Aston Martin GT3

[DB4DM]

In today's conditions, driving a totally 1962 standard DB4 is like motoring a museum piece. Hence mine has radial tyres, rose jointed front suspension, uprated springs and shocks, stainless steel brakes, complete SS exhaust, uprated cylinder head and high lift cams (unique as fitted by AML), electronic ignition, uprated clutch, etc so it can more or less keep up

[michael gould]

BamfordMike said:

michael gould said:

not to be picky but if 5% of V12 and Zagato's have been modified then my wild guess was pretty accurate...there are probably 30,000 (I'm guessing again ) Gaydon cars of which probably less than 1% have been modified it's not what the average Aston owner wants or has the slightest interest in. They want box standard cars with the only after sale modification probably being new grey matts when the old black ones look a bit worn.

But I totally respect businesses like yours who offer petrol heads with deep pockets the opportunity to have unique cars

to say 5% of total production will be enhanced is different to original point of 5% of one variant, especially when that variant is in bracket of enthusiast owner and likely to enhance vs a owner, lets say like Rapide, which is unlikely to ever modify. Which is why given time, dont be surprised more than 5% of certain models will be enhanced, but no point to split hairs about 5% or rationale of majority keeping car std, like you i clearly see both sides to something where there is no right or wrong answer.
My main point is that for accuracy, the % likely modified comment needed reference against time. This is because vast majority of heritage cars are now far from spec they left the factory at. Example, in the days of DB4 the thinking was probably the same, keep a totally std car. Since then a race series happened an a non standard engine improvement became the norm, now when vast majority go wrong / in need of rebuild they are not rebuilt to std factory spec, and probably 5% remain std and the majority at enhanced / non factory original spec, and those at enhanced spec are seen as value added. Given time the same will happen to new era, much like now value added enhancements make original vanquish more desirable.

well obviously heritage cars are going to need some modification .......Jesus some of the older cars had square wheels !!

[robgt3]

Just a quick update. Car will be called a GTE. 100 production run only. 80 for the US , 20 for the UK. It will be billed as " The Ultimate V12 Vantage".

[jonby]

robgt3 said:

Just a quick update. Car will be called a GTE. 100 production run only. 80 for the US , 20 for the UK. It will be billed as " The Ultimate V12 Vantage".

How stupid considering the GTE race car is a V8 !

Just to clarify for those that don't know, Aston Racing make 3 race cars

'entry level' - GT4 (based on the V8 road car) which is a multi marque class although Aston Racing run Aston-only races and the car can also be bought as a non road legal track day car

'mid level' - GT3 (based on the V12 road car), with far more in the way of aero & weight saving measures than the GT4 and used in multi marque GT3 races

'top level' - GTE (based on the V8 road car), run in the Le Mans series, hence using the V8 as the restrictions wouldn't allow a V12 of that capacity

I can see merit in calling this road car GT3 or GT4 with arguments either way for both but not GTE

[Jon39]

jonby said:

How stupid considering the GTE race car is a V8 !

+1

jonby said:

Just to clarify for those that don't know, Aston Racing make 3 race cars

'entry level' - GT4 (based on the V8 road car) which is a multi marque class although Aston Racing run Aston-only races and the car can also be bought as a non road legal track day car

'mid level' - GT3 (based on the V12 road car), with far more in the way of aero & weight saving measures than the GT4 and used in multi marque GT3 races

'top level' - GTE (based on the V8 road car), run in the Le Mans series, hence using the V8 as the restrictions wouldn't allow a V12 of that capacity

Does anyone have lap times to compare the performance of these three cars, where each class has raced in the dry at the same circuit?

Somewhere I have GT4 and GT3 times for Spa-Francorchamps, although the Horsepower Racing GT3, was the only Vantage taking part in a non-GT3 race, and on that occasion they were able to unlease all of the power, by not being required to use the GT3 class engine restrictor plate.

I don't know whether the GTE cars have raced at the Spa circuit.

[Cockernee]

Lottowhodriveslikeagirl said:

if I thought it was all about speed for my money then I would be driving a Nissan GT-R and not an Aston Martin ........Iv'e owned very fast cars since I was 25 and I rarely drive at more than 100MPH (when I'm in Germany) which is probably why Ive had a clean licence for the past 20 years

You rarely drive faster than 100MPH on a race track either

[jonby]

Jon39 said:

Does anyone have lap times to compare the performance of these three cars, where each class has raced in the dry at the same circuit?

I think it would be very interesting but difficult to obtain data from anyone other than AMR. A combination of lots of amateur drivers, cars running with different restrictions at different times, etc means no easy comparables

I believe power is not much different between GTE and GT3 (GTE engine is more sophisticated compared to the donor engine but from a much lower starting point than the GT3's V12 so I believe they both end up at 600-650bhp) but GTE has better aero, more sophisticated cassis and slightly lower weight

GT4 has much less power but probably not that much heavier as it doesn't have all the gubbins that the GT3 and GT4 have. I'll ask AMR if they can give an answer though

[mikey k]

So I'm guessing we have actually already seen this?
The wide body V12 that was seen at the Ring a while back.
I also suspect there is little to no development going on, as a run out special it will be a collection parts they already use

[jonby]

mikey k said:

So I'm guessing we have actually already seen this?
The wide body V12 that was seen at the Ring a while back.
I also suspect there is little to no development going on, as a run out special it will be a collection parts they already use

Unfortunately, despite the stuff Rob has mentioned which is typical Aston marketing speak, I suspect you are right

I doubt they will even bother taking out the electric motors for the seats. This will most likely be a V12VS with lighter wheels, lighter CF body, wider track, different backbox and a fancy colour scheme. If we are really lucky, they will put on the rear wing from the GT4. Buyers will be paying for exclusivity rather than enhanced performance.

Much better going to AMR with a V12VS and spending £100k on performance/aero upgrades and having them remove some luxuries (weight) at the same time

Such a shame - I do hope I'm wrong

[outofstepuk]

jonby said:

Unfortunately, despite the stuff Rob has mentioned which is typical Aston marketing speak, I suspect you are right

I doubt they will even bother taking out the electric motors for the seats. This will most likely be a V12VS with lighter wheels, lighter CF body, wider track, different backbox and a fancy colour scheme. If we are really lucky, they will put on the rear wing from the GT4. Buyers will be paying for exclusivity rather than enhanced performance.

Much better going to AMR with a V12VS and spending £100k on performance/aero upgrades and having them remove some luxuries (weight) at the same time

Such a shame - I do hope I'm wrong

Apparently there is a clay model, and it does come with a big wing.

[Grant3]

High end limited run specials are a nice profit item for A.M. while also raising their overall profile and developing these "specials" helps with the evolution of the other models. The Lagonda is another example, which may now come to Europe. I think we can expect a good deal more of this type of very top-end product from Aston going forward.

Look how successfully Ferrari have done this and they now have core base of ultra-rich clients that will buy the latest £1m plus special, ensuring each new addition sells out and going forward remains a good investment. Walking around Works the other day, they had 4 customer One-77's in the workshop which are shipped around the world for track days and a customer car for sale at around £2m, so the seed is already sown!

[AMD87]

If it sounds like this sign me up.
http://youtu.be/m4I7Ii5I0as
http://youtu.be/_t4ovQbEyIs

[George29]

jonby said:

lighter CF body

A carbon fibre body wouldn't be that much lighter than the existing aluminium one.

[jonby]

George29 said:

jonby said:

lighter CF body

A carbon fibre body wouldn't be that much lighter than the existing aluminium one.

I agree. But the OP stated it would have one and IIRC, whilst I was sceptical at launch and the factory actually quote an identical weight, an owner on here with a Zag states it is sufficiently lighter than the donor car to have a tangible effect on performance. Again only IIRC, said owner actually took his car to a weighbridge - I think it may have been someone that went to BR for an upgrade ?

[BamfordMike]

jonby said:

Much better going to AMR with a V12VS and spending £100k on performance/aero upgrades and having them remove some luxuries (weight) at the same time

very interesting, is this advertised anywhere, or been done for a customer? Is a spec sheet available? The area for sales to non motorsport customers did say for a long time that Prodrive no longer dabbled in aftermarket business for road cars, and now all i can find on their website for sale is T-shirts and hats? What do you know differently?

[ajr550]

My info is that there is a clay model at factory for viewing and that deposits are being taken off viewings of that.
Gearbox is exactly the same as V12S.Not being mechanical at all I had asked if upgraded box from new Vanquish(which is reportedly a big improvement) had been fitted.Answer is no.Someone cleverer than I on here will probably tell me that it would not be possible to fit this box to a Vantage.
Power is up 15 bhp and weight down 165kg.
My fear based on what I have learnt is that this is a cosmetic end of line limited edition rather than a "special" of the type Ferrari and Porsche produce which are significantly improved cars.
I accept that AM does not have the resource to really go to town on the engineering of a special like this but IMHO it needs to in order to justify the price they are asking for this one.
I intend investigating further as the prospect of a depreciation free car always interests me.I really hope the spec justifies the price !

[jonby]

ajr550 said:

My info is that there is a clay model at factory for viewing and that deposits are being taken off viewings of that.
Gearbox is exactly the same as V12S.Not being mechanical at all I had asked if upgraded box from new Vanquish(which is reportedly a big improvement) had been fitted.Answer is no.Someone cleverer than I on here will probably tell me that it would not be possible to fit this box to a Vantage.
Power is up 15 bhp and weight down 165kg.
My fear based on what I have learnt is that this is a cosmetic end of line limited edition rather than a "special" of the type Ferrari and Porsche produce which are significantly improved cars.
I accept that AM does not have the resource to really go to town on the engineering of a special like this but IMHO it needs to in order to justify the price they are asking for this one.
I intend investigating further as the prospect of a depreciation free car always interests me.I really hope the spec justifies the price !

If it's 250k for the AM and you want a depreciation free car, I'd get the new GT3 RS if you can get your hands on one!

As for gearbox, I can't see, however good it may be, buyers of this car wanting a conventional automatic.And yes engineering it in would be prohibitively expensive anyway

I wish I'd been wrong with my earlier post but I see power has already gone down in the space of 2 pages from 600, to 585, to 580. Looks like a new backbox as predicted.....

Edited by jonby on Wednesday 3rd December 19:47

[L0TT0]

Cockernee said:

Lottowhodriveslikeagirl said:

if I thought it was all about speed for my money then I would be driving a Nissan GT-R and not an Aston Martin ........Iv'e owned very fast cars since I was 25 and I rarely drive at more than 100MPH (when I'm in Germany) which is probably why Ive had a clean licence for the past 20 years

You rarely drive faster than 100MPH on a race track either

Think you will find it was Jonby not me that said that. I Mean.........a Datsun......FFS

[jonby]

BamfordMike said:

jonby said:

Much better going to AMR with a V12VS and spending £100k on performance/aero upgrades and having them remove some luxuries (weight) at the same time

very interesting, is this advertised anywhere, or been done for a customer? Is a spec sheet available? The area for sales to non motorsport customers did say for a long time that Prodrive no longer dabbled in aftermarket business for road cars, and now all i can find on their website for sale is T-shirts and hats? What do you know differently?

Yes and no. I had your experience when I bought my first Aston - they didn't return any calls despite at the time advertising the upgrades that you will recall were theoretically available at the time (c 4- 5 yrs ago)

I believe they don't offer upgrades

But if one were to come with say a £100k budget, rather than a 5-15k budget, my guess is they would talk, effectively looking at it as a race car project, fitting race car parts, but to a road car. If not, you'd have to do it via someone else but still using race car bits e.g. rear spoiler

If you recall around 12 months ago there were photos of a road car V12 with a number of race car mods, in white, at the ring. See link below for a reminder. It finally emerged that this was a private project for a customer, but I;m not sure who did the build. Whether done directly or indirectly with AMR, some of the parts appear to be off the shelf race car.. You will know better than me how to source these components Mike and in particular, whether original source is AMR or elsewhere

http://www.aston-martin.com/2014/05/13/spotted-v12...

[jonby]

L0TT0 said:

Cockernee said:

Lottowhodriveslikeagirl said:

if I thought it was all about speed for my money then I would be driving a Nissan GT-R and not an Aston Martin ........Iv'e owned very fast cars since I was 25 and I rarely drive at more than 100MPH (when I'm in Germany) which is probably why Ive had a clean licence for the past 20 years

You rarely drive faster than 100MPH on a race track either

Think you will find it was Jonby not me that said that. I Mean.........a Datsun......FFS

Not me :-)