DB9 engine ticking noise - help please
Discussion
I too have a KX car, first few stamps in the book are by AM Prototype Division and then AM Fleet Operations. After a bit of digging around I was informed that it was probably a "mileage car", driven around the country a lot to see if anything failed, fell off etc, this is testified by the 35k miles in the first 12 months!!
However, this didn't put me off, as during this period it will have been scrutineered and serviced religiously. And I think having a prototype division stamp in the book is pretty cool.
It's now on 57k and it's had no issues other than the usual "they all do that sir" stuff.
However, this didn't put me off, as during this period it will have been scrutineered and serviced religiously. And I think having a prototype division stamp in the book is pretty cool.
It's now on 57k and it's had no issues other than the usual "they all do that sir" stuff.
roughrider said:
Ascari. I don't think you can really "thrash" an Aston Martin, as they are over engineered to cope with said thrashing! The V8 is very closely related to its GT4 race car version.
Re the usage comment and car taking whatever in its stride, you are mainly correct for components like engine (OP's nightmare aside) and gearbox, but what you overlook is that all consumables will inevitably need renewing earlier than what is normal from non track'd non ex factory cars - evidenced by the few sets of CCM brakes i know a number of KX cars have had well earlier than the average cars without a 'history' consume those same parts - and that is an issue if not taken into account in purchase price.Edited by roughrider on Monday 8th February 16:32
With the odd exception where the owner likes the fact the car was an ex factory (press or engineering use), what most prospective buyers want to know upfront of purchase is any past history which if surfaced might restrict their market when they come to sell the car (ex hire car, track day company car or ex factory car) - and for most the history as famous as this green car has will do just that.
roughrider said:
Ascari. I don't think you can really "thrash" an Aston Martin, as they are over engineered to cope with said thrashing! The V8 is very closely related to its GT4 race car version.
Yep AscariI can't agree with you on the thrashing
My V8VS ate a gearbox and rear wheel bearings within 9 months of me collecting it from new (for clarity all before BR went any where near the engine)
mikey k said:
Yep Ascari
I can't agree with you on the thrashing
My V8VS ate a gearbox and rear wheel bearings within 9 months of me collecting it from new (for clarity all before BR went any where near the engine)
Yes, i saw your thread. Graziano [as far as i'm aware], are industry leaders, and build gearboxes for race cars. I guess every product in the world will have a manufacturing glitch occasionally,,,its just a bugger when its your own...I can't agree with you on the thrashing
My V8VS ate a gearbox and rear wheel bearings within 9 months of me collecting it from new (for clarity all before BR went any where near the engine)
roughrider said:
mikey k said:
Yep Ascari
I can't agree with you on the thrashing
My V8VS ate a gearbox and rear wheel bearings within 9 months of me collecting it from new (for clarity all before BR went any where near the engine)
Yes, i saw your thread. Graziano [as far as i'm aware], are industry leaders, and build gearboxes for race cars. I guess every product in the world will have a manufacturing glitch occasionally,,,its just a bugger when its your own...I can't agree with you on the thrashing
My V8VS ate a gearbox and rear wheel bearings within 9 months of me collecting it from new (for clarity all before BR went any where near the engine)
I wouldn't consider them industry leaders, they supply boxes (with issues) to Ferrari and McLaren
Bringing back this tread as I too am having a similar issue. I've included a video where the sound can be heard.Mine is a 2005 DB9 and has the updated dipstick but i'm not sure when that update occurred and if it was ever run low on oil. Unfortunately, it didn't tick during test drive and I neglected to have a PPI done.
Mine also only ticks when it reaches and stays at operating temperature for a bit. I remember MaverickV12 saying that he changed his thermostat to the Vanquish one which results in the engine running cooler. Has anyone else tried this? I'm wondering if a cooler running engine will help since it seems the tick only occurs when the car is hot. This will be a weekend car and I'm wondering how long I should/can keep on driving it before having the engine stripped as it seems that's the only resolution if it's indeed a small end bearing issue. It seems that folks with the tick have lived with it for years.
https://youtu.be/9oB7lOO8KOM
Mine also only ticks when it reaches and stays at operating temperature for a bit. I remember MaverickV12 saying that he changed his thermostat to the Vanquish one which results in the engine running cooler. Has anyone else tried this? I'm wondering if a cooler running engine will help since it seems the tick only occurs when the car is hot. This will be a weekend car and I'm wondering how long I should/can keep on driving it before having the engine stripped as it seems that's the only resolution if it's indeed a small end bearing issue. It seems that folks with the tick have lived with it for years.
https://youtu.be/9oB7lOO8KOM
Ryanr317 said:
Bringing back this tread as I too am having a similar issue. I've included a video where the sound can be heard.Mine is a 2005 DB9 and has the updated dipstick but i'm not sure when that update occurred and if it was ever run low on oil. Unfortunately, it didn't tick during test drive and I neglected to have a PPI done.
Mine also only ticks when it reaches and stays at operating temperature for a bit. I remember MaverickV12 saying that he changed his thermostat to the Vanquish one which results in the engine running cooler. Has anyone else tried this? I'm wondering if a cooler running engine will help since it seems the tick only occurs when the car is hot. This will be a weekend car and I'm wondering how long I should/can keep on driving it before having the engine stripped as it seems that's the only resolution if it's indeed a small end bearing issue. It seems that folks with the tick have lived with it for years.
https://youtu.be/9oB7lOO8KOM
My car has the same issue and like you, I didn't notice it until after the deal was done. Yours sounds a little more pronounced than mine in the video, but mine also sounds worse on video than in person. Your symptoms do seem to align with the mysterious and infuriating early V12 tick. How many miles has your car done? Mine ticked from at least 16k and probably earlier, but most seem to go farther than that before it shows up. Mine also only ticks when it reaches and stays at operating temperature for a bit. I remember MaverickV12 saying that he changed his thermostat to the Vanquish one which results in the engine running cooler. Has anyone else tried this? I'm wondering if a cooler running engine will help since it seems the tick only occurs when the car is hot. This will be a weekend car and I'm wondering how long I should/can keep on driving it before having the engine stripped as it seems that's the only resolution if it's indeed a small end bearing issue. It seems that folks with the tick have lived with it for years.
https://youtu.be/9oB7lOO8KOM
After a lot of research, I found that there still isn't 100% agreement on the cause, but it seems to be either small end bearings, piston slap, or a combination. The small end bearings were redesigned with an oiling groove in later engines, which seems to have solved the problem.
Changing to the Vanquish thermostat wouldn't hurt, but it's unlikely to solve the tick. I chatted with Maverick at some length about the issue, and he tried virtually every form of alternative medicine: revised cooling, different oil, tappets, even replacing bearings from underneath, all to no avail. He saved me some time and money there, because those are all things I would have tried. In the end the only cure is a rebuild or replacement. As you've found however, it doesn't seem to reduce the service life of the engine. If you can tolerate the noise, you might as well keep driving it.
For me, this issue is a real catch-22. The tick keeps me from enjoying the car like it is, but I can't stomach the cost of a rebuild, or the loss I would take if I sold it.
PrAston said:
My car has the same issue and like you, I didn't notice it until after the deal was done. Yours sounds a little more pronounced than mine in the video, but mine also sounds worse on video than in person. Your symptoms do seem to align with the mysterious and infuriating early V12 tick. How many miles has your car done? Mine ticked from at least 16k and probably earlier, but most seem to go farther than that before it shows up.
After a lot of research, I found that there still isn't 100% agreement on the cause, but it seems to be either small end bearings, piston slap, or a combination. The small end bearings were redesigned with an oiling groove in later engines, which seems to have solved the problem.
Changing to the Vanquish thermostat wouldn't hurt, but it's unlikely to solve the tick. I chatted with Maverick at some length about the issue, and he tried virtually every form of alternative medicine: revised cooling, different oil, tappets, even replacing bearings from underneath, all to no avail. He saved me some time and money there, because those are all things I would have tried. In the end the only cure is a rebuild or replacement. As you've found however, it doesn't seem to reduce the service life of the engine. If you can tolerate the noise, you might as well keep driving it.
For me, this issue is a real catch-22. The tick keeps me from enjoying the car like it is, but I can't stomach the cost of a rebuild, or the loss I would take if I sold it.
Mine has 39,900 as of now. I ordered the Vanquish thermostat but I agree that it likely won't solve the root issue. I'm fine with continuing to drive it but I can't imagine that what's causing the noise isn't somehow causing premature wear on the engine. I.e. piston sleeve ovalization. How many miles have you put on yours since you first noticed the tick and has it gotten worse? Mine is also quieter in person vs. on video.After a lot of research, I found that there still isn't 100% agreement on the cause, but it seems to be either small end bearings, piston slap, or a combination. The small end bearings were redesigned with an oiling groove in later engines, which seems to have solved the problem.
Changing to the Vanquish thermostat wouldn't hurt, but it's unlikely to solve the tick. I chatted with Maverick at some length about the issue, and he tried virtually every form of alternative medicine: revised cooling, different oil, tappets, even replacing bearings from underneath, all to no avail. He saved me some time and money there, because those are all things I would have tried. In the end the only cure is a rebuild or replacement. As you've found however, it doesn't seem to reduce the service life of the engine. If you can tolerate the noise, you might as well keep driving it.
For me, this issue is a real catch-22. The tick keeps me from enjoying the car like it is, but I can't stomach the cost of a rebuild, or the loss I would take if I sold it.
I feel the same way. If something is loose enough to bang around and make noise, then there should be additional wear somewhere. However, I sent some oil off for analysis and they found absolutely nothing out of the ordinary - no elevated metal levels, nothing. Even if there is additional wear, it's probably on parts you'd replace in a rebuild anyway. The fix will probably be the same in 10 years as it is now.
I've put about 3000-3500 miles on the car since I got it, which isn't a lot, but I'm pretty afraid to drive it because in spite of what I've read I have a hard time accepting that the ticking is just a benign annoyance and not a sign of imminent catastrophic failure. I seem to recall reading about an owner who put tens of thousands of miles on his ticking DB7V, though. I wouldn't say mine has gotten worse over time, but it's never been 100% consistent. The ticking seems to vary in intensity from day to day.
Thing is if you tell the next owner the problem and if he looks on the web he won't find it hard to find all the info on how much a recon engine will cost.
Mike from BR said to me they are £9000 plus fitting and fluids, so i think your looking at roughly £15000, so that's a very expensive loss.
I would maybe take it to webuyanycar.com, or through a car auction to try to get what you can, or a way of getting rid with zero come back. chuck in some slick 50 just before going for the inspection to hide the tick. If you sell it privately you could get them knocking on your door afterwards.
If you decide to have a recon engine installed it would, in my opinion, sell for abit more but not much more, i'd only get it done if it was a keeper.
I have an early build DB9, no 249, it has done 57,000 miles and no tick so i'm lucky at the mo, what is your build?
Mike from BR said to me they are £9000 plus fitting and fluids, so i think your looking at roughly £15000, so that's a very expensive loss.
I would maybe take it to webuyanycar.com, or through a car auction to try to get what you can, or a way of getting rid with zero come back. chuck in some slick 50 just before going for the inspection to hide the tick. If you sell it privately you could get them knocking on your door afterwards.
If you decide to have a recon engine installed it would, in my opinion, sell for abit more but not much more, i'd only get it done if it was a keeper.
I have an early build DB9, no 249, it has done 57,000 miles and no tick so i'm lucky at the mo, what is your build?
I guess that's the big question: would I have to take the full cost of the replacement engine off the price to sell it? From everything I've read it's not a terminal issue, just an annoying one, but I understand how a buyer would be skeptical of that, just like I still am.
When I checked, factory remanufactured engines were priced at about $12000, and I know there would be several thousand in labor to install it, so Mike's numbers would seem to track. I was figuring the old engine would have some value as a rebuildable unit, which would partially offset that. I agree that a new engine would only add a little value to the car (the fact that it HAS a new engine is good, but the fact that it NEEDED a new engine casts all kinds of doubts). And I don't think it's a keeper for me. Even with a new engine, I'd have a lot of trust issues.
I've thought about webuyanycar.com or Carmax or auctions. I just wonder if what I'd lose to wholesale pricing or commission would be more than what I'd lose being honest with a private buyer. My frustration has reached a point where a big loss sounds better than living with the car, but I still don't want to lose more than I have to.
My build is 1379.
When I checked, factory remanufactured engines were priced at about $12000, and I know there would be several thousand in labor to install it, so Mike's numbers would seem to track. I was figuring the old engine would have some value as a rebuildable unit, which would partially offset that. I agree that a new engine would only add a little value to the car (the fact that it HAS a new engine is good, but the fact that it NEEDED a new engine casts all kinds of doubts). And I don't think it's a keeper for me. Even with a new engine, I'd have a lot of trust issues.
I've thought about webuyanycar.com or Carmax or auctions. I just wonder if what I'd lose to wholesale pricing or commission would be more than what I'd lose being honest with a private buyer. My frustration has reached a point where a big loss sounds better than living with the car, but I still don't want to lose more than I have to.
My build is 1379.
Don't know how others feel about this, but I wouldn't buy a ticking Db9 for any price because driving one around is an embarrassment. And I wouldn't want the hassle of replacing the engine, so reducing the price by that amount is a non starter. You'd have had to replace the engine yourself so that at least I know it doesn't tick and replacing the motor didn't result in other problems.
My advice? Sell it wholesale via auction or carmax, if they'll take it. You'll never be happy driving it the way it is.
My advice? Sell it wholesale via auction or carmax, if they'll take it. You'll never be happy driving it the way it is.
DB9VolanteDriver said:
Don't know how others feel about this, but I wouldn't buy a ticking Db9 for any price because driving one around is an embarrassment. And I wouldn't want the hassle of replacing the engine, so reducing the price by that amount is a non starter. You'd have had to replace the engine yourself so that at least I know it doesn't tick and replacing the motor didn't result in other problems.
My advice? Sell it wholesale via auction or carmax, if they'll take it. You'll never be happy driving it the way it is.
Pretty much agree. But the folks at Carmax aren't deaf, and I don't want to be wholesale low-balled on top of discounting it for the tick, so what's the play? Pull fuse 22 and leave the radio on? Fill the engine with 90 weight and STP? I feel less bad about doing that to Carmax than an individual, but that's still a lot of bad karma to live down.My advice? Sell it wholesale via auction or carmax, if they'll take it. You'll never be happy driving it the way it is.
Numbers wise, I figure my car with no tick would be somewhere in the low 40s. A new engine might add a couple thousand to the value, and would think I could get a few thousand for the old one. With any luck, those two things would offset the installation cost, so I'd just be left with the price of the engine at around $12k. With all that in mind, the magic number for me is $30k: if I can't get that, I think I'm better off replacing the engine first.
Quick update on my DB9 and the tick. I did a coolant change and swapped the thermostat for a Vanquish one. Really, it's the same thermostat on the 2013+ DB9 as well. I did not solve the problem, nor did I expect it to. It did, however, lessen the frequency of the tick. The car only ticks now if it runs for about 20+ minutes without the AC on. Keep in mind I live in Florida and the temps during the day are above 90F consistently.
My guess is the fans are running at full speed when the AC is on, allowing the car to run cooler. At first, I thought the sound of the fans were drowning out the ticking noise but upon closer observation, that doesn't seem to be the case. I am thinking that if I can change the temp at which the fan comes on, even with the AC off, the ticking noise would be even less likely to show up.
My guess is the fans are running at full speed when the AC is on, allowing the car to run cooler. At first, I thought the sound of the fans were drowning out the ticking noise but upon closer observation, that doesn't seem to be the case. I am thinking that if I can change the temp at which the fan comes on, even with the AC off, the ticking noise would be even less likely to show up.
paulrog1 said:
Ryanr317, does the Vanquish stat make the engine run cooler??
Plus what DB9 build no is yours and mileage?
Thanks.
I'll get back to you on the build number. Mileage is at 40,300. The Vanquish stat runs about 10 degrees C cooler.Plus what DB9 build no is yours and mileage?
Thanks.
Edited by paulrog1 on Tuesday 4th June 19:00
Still ticking when hot and radiator fans off. My engine number is AM04/10950H. Build number is 2778. Chassis number is A02738. I've put about 2500 miles on it since I bought it but I'm not sure how long the issue existed before my ownership. It hasn't seemed to have gotten worse though.
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