Discussion
ClockworkCupcake said:
TVRMs said:
Some may even argue that engines modified and under greater stresses are more susceptible to a shorter time ticking and prone to louder bangs...
Whilst others would suggest that running an ECU with fully 3D mapped sequential ignition, knock sensors, and a head that has improved oil and coolant pathways, is far better than a factory ECU that treats a straight 6 as two banks of 3 and wastes 2/3 of the fuel it blindly throws into the cylinders, one of which is notorious for leaning out and causing detonation (which a lack of knock sensors means it won't protect against either). Each to their own, I guess.
Wow, those original S6s must be some design to do what they do so inefficiently...waste 2/3s of the fuel you say.
I need to run off and do the lottery, I hadn't realised I'd been so lucky with my engines
TVRMs said:
Wow, those original S6s must be some design to do what they do so inefficiently...waste 2/3s of the fuel you say.
The standard ECU fires pulses of fuel into the cylinders at incorrect times which are just flushed straight through - that's why the catalytic converters in S6 engines degrade so quickly. The reason being that it's a bit of a kludge that assumes the S6 is a V8 with two cylinders lopped off, which it plainly isn't. That's how it was explained to me by Racing Green anyway, and I have no reason to disbelieve them. An ECU like Syvecs uses fully mapped sequential ignition to put fuel in when it's actually needed, and also has knock sensors to detect when #6 is leaning out and prevent detonation. It was exactly that scenario that caused my original S6 engine to detonate and lunch itself.
Please feel free to research this yourself, rather than simply making disparaging remarks.
DJR 7 said:
Tony
What were your thoughts on the Sagaris, you've clearly had a lot of experience with high performance cars, it would be interesting to know how it compared.
D
Difficult to explain how the Sag differs from other cars i have owned and own,one thing that does springs to mind that its not one for the fait hearted What were your thoughts on the Sagaris, you've clearly had a lot of experience with high performance cars, it would be interesting to know how it compared.
D
TVRMs said:
Wow, those original S6s must be some design to do what they do so inefficiently...waste 2/3s of the fuel you say.
Most engines cut the injectors on overrun, AJP8 and SpeedSix do not, hence the familiar head turning soundtrack associated with the valve overlap (which itself also contributes to the appalling fuel consumption). I wouldn't change mine, and it's likely to be one of the last engines made to get away with that!ukkid35 said:
TVRMs said:
Wow, those original S6s must be some design to do what they do so inefficiently...waste 2/3s of the fuel you say.
Most engines cut the injectors on overrun, AJP8 and SpeedSix do not, hence the familiar head turning soundtrack associated with the valve overlap (which itself also contributes to the appalling fuel consumption). I wouldn't change mine, and it's likely to be one of the last engines made to get away with that!Targarama said:
I can never understand comments about appalling fuel consumption. Fuel may be wasted, but you get better MPG from a TVR than many sporty BMWs, Mercedes and Audis.
I dunno about that, the MPG in my Sag is pretty appalling, much worse than an RS4, M3 etc. Can't say it bothers me though, I didn't buy it to be frugal!Rocco1 said:
I bought this car back in Octber 2015 it was advertised for £72k
Six months on and the same cars on PH's have have had an increase of £5k
As for the mileage it has only done approx 4000 miles since a rebuild
I could have bought a cheaper car yet didnt want the worry of catastrophic engine failure
Rocco, all the other cars went up 5 grand, BUT have you noticed that none of them have sold, some have been for sale for 9 months now.Six months on and the same cars on PH's have have had an increase of £5k
As for the mileage it has only done approx 4000 miles since a rebuild
I could have bought a cheaper car yet didnt want the worry of catastrophic engine failure
To get fantastic money for a Saggy, it has to be a Fantastic car. (not saying yours is not)
Edited by TVR4US on Thursday 17th March 17:55
TVR4US said:
Rocco, the all other cars went up 5 grand, BUT have you noticed that none of them have sold, some have been for sale for 9 months now.
To get fantastic money for a Saggy, it has to be a Fantastic car. (not saying yours is not)
My car was up at £72k it didnt stop me from buying when there were others far cheaper To get fantastic money for a Saggy, it has to be a Fantastic car. (not saying yours is not)
In the past few weeks cars have been advertised for around £70k and have sold
My car is also well known and has no hidden history,the previous owner took real good care of it and wasn't afraid of spending money on it
If it sells it sells if not then no harm done :-)
ClockworkCupcake said:
TVRMs said:
Wow, those original S6s must be some design to do what they do so inefficiently...waste 2/3s of the fuel you say.
The standard ECU fires pulses of fuel into the cylinders at incorrect times which are just flushed straight through - that's why the catalytic converters in S6 engines degrade so quickly. The reason being that it's a bit of a kludge that assumes the S6 is a V8 with two cylinders lopped off, which it plainly isn't. That's how it was explained to me by Racing Green anyway, and I have no reason to disbelieve them. An ECU like Syvecs uses fully mapped sequential ignition to put fuel in when it's actually needed, and also has knock sensors to detect when #6 is leaning out and prevent detonation. It was exactly that scenario that caused my original S6 engine to detonate and lunch itself.
Please feel free to research this yourself, rather than simply making disparaging remarks.
Sadly you are fit a classic PH profile. Original engine going bump, that seems to want to change everything to correct something that is not a huge problem. Or am I really just lucky? I doubt it.
RG - are they the folk with the FFF head that has problems with valve seat recession?
TVRMs said:
Sadly you fit a classic PH profile.
You too fit a classic profile, but politeness prevents me from elaborating. 
TVRMs said:
RG - are they the folk with the FFF head that has problems with valve seat recession?
You clearly have an axe to grind and/or points to score, so I'll leave you to your opinions. I don't have an axe to grind and I guess the points I was trying to make could been made better.
I'm one of those that's had no issues with the S6 (a lesser known PH profile one may argue) and when folk explain how flawed or crude the engine is it does wind me up a little, especially when not is all it seems with the mods gurus.
Apologies if I increased blood pressure, not the intent Jon
I'm one of those that's had no issues with the S6 (a lesser known PH profile one may argue) and when folk explain how flawed or crude the engine is it does wind me up a little, especially when not is all it seems with the mods gurus.
Apologies if I increased blood pressure, not the intent Jon
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 17th March 18:55
TVRMs said:
I don't have an axe to grind and I guess the points I was trying to make could been made better.
I'm one of those that's had no issues with the S6 (a lesser known PH profile one may argue) and when folk explain how flawed or crude the engine is it does wind me up a little, especially when not is all it seems with the mods gurus.
Apologies if I increased blood pressure, not the intent Jon
Ok, fair enough. Perhaps we misinterpreted each other then. I'm one of those that's had no issues with the S6 (a lesser known PH profile one may argue) and when folk explain how flawed or crude the engine is it does wind me up a little, especially when not is all it seems with the mods gurus.
Apologies if I increased blood pressure, not the intent Jon
My background is in engineering, science and software development, and I've also been quite into modifying cars for many years, so in all that I am of the mindset that there is always room for improvement, and there is nothing wrong in evolving and improving.
The S6 engine is a superb design, but there are some inherent weaknesses that are now well understood, not least the tendency of #6 to lean out. When my original spec engine lunched itself, it was natural for me to research what improvements had been made to the design in the intervening time. Knock sensors seemed like a very desirable thing to have, since that would have prevented the detonation on #6 that caused the engine failure, and at the time Syvecs was the only company who had cracked the issue. Others have followed suit since. Having worked closely with Syvecs as a software development partner, I have a lot of time for the guys there and they really know their stuff.
Anyway, we have a difference of opinion, obviously, and text is a medium whereby it is easy to misinterpret and take offence where none was necessarily intended.
Rocco1 said:
When i was looking for a Sag i was told all sorts about thr engine being a ticking time bomb,so I decided to go for one that had been well looked after and had an engine rebuild,not only a rebuild but a 4.3 conversion
Ive never owned a tvr before and wanted to experience what it was like own one,after 5/6 months of ownership its time to try something different
thank you
Sorry didnt mean to sound like I was getting at you. Just after years and years of the myth going around that their ticking time bombs people believe the myth in its just this self defeating circle. Yes the S6 had issues - its eloquently explained by John Ravenscroft in Ralph Dodds new book. Its a shame because it scares people off experiencing these fabulous unique cars. Ive never owned a tvr before and wanted to experience what it was like own one,after 5/6 months of ownership its time to try something different
thank you
Still we're not the only ones - my mate still crosses his fingers when starting his M5 praying the 'cog of death' doesn't appear. And another mate is convinced his 996's intermediate shaft will cause the car the self combust at any minute!
Good luck with the sale Rocco. And FairPlay for buying the most expensive one on the market at the time! And like you said if it does not sell, it's not the end of the world.. It's not a bad toy to have in the garage and clearly growing in value....Im sure there a many people who would like to be in your position..
Ropps said:
Good luck with the sale Rocco. And FairPlay for buying the most expensive one on the market at the time! And like you said if it does not sell, it's not the end of the world.. It's not a bad toy to have in the garage and clearly growing in value....Im sure there a many people who would like to be in your position..
Thanks Sandro,truth is i bought the Sag out of boredom,a friend of mine was looking at buying a tamora and i found one for him.Somehow how i got caught in all the excitement and i bought the Sag.Wonderful cars but not for me yet a good investment
Drop it into 2nd and just let it sing to 7000rpm, pop, crackle on the upshift and give it another gear. Brilliant cars. No more worries than any other performance car. Not much stirs the soul like a good TVR. Thats why they are still around. Just plain simple good fun. You will miss it when its gone rocco. 70k will be nice in bank but you will struggle to find anything as fun and rare.
crimbo said:
Drop it into 2nd and just let it sing to 7000rpm, pop, crackle on the upshift and give it another gear. Brilliant cars. No more worries than any other performance car. Not much stirs the soul like a good TVR. Thats why they are still around. Just plain simple good fun. You will miss it when its gone rocco. 70k will be nice in bank but you will struggle to find anything as fun and rare.
Its £72k lol By the way my money never sits in the bank in sits in my cars,life is too short ;-)
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