New BMW's getting stolen using blank BMW keys

[Lunja]

Hi all,

I've just read through around 20 pages but not seen a definitive answer to my questions. I'm looking to lease an F20 118d and would like to know:

1. Is the current F20 118d vulnerable to the OBD key programming exploit?
2. If so, have any been reported as stolen using the technique?
3. Do BMW have a warranted, proven solution, that doesn't involve simply recoding the car's software? I ask this as I'm conscious that any software-based solution could be hacked in the 3 years I have the car on lease.

If the answers are Yes, Yes,, No then I'll soon be a customer of Audi. Thanks in advance.

Edited by Lunja on Monday 1st April 22:47

[Doink]

Lunja said:

Hi all,

I've just read through around 20 pages but not seen a definitive answer to my questions. I'm looking to lease an F20 118d and would like to know:

1. Is the current F20 118d vulnerable to the OBD key programming vulnerability?
2. If so, have any been reported as stolen using the technique?
3. Do BMW have a warranted, proven solution, that doesn't involve simply recoding the car's software? I ask this as I'm conciuos that any software-based solution could be hacked in the 3 years I have the car on lease.

If the answers are Yes, No, No then I'll soon be a customer of Audi. Thanks in advance.

Friday 22nd March quote quote all
Swervin_Mervin said:
Just to get this straight - does the update do anything other than code out the window drop from the key?

Mr Bimmer said:
The updated Cas file means an old key needs to be present in the slot. The window drop is just coding


From what i've read Mr Bimmer seems to have his finger on the pulse and sounds like he has dealer connections

[_Nathan_]

I've just noticed this stolen recovered M3 on a salvage auction.

What do you reckon they have done to it ? Tried to remove a tracker ?

[TheEnd]

Maybe they swapped the ECU and CAS to a working set from a different car.

[Lunja]

Doink said:

Friday 22nd March quote quote all
Swervin_Mervin said:
Just to get this straight - does the update do anything other than code out the window drop from the key?

Mr Bimmer said:
The updated Cas file means an old key needs to be present in the slot. The window drop is just coding


From what i've read Mr Bimmer seems to have his finger on the pulse and sounds like he has dealer connections

Hhmmm - so the only BMW-waranted solution at the moment is to update the CAS file, rather than change the alarm sensitivity around the blackspot near the OBD port or to move/disable the port itself? I'm doing my best to justify an F20 lease but BMW are making it difficult when this vulnerabillity is still present.

[chrisx666]

Lunja said:

Hhmmm - so the only BMW-waranted solution at the moment is to update the CAS file, rather than change the alarm sensitivity around the blackspot near the OBD port or to move/disable the port itself? I'm doing my best to justify an F20 lease but BMW are making it difficult when this vulnerabillity is still present.

I don't think your question was answered clearly. The 'F' series cars do not have the vulnerability that is being discussed in this thread.

[aeropilot]

_Nathan_ said:

What do you reckon they have done to it ? Tried to remove a tracker ?

Yup, looking for a Tracker most likely.

[Lunja]

chrisx666 said:

I don't think your question was answered clearly. The 'F' series cars do not have the vulnerability that is being discussed in this thread.

Ah, well that changes things significantly. My understanding of the vulnerability is that a window can be forced open and a small computer plugged into the OBD port (without the alarm being triggered) that will flash a blank key with the info needed to unlock the car and drive it away. Just to be doubly sure (before I go and sign a three year lease!), the F20 series cars DON'T have this vulnerability, nor any other that makes them easy to be stolen?

[pavul]

Hey guys,
Looks like all the rumours about how easy to steel a BMW are true......just had my BMW 1 series stolen last night. Bought it less than two months ago (second hand), had both keys at home, woke up in the morning - car gone, keys in my table drawer, no glass in driveway and haven't heard a damn alarm at night neither!! that was my first BMW, and really loved it to bits, but seriously, no more BMW's for me, especially after what I've read here.

[TX1]

Not rumours as you have unfortunately found out.
What model 1 was it and year ?

[BE57 TOY]

pavul said:

Hey guys,
Looks like all the rumours about how easy to steel a BMW are true......just had my BMW 1 series stolen last night. Bought it less than two months ago (second hand), had both keys at home, woke up in the morning - car gone, keys in my table drawer, no glass in driveway and haven't heard a damn alarm at night neither!! that was my first BMW, and really loved it to bits, but seriously, no more BMW's for me, especially after what I've read here.

Oh dear. Was it an M Sport?


:-(

[stuart-b]

Guys what do you think of this? Seems to be an ODBII port locker

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/04/autocyb-car-f...

[Tim330]

stuart-b said:

Guys what do you think of this? Seems to be an ODBII port locker

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/04/autocyb-car-f...

As it locks onto the port itself it looks better than the alternative locking cover that has been posted earlier in this thread. The OBD port cover could probably be dispatched with a large screwdriver whereas this looks like the thief would have to cut the wire & wire up a new port which seems less likely. Says it doesn't ship outside the US though

[youngsyr]

Tim330 said:

stuart-b said:

Guys what do you think of this? Seems to be an ODBII port locker

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/04/autocyb-car-f...

As it locks onto the port itself it looks better than the alternative locking cover that has been posted earlier in this thread. The OBD port cover could probably be dispatched with a large screwdriver whereas this looks like the thief would have to cut the wire & wire up a new port which seems less likely. Says it doesn't ship outside the US though

It's no more effective than having the security update done though, is it?

The way I see it is you need a strong visible/audio deterrant (stickers won't do it, I'm afraid) that tells would-be thieving scumbags that your car isn't an easy target, as well as the security update (and stickers if you like) as a fall back.

This is the only way to stop thieves drilling your door lock/smashing your window and causing all sorts of other damage gaining access to the car to see if they can programme a key.

Thieves don't care about what damage they do to your car, all they care about is whether they're likely to get caught. The absence of an alarm upgrade in the update means that they can still try to programme a key at their leisure. So you need either an upgraded alarm or disklok whenever the car is somewhere vulnerable.

[t8cmf]

youngsyr said:

This is the only way to stop thieves drilling your door lock

What lock?



For those looking to put another stumbling block in the way of thieving scumbags do what I did above. I fitted a delock part to my drivers side door on my E92 M3. This is not a cover but a complete barrel replacement. Fit it in conjunction with the security update.

The entire barrel can be removed via a couple of captive allen bolts and the new part just fits in its place. This is for a pre LCI E92 M3 so you will have to research the lock specifics of your own car. For those wondering what happens if your battery goes flat my car has the old style mechanical key release on the boot so I can access the battery compartment and also drop the rear seats from the boot. I believe BMW's after that may have the electrical release fitted.

Mine was sourced and painted in Alpine White for £25.

[youngsyr]

t8cmf said:

What lock?



For those looking to put another stumbling block in the way of thieving scumbags do what I did above. I fitted a delock part to my drivers side door on my E92 M3. This is not a cover but a complete barrel replacement. Fit it in conjunction with the security update.

The entire barrel can be removed via a couple of captive allen bolts and the new part just fits in its place. This is for a pre LCI E92 M3 so you will have to research the lock specifics of your own car. For those wondering what happens if your battery goes flat my car has the old style mechanical key release on the boot so I can access the battery compartment and also drop the rear seats from the boot. I believe BMW's after that may have the electrical release fitted.

Mine was sourced and painted in Alpine White for £25.

Sorry to keep bleating on about it and to be so pessimistic, but what makes you think that will stop a thief just breaking the window instead?

These scumbags don't think like us; all they see is a big stack of cash sitting there waiting for them to take it and they won't let trivial stuff like a blank door lock stand in their way.

Good work on taking precautions though, I just don't think you should rely on that alone.

[paulmoonraker]

youngsyr said:

t8cmf said:

What lock?



For those looking to put another stumbling block in the way of thieving scumbags do what I did above. I fitted a delock part to my drivers side door on my E92 M3. This is not a cover but a complete barrel replacement. Fit it in conjunction with the security update.

The entire barrel can be removed via a couple of captive allen bolts and the new part just fits in its place. This is for a pre LCI E92 M3 so you will have to research the lock specifics of your own car. For those wondering what happens if your battery goes flat my car has the old style mechanical key release on the boot so I can access the battery compartment and also drop the rear seats from the boot. I believe BMW's after that may have the electrical release fitted.

Mine was sourced and painted in Alpine White for £25.

Sorry to keep bleating on about it and to be so pessimistic, but what makes you think that will stop a thief just breaking the window instead?

These scumbags don't think like us; all they see is a big stack of cash sitting there waiting for them to take it and they won't let trivial stuff like a blank door lock stand in their way.

Good work on taking precautions though, I just don't think you should rely on that alone.

This type of crime is 'organised'. Don't make the mistake of thinking they don't weigh up risk, check cars out before hand, and are generally unintelligent. I would guess that the amount of opportunistic theft is quite low using this key cloning technique.

[t8cmf]

youngsyr said:

Sorry to keep bleating on about it and to be so pessimistic, but what makes you think that will stop a thief just breaking the window instead?

I think you have completely and utterly missed my point.

Nobody is saying they won't smash a window. Nobody is saying they won't attempt to steal the car. The delock is just one in a number of security measures that my car has fitted to it. It's designed to be another stumbling block that is all.

I'm sure you are aware that if you ram a screwdriver into a door lock that does NOT have the security update fitted then you can drop the windows with ease. If thieves approach my car and see my car is delocked maybe they will wonder what else I have fitted as its not a normal mod by any stretch. Maybe it will make them think twice....you never know.

It will never be a primary security upgrade, just another one to add to the list.

For £25 sourced, painted and fitted its not going to break the bank is it?

Missed my point entirely.

[youngsyr]

t8cmf said:

youngsyr said:

Sorry to keep bleating on about it and to be so pessimistic, but what makes you think that will stop a thief just breaking the window instead?

I think you have completely and utterly missed my point.

Nobody is saying they won't smash a window. Nobody is saying they won't attempt to steal the car. The delock is just one in a number of security measures that my car has fitted to it. It's designed to be another stumbling block that is all.

I'm sure you are aware that if you ram a screwdriver into a door lock that does NOT have the security update fitted then you can drop the windows with ease. If thieves approach my car and see my car is delocked maybe they will wonder what else I have fitted as its not a normal mod by any stretch. Maybe it will make them think twice....you never know.

It will never be a primary security upgrade, just another one to add to the list.

For £25 sourced, painted and fitted its not going to break the bank is it?

Missed my point entirely.

Please don't take my post personally, I just know from experience that superficial upgrades won't stop a thief trying to take the car and making a mess of it in the process, even if they ultimately can't steal it.

I would imagine that a thief would take one look at a blanked lock, think: "haven't seen that before", then smash the window on the assumption that the alarm is as poor on other E series BMWs.

Unfortunately it costs them nothing - they already have their escaped planned well in advance (with or without the car), so even if the alarm goes off, which in their experience it rarely (if ever) does, they haven't lost anything.

On the other hand, they stand to gain £XX,000 if they do get your car.

Like I wrote above, I commend you taking precautions, but I wouldn't rely on a blanked lock at all, it would have to be an upgraded alarm with proximity warning or a disklok whenever the car is parked somewhere even remotely vulnerable, plus the security update as a back up.

[youngsyr]

paulmoonraker said:

This type of crime is 'organised'. Don't make the mistake of thinking they don't weigh up risk, check cars out before hand, and are generally unintelligent. I would guess that the amount of opportunistic theft is quite low using this key cloning technique.

I don't think they're unorganised, not even for a second. They know exactly what they're doing, which is unfortunately why I suggest making it abundently clear that your car isn't a soft target whenever it's vulnerable.

Stickers and blanked locks on their own won't hold these guys up for more than a few seconds.