Aston Martin advice from Bamford Rose independent specialist

[dbs2000]

They do indeed. I have the primary deleted and high-flow secondaries, the result is a stock (slightly louder) sound, a lot more power over stock and peace of mind knowing the cat will never be eaten

[CSK1]

All very well if your car is no longer under factory warranty. Deleting primary cats will invalidate warranty.

[Speculatore]

v8maniac said:

Does Bamford Rose offer exhaust conversions for V12 as well? Cannot find anything on its homepage. Looking to get rid of this cat integrated exhaust manifolds of my DB9 GT.

Search for Project Blofeld. They did 'The Works' on my 2007 DB9.

[Chris_C]

Just had mine back after Mike and Adrian added the glass buttons and a small remap of the Gearbox and Throttle in Sport - what a difference - Jeckyl and Hyde (the car not Mike and Adrian )

Great guys to work with, and the tea is good

Thanks gents, be back soon for the exhaust work.... First off a small trip to France

[Seakingsam]

Hi all, I'm a new forum member, based in Auckland, New Zealand. Took delivery of my brand new 2016 V8 Vantage S in Auckland six months ago, in December 2016. The vehicle is in Quantum Silver, red Brembo calipers, Obsidian black interior. I wanted slightly modified suspension ( just a touch softer for the undulating back roads of New Zealand, but body control kept optimum ) and had to be manual transmission.

I ran the Vantage in by way of an amazing road trip of 3000 miles throughout New Zealand, and she now has about 6000 miles in total. I'm using her every single day. I have, however, decided the new car needed a tweak here and there. Specifically, I spoke to Mike at Bamford Rose about optimising the Vantage experience, and he couldn't have been more helpful - thanks, Mike!

I ordered the twinplate clutch and lightweight flywheel, which was fitted over last month by Aston Martin New Zealand team here in Auckland - can't say enough about them either ! The Aston Martin GM in New Zealand has been consistently superb to work with in specifying and ordering the new vehicle, and again demonstrated his customer support by agreeing my new vehicle warranty wouldn't be impacted by the change. The team was also very interested in my reasons for the change, and the Bamford Rose solution.

We hit a snag when trying to fit - a warning for all. The 20mm spacer located behind the slave cylinder which is found in all other 4.3 and 4.7 V8 Vantages was found to be now cast in at factory, so that the space required for the new clutch pack, the smaller BR spacer and the BR-supplied slave cylinder was no longer available. Worse still, we checked the 2017 Aston Martin factory parts system and no mention of the change - still showing the original 20mm spacer.

Mike and I had lots of conversations about the snag, and he was ever helpful, and asked for detailed measurements, and checked his own information sources, to determine the work-around. Clearly, we needed to machine the bell housing and the torque tube, so we needed to be dead accurate before cutting metal.

Not easy sourcing a top-quality machine shop who could cut to the exacting requirements on a horizontal lathe where the central spindle couldn't be used as the torque tube machined face is buried down in the bell housing was exactly the component to be machined. Indeed, I received something of an education in machining high value components when I was shown how the torque tube does not lie through the centre-line of the component. Therefore, 2 days to set up the job, 3 hours milling - all for NZ$1300, just 650 pounds - not bad at all, when you think of the alternative or a botched job !

The vehicle was returned to me a week ago - a real transformation ! The manual box now feels beautifully light and accurate, clutch is easily modulated and the engine revs just that little bit more freely, certainly a much more flexible and involving driving package - exactly what I was hoping for !!

I'll let this settle for a month or three, and then onto the second programmed upgrade - Bamford Rose's exhaust manifold and sports cats.

[Steve*B]

Seakingsam said:

Hi all, I'm a new forum member, based in Auckland, New Zealand.

Interested to read your post Gareth as a clutch replacement isn't too far off and the glowing reports on the Bamford Rose replacement is something I'd consider as and when needed. Who is your contact in Auckland? Independent Prestige? Mike?
Interested to know the process you went through to get the clutch imported and by who if you get a minute

[V8V Pete]

It's now two weeks since BR did the modification to my exhaust with the addition of small silencers immediately behind the cats and removal of the X-pipie - full write up here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... Video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngERuezVd5o&fe...

My initial impressions are confirmed that it is now exactly as I wanted it. I totally recommend this new version of the BR exhaust to anyone with a V8S who loves the character of the OEM exhaust sound but wants more power, a bit more volume (but not too much) and the extra bits that the 200 cell cats give. Thanks again to Mike and Adrian for making it happen

[Ian_UK1]

V8V Pete said:

It's now two weeks since BR did the modification to my exhaust with the addition of small silencers immediately behind the cats and removal of the X-pipie - full write up here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... Video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngERuezVd5o&fe...

My initial impressions are confirmed that it is now exactly as I wanted it. I totally recommend this new version of the BR exhaust to anyone with a V8S who loves the character of the OEM exhaust sound but wants more power, a bit more volume (but not too much) and the extra bits that the 200 cell cats give. Thanks again to Mike and Adrian for making it happen

Following Pete's really positive review, I also had this change made to my car (Vantage SP10) last week. BR replaced their 'standard', non-silenced, 200-cell cats with the same, silenced units fitted to Pete's car. My car differs from Pete's as it's fitted with an X-pipe, that I've retained (for now). My comments refer to the silenced-cats-plus-X-pipe setup.

After a few days hooning-around, I can only echo Pete's comments. What I regarded as a rather over-the-top edge to car's exhaust note is gone. It's still louder than standard, with the valves open, but now in a really good way. Less I'VE GOT A VERY LOUD EXHAUST' and more 'That sounds amazing'. In my opinion, a big improvement, but I'm probably in a minority on this one!

What I didn't expect was a (small, but) measurable increase in performance! The one minor concern I'd had with this change was the cats being a smaller diameter than the original, non-silenced BR units. As I understand it, a smaller diameter means less flow for a given pressure differential across the cat - something that, theoretically, could adversely affect outright performance. Subjectively, the car didn't feel slower (but the delivery has changed a little - more later) so I decided to check with a more measured approach.

Near where I live, there's a quiet, straight, road, with little traffic, where I can really open the car up. I have an (admittedly not very scientific) way of benchmarking the car's performance along this road. If I drive along in 2nd gear, at exactly 30mph and open the car up at a certain lamp post, it will graze the rev limiter at a known point, further along the road. This point can vary a little, day-to-day, (presumably due to temperatures, atmospherics and inconsistencies in my driving/observational skills). So not madly accurate, but better than 'I'm sure it feels slower/quicker'!

With a couple of hundred miles on the new cats, I took my car to this location, opened it up and.... on the limiter a few feet sooner than expected. Hmmmm..... Anomaly? Back up the road for another go. Same! This has been repeatable over a few runs on separate days - the car appears to consistently hit the limiter a few feet sooner. This would suggest the car has genuinely picked-up a small amount of extra power. Not very much, but it's there! Why, I've no idea.

Other minor changes noted to date are a) in the way the throttle responds - I can't really quantify it, it just feels slightly different (or maybe it's just brain fade on my part) and b) the shape of the torque curve at full throttle also appears to have changed a little - the previous, noticeable step at 4000 rpm now appears to be more of a smooth increase over a few hundred rpm.

One final, unexpected bonus: the car is now far better for long distance motorway driving. With the non-silenced cats fitted, there used to be a noticeable, ever-present, exhaust noise, inside the car, at cruising speeds, even with the exhaust switched to 'quiet mode' (valves permanently closed). Now, with the extra silencing, the exhaust noise at cruise is gone and long hauls are much more peaceful.

For anyone looking to have the BR mods done to their car in future, Mike told me last week that the silenced cats will now be BR's standard fitment on all new conversions, with the non-silenced cats being available as an option, should you like/want a really loud exhaust sound.

Edited by Ian_UK1 on Tuesday 5th December 09:16

[Wayne95]

Mike

I am running a standard 4.7 2010 Vantage with 33 k miles completed.

I have been considering changing up to a later model but there is s big step up in price. I am happy with power and acceleration, but want a better controlled ride to smooth out the worsening road network but still give more control.

I have Bridgestone tyres and have heard PS4 etc make a big difference.

Question, is it better to change the tyres first then look at the active suspension upgrade, or do the upgrade first and wait till the tyres need changing.

Also looks like a new clutch is due soon, so will be adding the twin plate.

Finally, how does BR mods affect resale, j would suspect t it adds value at this end of the market, but concerned a future trade in at AM would be an issue

Thanks

[David W.]

Wayne
Just had the active suspension and as set up by the BR guys the car now ride superbly. Cant believe the standard car (mines 56 reg 4.3) got “released” with such a harsh ride, there are very few uk roads where it offered a tolerable ride for me (A421 Bedford bypass springs to mind as a highlight).
Also had the DP clutch done, my 911 pedal now seems heavy! New clutch now has lovely bite point, no need to dread stop start traffic anymore and engine throttle re-map means it spins up more freely too.
Regarding resale value, for me it also meant not having to invest big bucks on a newer better set up model and for buyers looking S/H I’d hope they would realise that buying a car properly sorted would mean not having to spend more putting right the compromises that earleyer standard cars have.
Get it done.
DW

[Wayne95]

DW
Thanks for the recommendation. I think my dampers are getting a little tired anyway, and the new set up does sound good.

I'm ok with clutch most of the time, but when traffic inevitably clogs up it can be hard work. It can also be hard to judge blood on downshift keeping things smooth.

Call to BR tomorrow I think.

[V8V Pete]

Wayne. I've not (yet) had the suspension done but thoroughly recommend the clutch/flywheel (and exhaust if interested). As regards resale I think there are two ways to approach this. If you sell privately and find a buyer who wants the best car they can get then I think the mods will enhance the value. If you trade in to a main dealer then I they will probably give you less rather than more because they can't really put a warranty on the car. So the solution then is to have the mods removed, then either fit the bits to the new car or sell them as parts. The other obvious solution is not to sell it as it's now so good

[Squaremeal]

Big Brake Upgrade Review crosslink for those interested.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[BamfordMike]

CraigV12V said:

Just a line to say in just over 2 weeks she is back with a brand new engine. No quibbles or even questions, just ripped out the old and dropped in a new one. They tell me it was the primary cats being ingested that caused the failure and they would not rebuild it without installing new cats (I asked them to be removed to stop potential problem happening again). What they have not told me is what caused the cats to be ingested, I have asked, we'll see.

Craig's V12VS on back of tow truck on way back to dealer was certainly not the best of sights, fortunately the unexplained primary catalyst failure which compromised the engine because of ceramic debris ingestion was sorted under warranty by dealer / factory fitting new exhaust system and replacement engine.

However, there's an altogether much nicer sight to see now - and no more risk of unknown and unexplained catalyst failure wrecking a perfectly decent engine, a rather devilish exhaust note and a power delta increase of 70 BHP.









Out with the old and in with the new....




Appropriate Re-program of the V12VS's Bosch Engine management system...









And choice of catalyst depending on sound preferences (baffle for deep bass / baritone / typical Aston burble or non baffle for full on loud)



https://youtu.be/QspJLM_26ZE

https://youtu.be/IiKmkQHWIdY

https://youtu.be/9B_sFCblKZQ

It's taken us a while to come to market with our Exhaust manifold and catalyst power upgrade kit for Bosch engine management system cars (V12VS, Rapide S, Vanquish 8 speed, DB11 and soon to be New AMG Vantage), there were 2 barriers to entry.

The first was sound quality, nobody really wants the exhaust note to change pitch or volume too much. Our baffle catalysts keep volume to roughly the same overall but amplifies the burble at idle to make the sound even more bass / baritone, without baffle catalysts and as pretty much all conversions iv'e seen on the net to date, the exhaust note is way too loud and turns un-Astonly high pitch and harsh up the rev range.

The second was re calibration of the EMS. Most aftermarket tuning companies for Bosch ECU will simply buy the flashing hardware from a supplier and then look to a generic 'tuner' for a software file to reprogram the ECU with. Usually, the changes made to the file by the generic tuner, the aftermarket installer will have little to no idea what they are because the supplying aftermarket is simply a conduit to install the file into the car, and if problems are encountered (dashboard error lights or poor driveability) because even the generic tuners access to the ECU is very limited, means problems quite likely remain unresolved (often discussed in the world of aftermarket as the side effects of modification one has to live with, either drive around the issue or keep resetting the fault codes). The powertrain calibration engineers within us cringe at the thought of taking an unknown file and flashing to a car and then having no power to write a solution and informing customer to 'live with it', so for that reason we've avoided Bosch ECU cars until we could crack the ECU totally and via internal means. Through painstaking reverse engineering and decoding of files uploaded from several Bosch cars, we now have complete control of all data within the Bosch ECU as if we were the factory prototype department.

70 BHP improvement equates to a full throttle acceleration in 4th gear from 25 mph (1500 rpm) to 113 mph (7000 rpm) reduction of just over a second or 10%, a 50% throttle pedal acceleration in 3rd gear from 20 mph to 90 mph (7000 rpm) was 7% faster - making the drive of the car addictive, corrupting and mighty good fun.

But crucially for Craig's car, whatever caused the unexplained catalyst failure, if should occur again, won't trash a perfectly serviceable engine now the primary catalysts are gone.

[CraigV12V]

I saw Mike's exhaust system in the flesh two Aston's ago and always intended to get them fitted on an Aston I thought would be a keeper and much as I liked the V8V and V12V coupes I’d had, I always thought they would be temporary. But now the Flugplatz Blue V12VS Roadster is way too much fun to part with.

When my P&J Flugplatz ingested its primary cats not long after purchase, this sealed the deal for me, the cats had to go. Whilst I could simply rely on a warranty to get out of a £20k+ bill for a new lump, I didn’t want to worry about being stranded in Italy with dead Aston.

I was going to wait until 2019 when the 3 year warranty comes to an end to get the cats out and possibly Mike’s stainless steel work of art fitted but Mike gave me an early Xmas present when he contacted me to say he now had the ability to re calibrate the Bosch ECU and would I like my car to be his Guinea pig.

So now she is back and the sound has not changed that much, it’s a little louder I would say but not deafening by any means. With exhaust closed it’s still just as quiet. What has changed in the sound is the way it rips up through the revs which probably makes it sound angrier and louder than before, but it may be just the speed with which the noise increases. The noise on full throttle through the gears is epic.

As for the power. Well it’s definitely quicker, you are pulling on the paddles pretty quickly at full chat. If you have a manual, you are going to be very busy managing 7 gears. It feels like the car it always should have been without the inhibition of those primary cats which serve no real purpose in the real world; emissions are controlled sufficiently for MOT via the secondary 200 Cell cats Mike fitted.

I have only been for a couple of short runs due to the inclement weather but OMG its quick and noticeably pulls harder from lower down the revs.

So part insurance against cat ingestion and from what I hear there is a lot more engines suffering this problem than owners probably realise and part serious power upgrade.

[Upperworks]

I'm removing the power kit from my V12V as I prepare to sell it. Now they can fit them to the Bosch V12's I'm really excited to be able to fit it to another car. At the moment I'm thinking my Vanquish as I prefer it to the S stylistically and love the idea of genuine 600bhp+ performance in it. Probably hold off a year to let the manufacture warranty run it's course though.

Watching with interest!

[klaiberp]

Thanks for the write up. Makes me even more excited to pick my car up on Friday when the same work is complete. Can't wait and the weather looks like it could be favourable

Paul

[steveway]

klaiberp said:

Thanks for the write up. Makes me even more excited to pick my car up on Friday when the same work is complete. Can't wait and the weather looks like it could be favourable

Paul

Do you have V12V or V8V, would be nice to know what you think, although its too late to change my mind but then why would I when its going from 510 to 600bhp

[klaiberp]

steveway said:

Do you have V12V or V8V, would be nice to know what you think, although its too late to change my mind but then why would I when its going from 510 to 600bhp

Mine is a V12Vsr. I really don't think there will be anything to change your mind about Like you say what is there to change your mind when there is all that extra gain and the exhaust note
All can be justified with the added insurance for your engine not ingesting the CATs

Edited by klaiberp on Thursday 15th February 11:07

[CraigV12V]

Quick update. Called Admiral and advised them of the modifications and thye increased my premium by £21.