more events we have the more this table will become increasingly accurate and effective as a tool. But before the barrage of 'that's not what my car does!' comes in, I'll explain where this data has all come from...
1 - Dynos
It seems to be a general concensus that results to compare vehicles are best conducted on the same dyno, in the same gear, by the same operator, and preferably on the same day. Even then, the results are indicative of actual power, but most importantly give a decent comparison between cars.
Given we have now held 3 forum dyno days at Vixpys SRR dyno, it suggests have a reasonably good basis for comparison. I know there are always individual issues which mean the results aren't what we had hoped for or know the car can achieve (ie: state of tune/ fuelling/ belt slip/ air temperature/ etc). Because of this, I suggest that we add in an additional column or figures in brackets for what your car has achieved on another dyno or day (your thoughts please?) NB: For those that have attended more than 1 day, I assume the latest figure will have had the latest mods.
2 - 1/4 mile
Given we had such a great turnout for the last day Gareth organised at Shakeys (despite the rubbish weather), and already have 30+ cars for the 4th July, it won't take long to get an accurate picture of the achievable times for different models and mods. In the table I have used the results from the last day at Shakeys.
Although traction, air temperature, driver ability, and weather obviously affect results, it is arguably less variable and subjective than different dyno results are. A number of members have had previous runs down the strip at RWYB days and events such as PVS, so if you want to post them up here we should have a fairly good amount of data to start with.
3 - Class differentiation
This is to show the cars which have had superchargers fitted or are NA with internal work done, versus those with stock engine internals. Therefore by description it that means Air filter, remap, minor exhaust changes cars can fit into the stock class. These are achievable for under £500, without ever opening the engine, which brings them well in reach of mass market.
When you look at the table, It will be obvious that I am unsure of some of the modifications and details on your car, and I am also missing a few results from the second dyno day. The more accurate the details, the more use this is to everyone, so please post them (and any other info, or suggestions) up on the thread, and I will update the table on the original post.
Updated Table: 07/07/09 - following Shakeys Drag Day
Holden/ HSV/ Monaro:
Other LS Powered, and cars with no ET's available
Edited by kiwifraser on Tuesday 7th July 15:10
how come I'm not in the non=holden group?
Will be interesting to compare Sophies turbo setup to the NA of the s2000. Not sure how much power she is putting down now but my car is stock and manufacturer claims of 238/240bhp. I think my biggest concern is that to get things motoring really comes at 5500 rpm to the 9k shift, it fair old flies but will be interesting on the day as it will be down to my technique on the line. I also have had the notorious missed 3rd gear once or twice
Can't wait for the day
ETA bonnies isn't stock, its actually had a remap which was proven at the last dyno day. Always thought her car felt strong now we know why
Will be interesting to compare Sophies turbo setup to the NA of the s2000. Not sure how much power she is putting down now but my car is stock and manufacturer claims of 238/240bhp. I think my biggest concern is that to get things motoring really comes at 5500 rpm to the 9k shift, it fair old flies but will be interesting on the day as it will be down to my technique on the line. I also have had the notorious missed 3rd gear once or twice
Can't wait for the day
ETA bonnies isn't stock, its actually had a remap which was proven at the last dyno day. Always thought her car felt strong now we know why
Edited by toothrot on Tuesday 16th June 00:58
Hi mate, I got your email, Ive lost the old results because my website was wiped out when I changed ISP.
I think I have a copy on my old PC. Ill check again later.
Anyway, I think you need a massive column for the mods. Personally Id just put down trap speed for track day if you are looking a performance stuff, as the rest of the numbers are more dependant on driver and traction etc.
Mine was untuned at 453.x Same dyno now is over 500, but it wasnt a dyno day
Managed over 480rwtq too.
Also first dyno day 360.x rwhp stock LS2 with rollers and intake only.
I think I have a copy on my old PC. Ill check again later.
Anyway, I think you need a massive column for the mods. Personally Id just put down trap speed for track day if you are looking a performance stuff, as the rest of the numbers are more dependant on driver and traction etc.
Mine was untuned at 453.x Same dyno now is over 500, but it wasnt a dyno day
Managed over 480rwtq too.Also first dyno day 360.x rwhp stock LS2 with rollers and intake only.
MyM8V8 said:
Bonnie and Clyde said:
Hang on i have the slips that say i did a 14.7 at shakeys and my reaction time was wait for it 0.08
@ 100.1 mph Can you please change it
@ 100.1 mph Can you please change it 0.08 or .8? 0.08 ( eight hundredths) would be brilliant anticipation, or slipped off the clutch pedal in excitement.
Adrenaline seriously pumping. I'll find the slip and post it. 2 minsBonnie and Clyde said:
MyM8V8 said:
Bonnie and Clyde said:
Hang on i have the slips that say i did a 14.7 at shakeys and my reaction time was wait for it 0.08@ 100.1 mph Can you please change it
0.08 or .8? 0.08 ( eight hundredths) would be brilliant anticipation, or slipped off the clutch pedal in excitement. @ 100.1 mph Can you please change it Adrenaline seriously pumping. I'll find the slip and post it. 2 minsGot your voicemail, will soon have it on the PC to play for all
toothrot said:
Bonnie and Clyde said:
MyM8V8 said:
Bonnie and Clyde said:
Hang on i have the slips that say i did a 14.7 at shakeys and my reaction time was wait for it 0.08@ 100.1 mph Can you please change it
@ 100.1 mph Can you please change it 0.08 or .8? 0.08 ( eight hundredths) would be brilliant anticipation, or slipped off the clutch pedal in excitement.
Adrenaline seriously pumping. I'll find the slip and post it. 2 minsthis is a long 2 mins, you not able to find this mystical slip?
Got your voicemail, will soon have it on the PC to play for all
On here anyway and no i cant find the slip but you was with me so it should be on one of your slips. Unless of course you are using the paper to fill the holes in your sills before masking tape and hammer rite or was it only me that used to do that whilst trying to sell my mini
S600VXR said:
MyM8V8 said:
You can put me down for a 12.38@110 (.3693rt) at PVS then Mate. Might as well have some glory for a wee while at least!
Been away for a few days in Denmark... way to go Gareth! thats got to be seriously quick off the line since the terminals low.Magic919 said:
S600VXR said:
MyM8V8 said:
You can put me down for a 12.38@110 (.3693rt) at PVS then Mate. Might as well have some glory for a wee while at least!
Been away for a few days in Denmark... way to go Gareth! thats got to be seriously quick off the line since the terminals low.
I love the way this is a compliment and a put-down all in one.
S600VXR said:
MyM8V8 said:
You can put me down for a 12.38@110 (.3693rt) at PVS then Mate. Might as well have some glory for a wee while at least!
Been away for a few days in Denmark... way to go Gareth! thats got to be seriously quick off the line since the terminals low.Brummmie said:
I am NOT LSX37!!!
Here are my times
11.48 is best time and 129.43mph best terminal, whom ever LSX37 is, its not a bad time but not me!
Well if you weren't then, you are now! We'll have to find out on the 4th.Here are my times
11.48 is best time and 129.43mph best terminal, whom ever LSX37 is, its not a bad time but not me!
Sorry about the apparent cock up, don't know whats's happened there.
ETA BTW Brilliant times mate. I'll be looking to do that in future with my heavy old ute!!!
Edited by MyM8V8 on Thursday 18th June 19:33
Hmm, I recon a faster 60 means more traction, duh. Therefore your wheel rotation is slower than the madman who does a slow 60' but ends up grabbing third gear before the car hooks up at a higher speed..?
Stevie will know Im sure!
Gareth Im sure your trap will go up with a 427. Stock LS7's trap 120+ mph! IIRC
Stevie will know Im sure!
Gareth Im sure your trap will go up with a 427. Stock LS7's trap 120+ mph! IIRC
It is complicated.
But generally if you're gripping better, you're covering that ground at a greater rate. So as the 1/4 is a fixed distance, and you get there faster.....your terminal will be lower.
Although strangely, with a bit of wheelspin, covering the ground slower....your elapsed speed can be higher.
Although if it was being measured over a fixed time, instead of distance, then trap speeds might be the same at say 15 seconds, as opposed to 1/4 mile regardless of traction.
Does seem arse about face in many ways.
As a close general rule...lose 0.1s of your 60ft, and it'll drop 0.2s of your ET. But you really need good tyres...normal hard road rubber, really doesnt cut it for a 2wd car, unless you are auto with an excellent setup. ( Ive seen big heavy Merc's 60ft 1.8x before !!! )
Generally speaking....elapsed speeds stay fairly consistent for any power level though, unless you make a total arse of the run with dodgy gearchanges.
But generally if you're gripping better, you're covering that ground at a greater rate. So as the 1/4 is a fixed distance, and you get there faster.....your terminal will be lower.
Although strangely, with a bit of wheelspin, covering the ground slower....your elapsed speed can be higher.
Although if it was being measured over a fixed time, instead of distance, then trap speeds might be the same at say 15 seconds, as opposed to 1/4 mile regardless of traction.
Does seem arse about face in many ways.
As a close general rule...lose 0.1s of your 60ft, and it'll drop 0.2s of your ET. But you really need good tyres...normal hard road rubber, really doesnt cut it for a 2wd car, unless you are auto with an excellent setup. ( Ive seen big heavy Merc's 60ft 1.8x before !!! )
Generally speaking....elapsed speeds stay fairly consistent for any power level though, unless you make a total arse of the run with dodgy gearchanges.
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