RE: Prodrive boosts AM Vantage V8
Discussion
joust said:
amvntage said:
You have obviously missed the point of owning an Aston Martin.
Pray tell me, that point is what exactly? Perhaps you missread my post. I didn't say the slowness of it was the only reason I canned the order, just I cancelled it when I saw how slow it finally was.
J
What were the other reasons? (Out of interest).
grant3 said:
But in honesty this fixation with one car being 1 second quicker than another to 100 mph, doesn't translate into big differences on the road, the reality is you would need a GT3/Turbo/430/Gallardo to put a decent amount of air between the Aston's front end & their rear bumper then you would need to be doing well over 100 to really pull out an embarrassing gap (& with the exception of the stripped out GT3, they average about £120k, to the Astons £90k with heavy spec)!
If you had a look at my profile my daily car is a Noble M400. The DB9 that I had all last weekend was shockingly slow, even in the critical 60-90 range where the V12 should help it. Figures aren't everything, but ultimatly you compare to what you know, and the AMV8 is a shockingly slow car for so much money.
J
GetCarter said:
What were the other reasons? (Out of interest).
I fell out with the changes to the front. I saw the spy shots of it at the 'ring in Autocar and my initial reaction was "oh god, what have Aston done now". Once I realised that was the car I had on order I started sole searching if I really liked the shape. I came to the conclusion it looks like a Cherie Blair at the front, all wide open mouth at the front and it looks like it's dragging it's bottom lip along the road. Totally spoils it for me.
The changes from the prototype's suspension layout to the final one also shouted 'cost saving' to me, and I didn't really want a DB9 interior either which was a great shame. There was promise of the AMV8 having it's own character, it's own fun, young impression. Once it aped the DB9's interior it lost that, as a DB9 is a car I'd want when I'm 50, not mid 30s.
Also, during the 2 year wait, many things changed. Business life became more successful meaning an AMV8 wasn't just what I could afford any more, and so I started to think there was even better kit out there.
The final nail in the coffin was the final performance figures and the shocking experience I had at the dealer. Said dealer was downright rude about the whole transaction so I just told them to stuff it, mainly because of them, but also I had clearly fallen out of love with the car that took my breath away when I saw the concept.
J
joust said:
grant3 said:
But in honesty this fixation with one car being 1 second quicker than another to 100 mph, doesn't translate into big differences on the road, the reality is you would need a GT3/Turbo/430/Gallardo to put a decent amount of air between the Aston's front end & their rear bumper then you would need to be doing well over 100 to really pull out an embarrassing gap (& with the exception of the stripped out GT3, they average about £120k, to the Astons £90k with heavy spec)!
If you had a look at my profile my daily car is a Noble M400. The DB9 that I had all last weekend was shockingly slow, even in the critical 60-90 range where the V12 should help it. Figures aren't everything, but ultimatly you compare to what you know, and the AMV8 is a shockingly slow car for so much money.
J
Hi joust, I think the Noble is a fabulous car, but it is a different animal to an AMV8, current list for an M-400 is £55995, be in no doubt that down an average B road the Mitsibushi FQ360 at £35504 will demolish your car, is put together far far better than a Nobles hand made kit car build could dream of, has four seats & a boot & a real racing pedigree, so why oh why would you pay an extra £20,000 for a car that is slower in the real world, not as well made, not as reliable? Even a TVR Tuscan 3.6 targa is £16,000 less than the Noble for goodness sake!
Could it be because you like the looks, the handling, the character, the individuality of the Noble, so you will forgive some of its foibles & lack of relative value?
I am not knocking your choice of car, it is superb drivers car, I love it, I am simply illustrating that your argument is flawed, it applies to your car as much as the AMV8.
If you don't like the AMV8, fine don't buy it, but to simply come onto the Aston part of Pistonheads to knock the car, doesn't seem appropriate. Maybe I was like you, every time I changed my car it had to be faster, but a modified 996TT made me realise that for our roads that was fast enough & maybe there is more to being a car enthusiast than being faster than the next guy!
joust said:
GetCarter said:
What were the other reasons? (Out of interest).
I fell out with the changes to the front. I saw the spy shots of it at the 'ring in Autocar and my initial reaction was "oh god, what have Aston done now". Once I realised that was the car I had on order I started sole searching if I really liked the shape. I came to the conclusion it looks like a Cherie Blair at the front, all wide open mouth at the front and it looks like it's dragging it's bottom lip along the road. Totally spoils it for me.
The changes from the prototype's suspension layout to the final one also shouted 'cost saving' to me, and I didn't really want a DB9 interior either which was a great shame. There was promise of the AMV8 having it's own character, it's own fun, young impression. Once it aped the DB9's interior it lost that, as a DB9 is a car I'd want when I'm 50, not mid 30s.
Also, during the 2 year wait, many things changed. Business life became more successful meaning an AMV8 wasn't just what I could afford any more, and so I started to think there was even better kit out there.
busniess got better so i got a noble,LMAO must be a busy hot dog van 
The final nail in the coffin was the final performance figures and the shocking experience I had at the dealer. Said dealer was downright rude about the whole transaction so I just told them to stuff it, mainly because of them, but also I had clearly fallen out of love with the car that took my breath away when I saw the concept.
J
grant3 said:
Hi joust, I think the Noble is a fabulous car, but it is a different animal to an AMV8, current list for an M-400 is £55995, be in no doubt that down an average B road the Mitsibushi FQ360 at £35504 will demolish your car.
You clearly haven't ever been in a Noble or even understand it's power or weight - there is absolutly no way a FQ360 would keep up with it. FQ360 = 261 bhp/tonne
M400 = 400 bhp/tonne
Yeah. Right.
As for reliability, err, my X5 has been in the garage for more broken things than my M400 over the last two years.
However that isn't the point - it's the relative metrics. Can you really justify £50k more than that FQ360 for an AMV8 to turn your argument on it's head. If you are going to argue the Noble's a daft choice based on that, the AMV8 is plain insanity.
J
Edited by joust on Sunday 3rd December 10:12
joust said:
v8tvr said:
LMAO must be a busy hot dog van
Ohhhh. You look so sophisticated with that sort of quip. I actually sold my publically quoted company for £211m.
J
The real persona comes out, a long with any sense of credibility and respect.
This isn't the noble forum joust, put your bank statements and receipts away.
Edited by petrol_noggin on Sunday 3rd December 10:26
joust said:
v8tvr said:
LMAO must be a busy hot dog van
Ohhhh. You look so sophisticated with that sort of quip. I actually sold my publically quoted company for £211m.
J
You could have at least given us the "nod , nod nudge, nudge" .... we all could have made a few quid when you sold
When you moving from Croydon or is that your holiday home ?
joust said:
grant3 said:
Hi joust, I think the Noble is a fabulous car, but it is a different animal to an AMV8, current list for an M-400 is £55995, be in no doubt that down an average B road the Mitsibushi FQ360 at £35504 will demolish your car.
You clearly haven't ever been in a Noble or even understand it's power or weight - there is absolutly no way a FQ360 would keep up with it. FQ360 = 261 bhp/tonne
M400 = 400 bhp/tonne
Yeah. Right.
Joust you know the point I am making, it is you who is saying the Aston isn't worth £xyz more than another car with better performance, I am simply illustrating that the same argument applies to your car & any other for that matter.
WATCH MY LIPS... there is more to judging a cars value than simply how fast it is, I am really surprised that you can't see that.
The point is we all make value judgements, I am well aware that I can get a faster 0-100 by buying into the small volume british specialist market, TVR, Noble, Radical, Caterham etc etc,but I don't want to. I would honestly prefer the properly engineered pedigree of a 911 at the same price of your Noble, fully appreciating that it is far slower.
Otherwise we would all have a Caterham R400, R500, the 400 is half the price of your Noble & would leave it for dead! You are also delusional if you believe that on an average twisty B road you would leave a Mitisibushi FQ360, simply wouldn't happen, conversely on track the Caterham, Ariel or Radical would eat you for breakfast for half the cash of your Noble! I'm NOT knocking your car in saying this, simply pointing out yet again that ther is more to a cars value than power to weight, 0-100 etc!
I actually like the Noble it is a lovely car, but I don't want one, just because I don't want one doesn't mean that I want to leap into the Noble section of the forum & tell you why your choice of car is bad!
Edited by grant3 on Sunday 3rd December 11:29
Especially the "Strip"
:
Many years ago when you could still drive through from West to South Croydon ( DR Jims night club ! ) I was chased by a Morris Minor pursuit car ,I was in 440 C.I.(7.2L)Dodge Challenger so I managed to escape- but I suspect you`re up in the Shirley Hills area , very nice !Is Chateaux Napoleon still there ?
: Many years ago when you could still drive through from West to South Croydon ( DR Jims night club ! ) I was chased by a Morris Minor pursuit car ,I was in 440 C.I.(7.2L)Dodge Challenger so I managed to escape- but I suspect you`re up in the Shirley Hills area , very nice !
Is Chateaux Napoleon still there ?grant3 said:
WATCH MY LIPS... there is more to judging a cars value than simply how fast it is, I am really surprised that you can't see that.
Pray tell me where I said that? Watch MY lips...
The AMV8 is shockingly slow for so much money.
Did I say therefore that people shouldn't buy one? My point is why did Prodrive feel the ability to launch this product. Perhaps they realised that the AMV8 has far more potential than Aston, with it's entire range to protect, could do?
If you read my reasons for not buying one, speed was just one of those things. If I hadn't fallen out of love with the car I saw the first time it was shown, and had such a crap experience by the dealer, coupled with my financial position meaning I would be far more likely to buy a DB9 if I wanted an Aston rather than the V8, meant I didn't go through with it.
You are a funny lot over here for such a mass market car. We often get accused of having rosy tinted glasses over in the Noble forum, but then with such a small volume of cars being sold, the Noble is always going to be an 'alternative' choice. With the volumes in a week of Aston's now outstripping a years worth of Nobles, I'm intruiged that the mass market things of looks, performance and value haven't started to bite yet.
Or perhaps they have, maybe that's one of the multitude of reasons Ford is selling?
J
joust said:
I cancelled my deposit on the AMV8 when I saw how slow it is J
Sorry Joust, must have got you mixed up with some one else
joust said:
coupled with my financial position meaning I would be far more likely to buy a DB9 if I wanted an Aston rather than the V8, meant I didn't go through with it.
J
J
I also note your point that because you have a few quid in the bank you would have purchased the more expensive DB9 instead, hmmm enough said I think!!!
grant3 said:
I also note your point that because you have a few quid in the bank you would have purchased the more expensive DB9 instead, hmmm enough said I think!!!
I love the way you either don't understand our glorious language, or you are just trolling? I didn't say that at all. I said that finacial position was just one of many factors in the decision.
I thought the Ferrari owners were unwelcoming to people that enjoyed cars but didn't think Ferrari's were the best thing. I was wrong, clearly new Aston owners are much worse
joust said:
grant3 said:
I also note your point that because you have a few quid in the bank you would have purchased the more expensive DB9 instead, hmmm enough said I think!!!
I love the way you either don't understand our glorious language, or you are just trolling? I didn't say that at all. I said that finacial position was just one of many factors in the decision.
I thought the Ferrari owners were unwelcoming to people that enjoyed cars but didn't think Ferrari's were the best thing. I was wrong, clearly new Aston owners are much worse
Yeah, we're all 'orrible bastards, shut the door behind you.
joust said:
grant3 said:
I also note your point that because you have a few quid in the bank you would have purchased the more expensive DB9 instead, hmmm enough said I think!!!
I love the way you either don't understand our glorious language, or you are just trolling? I didn't say that at all. I said that finacial position was just one of many factors in the decision.
I thought the Ferrari owners were unwelcoming to people that enjoyed cars but didn't think Ferrari's were the best thing. I was wrong, clearly new Aston owners are much worse
Actually, I think the real issue here is you started the flame with your comment of how "slow" an AMV8 was for the money and that it was the deciding factor in your removing your deposit on the car.
Furthermore, I think you will find that many on this board who have purchased an AMV8 are affluent enough to buy any car they would like. Many have Ferrari's, Bentley's, or Porsches for their other cars.
All I know is that I drove my AMV8 to the new bond movie last night, and the giggles, jumps and admiration from children, adults, and especially women were enough to justify the extra 50k. I have never seen anything like it. There were more folks around my Aston than were standing around the 612 parked two cars down. Clearly beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Finally, there will ALWAYS be a faster car for LESS money than what you have paid. In addition,it would seem that your definition of faster is as narrow as your qualificaion of asthetics. There are many other aspects to "fast" than how quickly a car gets from 0-60mph.
I welcome your thougths that the AM could and should be faster for the money. However, as the former head of a publicly traded company, you should know that delivery is everything.
joust said:
or you are just trolling?
Some how I just can't believe you said that, from the guy who has simply come onto the Aston section of the forum & slagged off the DB9 & the AMV8, the way they look, the way they are made, the way they perform, their interior, their reliability.... and more!
Well fine we are all entitled to our opinions, but we don't all go around shouting about how sh*t the other persons choice is & then complain because they are offended
! I am not a blinkered Aston fan, I have owned a whole series of high performance cars & have driven a Noble, I wanted to try the Aston whilst waiting for a new 997GT3 Pork & frankly I love the car, it has really got under my skin!
My point in responding to your post was simply to say "hey I felt the same way as you coming out of a 996TT, but the Aston isn't all about speed & I love it, so maybe you would too if you gave the AMV8 a chance!"
Which you are clearly not going to do.
Well that is fine by me, I won't waste my breath further!!!
Edited by grant3 on Sunday 3rd December 16:33
amvntage said:
Actually, I think the real issue here is you started the flame with your comment of how "slow" an AMV8 was for the money and that it was the deciding factor in your removing your deposit on the car.
Excuse me. In my original post I said I cancelled when I saw how slow it was. No where in there did I say it was the deciding factor. If you are going to base some argument on incorrect regurgitation of what someone else has posted, then you're pretty much onto a loser before you start.
J
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