Aston Martin advice from Bamford Rose independent specialist
Discussion
CatalystV12V said:
I guess you mean 'with throttle pedal pressed to cut injectors', which is what I do. However on my V12 I can't get the oil pressure light to extinguish as I could when applying the same technique to my V8. Is this to be expected?
Richard
Mine goes out Rich - takes about 10 seconds (max) of cranking I guess. Will check next time I fire it up and let you know how long before light goes outRichard
Hi Mike ,
Please tell me about Blueprinting and porting, I understand the basic principles. While my car is with you in
January should I have this done as well? Is the process prohibitively expensive ? What gains should I expect over and above what we have agreed to do? Is 500 BHP conceivable without going down the route of bigger pistons?
Also is ASM2 up to all this increase in HP?
Sorry to burden you with all these questions.
Molly and I wish you and yours a great Christmas
Regards Rob
Please tell me about Blueprinting and porting, I understand the basic principles. While my car is with you in
January should I have this done as well? Is the process prohibitively expensive ? What gains should I expect over and above what we have agreed to do? Is 500 BHP conceivable without going down the route of bigger pistons?
Also is ASM2 up to all this increase in HP?
Sorry to burden you with all these questions.
Molly and I wish you and yours a great Christmas
Regards Rob
Tony V12V said:
CatalystV12V said:
I guess you mean 'with throttle pedal pressed to cut injectors', which is what I do. However on my V12 I can't get the oil pressure light to extinguish as I could when applying the same technique to my V8. Is this to be expected?
Richard
Mine goes out Rich - takes about 10 seconds (max) of cranking I guess. Will check next time I fire it up and let you know how long before light goes outRichard
BamfordMike said:
Lots of interesting stuff
Mike,Thanks. There certainly are many variables that affect engine life -- I know these are not easy questions, so I appreciate your efforts. The inevitable question, then, is how long will my engine last
? Obviously, this is an impossible question to answer, but hypothetically, if a 4.7L V8V is properly maintained, treated with mechanical sympathy, but also driven hard (but smoothly), is it fairly likely that it would go beyond 120K miles without needing big-end bearings and/or valvetrain work, or other significant work?My car is garaged. The garage is not climate-controlled, but it is attached to the house so it doesn’t get below freezing in the winter, and I run a dehumidifier. It’s a weekend/pleasure car, not a daily driver. I do not store the car in the winter, but I don’t drive it through the salt, so it may sit for 6 – 8 weeks during the winter between drives depending on the severity of the winter. If it sits 4 weeks, I always prime the oiling system (throttle to the floor) before I start it. I never drive the car hard until it’s fully warmed up, after which I certainly do drive it hard, but I always try to be smooth. Assume it will always be properly maintained. Is it likely that such a V8 (or V12) would go well beyond 120K miles without significant wear to the big-ends or valvetrain?
Hypothetically, if they all experienced the same use, care and maintenance, would an AM 4.7 V8 be as durable (or more, or less) as, for example, a:
Jag V8;
Ford V8, V6, or any other Ford engine that goes through the same testing;
Porsche flat 6;
Mercedes V8;
BMW V8;
Ferrari V8;
My 266,000 mile ’83 Saab Turbo?
BTW, about startup-cranking-with-the-throttle-to-the-floor-until-the-oil-light-goes-out and the V12 – wow, 10 seconds seems like a long time. It probably takes only about 2 seconds for the light on my V8 to go out. Does the V8 build oil pressure more quickly? If yes, is it due to the dry sump system? Also, after how much time sitting should the oil-system priming process be used? Every cold-start? After 2 weeks? 4 weeks?
Many, many thanks.
Speedraser said:
BTW, about startup-cranking-with-the-throttle-to-the-floor-until-the-oil-light-goes-out and the V12 – wow, 10 seconds seems like a long time.
Tried it this morning - Light was out within 4-5 seconds MAX - Seems a LOT longer when you sit there cranking. But this was first time I have actually checked properly (not timed it - just counted slowly). Dont forget V8 is dry sumped so different oil supply method to V12.Just a quick note of thanks to all those who have recommended Bamford Rose. I had my DB9V serviced just before Christmas and was very impressed with their knowledge of the cars and the clear customer focus. Whilst there I had he handling kit fitted, what a revelation. Feels like a different car.
dahume said:
Yes it's the Volante. Lovely car but a little soft. The short ride back to London confirmed it was money well spent.
Amazing isn't it... 
I initially changed mine to H&R springs which were a nice improvement but I didn't even realise that the chassis was compromised until it was sorted with the handling kit. I was also lucky anough to get the BR switchable suspension fitted at the same time, car felt like a scalpel by comparison to how it was before - which wasn't actually bad in the first place!
Edited by yeti on Wednesday 2nd January 16:47
Tony V12V said:
Tried it this morning - Light was out within 4-5 seconds MAX - Seems a LOT longer when you sit there cranking. But this was first time I have actually checked properly (not timed it - just counted slowly). Dont forget V8 is dry sumped so different oil supply method to V12.
A bit late with an update... but 6 seconds of cranking before the light went out 
Asked Mike about the switchable suspension when I was there. I've had it on other cars and after the initial novelty found that I rarely used it. If you don't mind me asking do you find that you still use it day to day? Took the car for a blast yesterday, came back grinning ear to ear.
dahume said:
do you find that you still use it day to day?
If I'm going to work on the south circular, then no, it stays in soft mode. Out and about I switch it a lot depending on the roads and my speed. The best use is driving to a 'run' with it set to soft. Then switching to firm for the actual fast run and then back to soft for the journey home on the motorway. Like having 2 different cars, I absolutely love it.
The firm setting makes turn-in so much sharper, seems to give additional rear end grip (by keeping better tyre contact?) and just makes everything feel so much more immediate. Then switch it back to have a wonderfully smooth, relaxing car to drive home or cover huge motorway distances.
If I sober up tomorrow... A New Years Day drive is in order!
Problem with BR lightweight flywheel and starter
I've been getting a short squeak on cold starts, which I guessed was a noisy belt - didn't think much of it, but had it looked at when car was at the dealer for other things.
They said it was caused by the starter not engaging properly with the flywheel (or something like that), but didn't want to touch it (understandably) as it was a BR flywheel.
The car starts fine (this has been going on for longer than I want to admit to!), but I have a couple of questions:
Is it likely to be doing any damage? It will be a while before I have time to drive up to BR. I'd like to get the exhaust and manifolds done this year too, and it would be good to get them done at the same time, but don't want to leave it too long if it's going to break something.
Is it likely to fail, and stop the engine turning over? I guess not as it's been happening a while, but I'm, not sure what the issue is.
Cheers.
Steve
I've been getting a short squeak on cold starts, which I guessed was a noisy belt - didn't think much of it, but had it looked at when car was at the dealer for other things.
They said it was caused by the starter not engaging properly with the flywheel (or something like that), but didn't want to touch it (understandably) as it was a BR flywheel.
The car starts fine (this has been going on for longer than I want to admit to!), but I have a couple of questions:
Is it likely to be doing any damage? It will be a while before I have time to drive up to BR. I'd like to get the exhaust and manifolds done this year too, and it would be good to get them done at the same time, but don't want to leave it too long if it's going to break something.
Is it likely to fail, and stop the engine turning over? I guess not as it's been happening a while, but I'm, not sure what the issue is.
Cheers.
Steve
GlynV8 said:
Have you phoned to speak to Mike at BR? I would have though that he is best able to advise. Others would just be speculating.
Not yet, but I thought someone at BR read this forum?If I don't hear anything in a day or two I'll call, but I'm sure they're busy after the new year, and I'm not really in a hurry.
- Steve
Hi Steve.
It’s OK, I don’t expect dealers to understand our magic…
The upgraded exhaust on ROBGT’s car was supposed to have lost loads of torque, put error lights on the dash and be the cause of global warming, freezing and famine. I am used to their ‘envy’ but did they worry you into thinking there was a “problem” warranting bold letters though?? seemingly without giving you proper diagnosis, removal of starter and examination of contact wear…. that just isn’t cricket…. (anybody can remove starter for a look no matter the flywheel fitted behind it to the engine – takes no time or effort…!!)
Test:
Press the throttle pedal fully and crank / try to start the engine (it won’t due to full pedal press disabling injection).
Cranking the engine with door open and head as low as you can get whilst leaning outside;
a) Is the noise / “squeak” present before or as engine starts to spin only?
b) Or does the noise disappear after a few revolutions?
c) Or as you continue to crank, say for 10 seconds, does the noise remain or even does it get any worse?
d) Or in fact does the noise disappear whilst cranking – if so when?
e) Are there any noises after cranking has stopped?
You say from cold starts only??
So if you do the test above from cold without allowing the engine to start, say repeat it 3 times, then start engine and allow it to warm fully and repeat the test procedure - are the results any different??
It sounds unlikely there is any cause to concern or any long term damage / risk present, the sorts of sounds that do damage are mechanical / rattles / clonks and bangs.
If the starter motor is failing then yes, it could stop altogether one day but that is nothing to do with the flywheel upgrade – starters fail on Aston’s like they do any other car.
Let me know the results of these tests and I will advise from there
It’s OK, I don’t expect dealers to understand our magic…
The upgraded exhaust on ROBGT’s car was supposed to have lost loads of torque, put error lights on the dash and be the cause of global warming, freezing and famine. I am used to their ‘envy’ but did they worry you into thinking there was a “problem” warranting bold letters though?? seemingly without giving you proper diagnosis, removal of starter and examination of contact wear…. that just isn’t cricket…. (anybody can remove starter for a look no matter the flywheel fitted behind it to the engine – takes no time or effort…!!)
Test:
Press the throttle pedal fully and crank / try to start the engine (it won’t due to full pedal press disabling injection).
Cranking the engine with door open and head as low as you can get whilst leaning outside;
a) Is the noise / “squeak” present before or as engine starts to spin only?
b) Or does the noise disappear after a few revolutions?
c) Or as you continue to crank, say for 10 seconds, does the noise remain or even does it get any worse?
d) Or in fact does the noise disappear whilst cranking – if so when?
e) Are there any noises after cranking has stopped?
You say from cold starts only??
So if you do the test above from cold without allowing the engine to start, say repeat it 3 times, then start engine and allow it to warm fully and repeat the test procedure - are the results any different??
It sounds unlikely there is any cause to concern or any long term damage / risk present, the sorts of sounds that do damage are mechanical / rattles / clonks and bangs.
If the starter motor is failing then yes, it could stop altogether one day but that is nothing to do with the flywheel upgrade – starters fail on Aston’s like they do any other car.
Let me know the results of these tests and I will advise from there
I'm certainly not going to try and correct anything Mike has mentioned above, but once the engine has fully warmed up, doesn't the "throttle to the floor" disabling method no longer function?
From past experience and that of others it seems to only disable actual starting when cold.
I found this out the hard way after fitting a new drive belt and wanted to spin the starter only to make sure the belt was seated fully, of course as the engine was still warm as I pressed the throttle fully, followed by the start button and WHOOSH! a sudden surge of revs as the V12 came to life and quickly headed for the red line.
Of course if this also now works when warm on newer models, exactly when did this change?
Just trying to prevent anyone having the same sudden start as I and others have had also.
From past experience and that of others it seems to only disable actual starting when cold.
I found this out the hard way after fitting a new drive belt and wanted to spin the starter only to make sure the belt was seated fully, of course as the engine was still warm as I pressed the throttle fully, followed by the start button and WHOOSH! a sudden surge of revs as the V12 came to life and quickly headed for the red line.
Of course if this also now works when warm on newer models, exactly when did this change?
Just trying to prevent anyone having the same sudden start as I and others have had also.
Thanks for your response Mike. Only just saw your message this afternoon, but did the test just now.
a) The squeak only happens just as the engine is firing up, for a second or less - didn't get it all while cranking with the pedal down full.
b) I would guess it goes within a few revolutions, but it only happens when the engine fires, not when cranking, or stopping cranking without firing.
c) and d) There's nothing unusual when cranking.
e) It sounds normal to me when I stop cranking, if the engine doesn't fire.
I let the engine run til it was idling at about 8-900 RPM, then switched off and fired up again, the noise was just about audible with the door open, but very brief, maybe 1/10th of a second. I would have missed it if the door was shut I think.
Cheers,
Steve
a) The squeak only happens just as the engine is firing up, for a second or less - didn't get it all while cranking with the pedal down full.
b) I would guess it goes within a few revolutions, but it only happens when the engine fires, not when cranking, or stopping cranking without firing.
c) and d) There's nothing unusual when cranking.
e) It sounds normal to me when I stop cranking, if the engine doesn't fire.
I let the engine run til it was idling at about 8-900 RPM, then switched off and fired up again, the noise was just about audible with the door open, but very brief, maybe 1/10th of a second. I would have missed it if the door was shut I think.
Cheers,
Steve
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