Tam very 'crashy' after Nitrons fitted!

[nrick]

Chris I am also in CInderford (well Littledean) with a Tuscan if you need anything. Haven't seen you around?

[chris watton]

nrick said:

Chris I am also in CInderford (well Littledean) with a Tuscan if you need anything. Haven't seen you around?

Hi Neill!

I haven't seen (or heard) you, too!

We almost bought a house in Littledean (Dean Crescent), but decided against it due to the steep incline of the drive to the garage (was thinking ahead for when I buy another Tam..)

The house we bought is still in a dilapidated state due to spending everything on the car - need to correct that the second half of this year, the Tam will have to wait 'till next year for more upgrades..



Cheers

Edited by chris watton on Thursday 19th June 22:12

[anonymous-user]

Chris,
When talking about spring rates contributing to ride quality, rose joints came to mind. My race car has top and bottom rose joints, if the road car shocks are the same, it's another introduction of loss of "road ride quality"

John

[chris watton]

TVRMs said:

Chris,
When talking about spring rates contributing to ride quality, rose joints came to mind. My race car has top and bottom rose joints, if the road car shocks are the same, it's another introduction of loss of "road ride quality"

John

I think they do have rose joints!

[spitfire4v8]

TVRMs said:

Chris,
When talking about spring rates contributing to ride quality, rose joints came to mind. My race car has top and bottom rose joints, if the road car shocks are the same, it's another introduction of loss of "road ride quality"

John

im surprised no ones mentioned that sooner..
Oh hang on ..

[anonymous-user]

spitfire4v8 said:

TVRMs said:

Chris,
When talking about spring rates contributing to ride quality, rose joints came to mind. My race car has top and bottom rose joints, if the road car shocks are the same, it's another introduction of loss of "road ride quality"

John

im surprised no ones mentioned that sooner..
Oh hang on ..

Apologies if I requoted Jules.

[chris watton]

So, it's a good chance it is the rose joints (both top and bottom) that are part of the problem?

I did note that the joints looked that same as on those Ohlin's Ed China fitted to that Lotus Elise....

Edited by chris watton on Friday 20th June 13:29

[Ab Shocks]

I don't subscribe to the spherical bearings theory because all the suspension companies have been using them for ages and anyway the rest of the wishbone bushes are metalastic.
I just think the output of the 46mm shocks has been increased and that's the problem, getum revalved is the answer.

[chris watton]

Ab Shocks said:

I don't subscribe to the spherical bearings theory because all the suspension companies have been using them for ages and anyway the rest of the wishbone bushes are metalastic.
I just think the output of the 46mm shocks has been increased and that's the problem, getum revalved is the answer.

What does 're-valving' entail - does it mean they have to be removed again to do this?

[slimtater]

chris watton said:

So, it's a good chance it is the rose joints (both top and bottom) that are part of the problem?

I did note that the joints looked that same as on those Ohlin's Ed China fitted to that Lotus Elise....

Edited by chris watton on Friday 20th June 13:29

My Ohlin's have rose joints and the ride isn't as Chris describes.

A quote from a previous (Porker owning) passenger "God the grip, handling and ride on this thing is amazing!"

[chris watton]

slimtater said:

A quote from a previous (Porker owning) passenger "God the grip, handling and ride on this thing is amazing!"

Funny you should write that - that is exactly what I expected to feel like after having the Nitrons fitted!

[phazed]

I did about 500 miles over the last 2 days including taking part in a sprint.

The sprint performance was great, no complaints but those road miles with the damping dialled down was crashy to say the least.

long term, I will send them back to be revalved as it totally spoils the car.

[QBee]

Ab Shocks said:

............... the spherical bearings theory....................

So THAT'S the posh name for what gets talked at barbecues and on the PH forums.
I knew there must be a proper title for it

[Basil Brush]

The Vreds are good tyres, regardless of the cost saving. I've run them on my Tuscan for a few years.

Am I reading this right Chris, that you don't yet know how many clicks the dampers are set at yet? I've also run Nitrons with the same spring rates you have on my Tuscan for about 9 years (they've been rebuilt a couple of times), including about 5 using it as a daily driver. Mine are capable of being set to too soft if fully wound out.

[MrChips]

Sorry if I missed it but where did you buy them from and were the "off the shelf" or ordered/built based on a brief?

I only ask as I bought some Nitrons for the Tuscan last year and it was only after speaking to them directly that I realised that they supply 2 different valving setups. One for road, and one for fast road/track.
I read reports of owners only being happy with the ride when the damping was set 2-3 clicks from soft, and this was with the standard 400fr and 350rear spring rates.

When I spoke to Nitron they comfirmed that some retailers just order the fast road ones, some order the normal road ones, whilst others were more proactive and ordered a mix, or just did build to order.

I ended up with the normal road valving, and with 375 front and 325 rear spring rates. After a bit of fettling, a slight increase to the tyre pressures to 26psi, and the damping set 12 clicks from soft, they now ride really well, and are pretty equal to the factory bilsteins.

Might be worth tracing back to the supplier/order and check what valving you have?

[K4TRV]

MrChips said:

Sorry if I missed it but where did you buy them from and were the "off the shelf" or ordered/built based on a brief?

I only ask as I bought some Nitrons for the Tuscan last year and it was only after speaking to them directly that I realised that they supply 2 different valving setups. One for road, and one for fast road/track.
I read reports of owners only being happy with the ride when the damping was set 2-3 clicks from soft, and this was with the standard 400fr and 350rear spring rates.

When I spoke to Nitron they comfirmed that some retailers just order the fast road ones, some order the normal road ones, whilst others were more proactive and ordered a mix, or just did build to order.

I ended up with the normal road valving, and with 375 front and 325 rear spring rates. After a bit of fettling, a slight increase to the tyre pressures to 26psi, and the damping set 12 clicks from soft, they now ride really well, and are pretty equal to the factory bilsteins.

Might be worth tracing back to the supplier/order and check what valving you have?

^^ +1^^ I ordered for track and 500/450 - rides the way I want.......not a high days and holidays ride TBH

Trev

[WinstonWolf]

ShiDevil said:

TVRMs said:

Steve, car set up is a very personal thing, CofG work for you, it does not make them a best fit for all set up options.

Fact is, man has issues with ride that is too firm, his spring rates have gone up significantly.

£600 later, that will still be the case.

I dispute the tyre pressure thing, but I've probably spent more time quantifying my statement than the specialists you name.

As an aside, I don't recall TVR issuing any notice on pressures and I owned several new T cars from 2003 to 2006 all supplied and serviced by probably the dealer closest to the factory?

Edited by TVRMs on Tuesday 17th June 22:10

Hi, I agree on your comments regarding the setup, it is indeed personal and some may find CG as overkill. The circumstances dictated they were worth exploring, given new shocks and close friends recommendations (Noble Track Owners and TVR Road Owners). In terms of pressures, I can only go by what i've been told. TrackVRoad were the ones who mentioned the advisory (as they did about dealers lowering ride heights to make the cars look better), when I visited them after being advised by CG that a higher pressure was needed than 24. This was based on checking my tyre temps, which were not consistent across the tyre and the nature of the wear. It may have been many chose to ignore the information as there didn't seem to be any issues, or it could be another one of those, hard to qualify TVR rumours :P

One thing I did struggle with was spring rates and knowing what to go for on my Protechs. I went with 400 and 350, which works well for my car, for fast road. I would be interested to hear what different spring rates people have. Thanks for your comments, it's good to get a different perspective.

Go to Centre Gravity, your car will be exactly as you want it after Chris has worked his magic. Best money I've spent on the Griff by a country mile...

[Ab Shocks]

chris watton said:

What does 're-valving' entail - does it mean they have to be removed again to do this?

I'm afraid they have to go back and be stripped down, this is the problem with monotubes in that the bump adjustment on the control knob is minimal so the shim stack (which is internal) has to be rebuilt.
I'm not knocking monotubes btw because for fast response on potholes and racetrack kerbs they are unbeatable and I would always use them but just be careful what I specified on bump/rebound.

[SergSC]

Ab Shocks said:

chris watton said:

What does 're-valving' entail - does it mean they have to be removed again to do this?

I'm afraid they have to go back and be stripped down, this is the problem with monotubes in that the bump adjustment on the control knob is minimal so the shim stack (which is internal) has to be rebuilt.
I'm not knocking monotubes btw because for fast response on potholes and racetrack kerbs they are unbeatable and I would always use them but just be careful what I specified on bump/rebound.

I guess this is the way to go... put the old back on and send it off for revalving. How long and much £££ is this going to be?
Was not aware there was an option of road vs road/track, when ordering I asked if they were reasonable over rough roads, yes was the answer, that they were adjustable for both. The option was not presented.

[phazed]

Derek is correct.

if they are new make a big fuss, call them direct.

I've given them plenty of grief over this.

they only seem to react when you shout.

Ask for James.