Adaptive suspension , yes or no ? ( new 3 series )
Discussion
I am in the process of specifying a replacement 3 series touring for my wife .
Car will be a 320D x drive touring , M sport derivative .
I was wondering what the benefits were of the active suspension .
She currently has a 10 plate version of the last model , M sport on run flats so any comparisons to that would be useful .
Car will be a 320D x drive touring , M sport derivative .
I was wondering what the benefits were of the active suspension .
She currently has a 10 plate version of the last model , M sport on run flats so any comparisons to that would be useful .
Just come back from a 4hr test drive in a 328i Touring M-Sport.
It had the standard suspension and coming from an Audi with adaptive, the BMW adaptive would have to be really good too justify the money over the standard.
The touring we drove had the optional 19" wheels and the ride and body control was superb. Just bear in mind that the X-Drive add's 10mm to the ride height as well, so it looks a little different.
It had the standard suspension and coming from an Audi with adaptive, the BMW adaptive would have to be really good too justify the money over the standard.
The touring we drove had the optional 19" wheels and the ride and body control was superb. Just bear in mind that the X-Drive add's 10mm to the ride height as well, so it looks a little different.
I've just picked up my new 320d Sport. All the internet wisdom I found before I ordered said it was a "must have". I read reports of the standard car being a bit soft. I didn't get the opportunity to do a back-to-back test, so rather than take the risk, I ticked the box. As said above, it isn't a hugely expensive option. In the limited time I've had to play today, you can definitely feel the difference between Comfort & Sport.
One thing I didn't do was specify bigger wheels. The standard car comes with 17s, but the car I test drove was on 18s, and I could feel a level of harshness through the steering wheel that was, to me, unacceptable on a daily driver. I'm glad I saved the £540, as the 17s give you all the feel, but not the harshness.
One thing I didn't do was specify bigger wheels. The standard car comes with 17s, but the car I test drove was on 18s, and I could feel a level of harshness through the steering wheel that was, to me, unacceptable on a daily driver. I'm glad I saved the £540, as the 17s give you all the feel, but not the harshness.
I had an hours test drive in a 330 f31 m sport with adaptive suspension and TBH I wasn't amazingly impressed. Coming from an e91 m sport, I found comfort too soft and wallowy, and sport not hard enough. Granted the ride was more resolved than my car, but overall I found the f31 not involving enough and getting back into my e91 the car felt alive in comparison...
... this weekend however I had a very brief ride in an f31 328i m sport on 19s and standard m sport suspension and it was great-much closer to my e91. But I will say that I do like a nice firm ride...
... lastly, if I were buying an m135i the adaptive suspension in that was much better...
I'm sure I've confused things a little, but these are my thoughts :-)
... this weekend however I had a very brief ride in an f31 328i m sport on 19s and standard m sport suspension and it was great-much closer to my e91. But I will say that I do like a nice firm ride...
... lastly, if I were buying an m135i the adaptive suspension in that was much better...
I'm sure I've confused things a little, but these are my thoughts :-)
After reading reviews it was originally a must have for me too but the car I tested (a Sport in 18s) felt great without it. Much more compliant than my old MSport but without losing much of the edge.
In the end I dropped it. Mainly for budget reasons (ordered an xdrive with other toys in the end) but I also had a nagging doubt about reliability. That shouldn't be an issue with a new car warranty of course but all 3 dealers I was playing off on price suggested I'd be better off without it. Maybe coincidence but it was enough to plant a seed of doubt
In the end I dropped it. Mainly for budget reasons (ordered an xdrive with other toys in the end) but I also had a nagging doubt about reliability. That shouldn't be an issue with a new car warranty of course but all 3 dealers I was playing off on price suggested I'd be better off without it. Maybe coincidence but it was enough to plant a seed of doubt
Interesting thoughts. I'm on the brink of ordering a lease F31 330d M sport with the adaptive suspension. I've not test driven (tbh won't have time and don't wanna waste that much time in ordering). I have an E61 SE on standard suspension which is a little soft for excitement. But the A3 S Line quattro 3.2 I'm ridding myself of is a pretty horrible ride. So harsh on bumps and so mind-numbing after any extended motorway journey. I've promised myself never another VAG...
I think given what I've read the adaptive would be the perfect thing for my wife & motorway (comfort) and country roads and me (sport)
I think given what I've read the adaptive would be the perfect thing for my wife & motorway (comfort) and country roads and me (sport)
I think this is where some of the confusion arises about adaptive suspension. The settings are not static, the suspension remains adaptive throughout. The settings just change the transition points which determine how firm the suspension will be under road conditions. For example in comfort mode things will still firm up if you throw the car aggressively into a corner, or in sport it will still try and dampen the effects of a big pot hole to some extent. To give you an example I was driving in comfort mode and came across an object in the road which I had to suddenly swerve to avoid, the adaptive suspension responded by switching to much firmer settings mitigating the negative aspects you'd normally experience from a comfort orientated suspension setup in such a circumstance.
IMO this is what throws people when they try and evaluate it in the manner they would a passive suspension setup.
Having said all that, I've got it because my car was a dealer specd pre-reg. I generally drive on decent roads (really, they do still exist in the uk :O). So while its nice to have, it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, as I could cope quite happily with the standard M Sport suspension on most BMWs. I'd rather spend my options budget on stuff like the HUD if it really was an either or decision. I'd also be concerned by the potential repair costs if I kept the car outside the 3 year warranty period. Unlike soft close doors etc, adaptive suspension isn't something you can just turn off if it goes wrong
IMO this is what throws people when they try and evaluate it in the manner they would a passive suspension setup.
Having said all that, I've got it because my car was a dealer specd pre-reg. I generally drive on decent roads (really, they do still exist in the uk :O). So while its nice to have, it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, as I could cope quite happily with the standard M Sport suspension on most BMWs. I'd rather spend my options budget on stuff like the HUD if it really was an either or decision. I'd also be concerned by the potential repair costs if I kept the car outside the 3 year warranty period. Unlike soft close doors etc, adaptive suspension isn't something you can just turn off if it goes wrong
I'm on the 'no' camp. I have standard M Sport on my F20 and its perfectly fine for every day use on 18" gen 3 run flats.
I know ride comfort is a subjective thing but I really think its more than acceptible. In fact, it could do with being a bit firmer.
Some people (in other threads on BMW specific forums) who have driven both say that standard M Sport is better than the Sport setting in the adaptive version, and that having specced adaptive they generally leave it in one setting all the time anyway.
Maybe the money it costs is worth your peace of mind, but if you decide to spend your cash elsewhere then I don't think you should worry about having a bone-shattering ride as a result. Its simply not the case with the latest generation BMWs unless you order ridiculous wheels.
I know ride comfort is a subjective thing but I really think its more than acceptible. In fact, it could do with being a bit firmer.
Some people (in other threads on BMW specific forums) who have driven both say that standard M Sport is better than the Sport setting in the adaptive version, and that having specced adaptive they generally leave it in one setting all the time anyway.
Maybe the money it costs is worth your peace of mind, but if you decide to spend your cash elsewhere then I don't think you should worry about having a bone-shattering ride as a result. Its simply not the case with the latest generation BMWs unless you order ridiculous wheels.
Mine is wearing 20s which many may put in the ridiculous bracket and having also driven one with standard MSport suspension I found that acceptable aswell. As you said it subjective and also based on the condition of the roads you regularly drive on.
As per my previous post, I'd highlight that even people that always drive in one setting for the Adaptive suspension will be deriving benefit from it over a standard setup. Each mode is not a static suspension setup, the suspension remains adaptive at all times.
To give you an analogy, its the difference between going out with a placid woman or one with a temper. They will both switch between the range of states between happy and angry. However, given the same effort from you, each will tend towards different sides of that range of emotions.
As per my previous post, I'd highlight that even people that always drive in one setting for the Adaptive suspension will be deriving benefit from it over a standard setup. Each mode is not a static suspension setup, the suspension remains adaptive at all times.
To give you an analogy, its the difference between going out with a placid woman or one with a temper. They will both switch between the range of states between happy and angry. However, given the same effort from you, each will tend towards different sides of that range of emotions.
I detected no semblance of dynamic intelligence in the F20 adaptive but I'll bow to your greater experience! I guess the effects are subtle or perhaps didnt arise in my 3 day trial.
Talking hypothetically...if - as anecdotal evidence suggests - the Sport setting in the Adaptive is softer than the standard M Sport, then there's another argument against its benefits if the personal preference is towards the 'sporting' over the 'comfort'. I'd certainly not want suspension softer than my standard M Sport as I already think the body control could be better.
I digress, apols OP.
Talking hypothetically...if - as anecdotal evidence suggests - the Sport setting in the Adaptive is softer than the standard M Sport, then there's another argument against its benefits if the personal preference is towards the 'sporting' over the 'comfort'. I'd certainly not want suspension softer than my standard M Sport as I already think the body control could be better.
I digress, apols OP.
http://www.bmw.com/com/en/insights/technology/tech...
That's the blurb for adaptive drive, there are links for the other variants aswell (IE just EDC, dynamic drive, etc). As you can see from the blurb the settings are not static, the car will constantly calculate and adjust for road conditions. Stick it in comfort and it will have a slant towards comfort, but will stiften up if needed. I've given an example in my previous post from personal experience.
If you were appraising it with the assumption the modes were all static suspension setups, you may not have picked up on the dynamic aspects of adaptive suspension. I'm not sure the range of conditions you tried the car in and various styles of driving, transitions in driving style etc. If you get another chance to test it, try the example I have previously given (assuming its safe to do so of course).
WRT people's comments about the merits (or lack off) of adaptive suspension I noted they were generally in line with wether one opted for it or not. Those that specd it will often sing its praises, those that didnt will suggest its a waste of money. IMO if you're happy with M Sport on the roads you generally drive, don't bother trying an adaptive equipped car. If you aren't then give it a shot. It wouldn't be at the top of my list of options as generally I drive on decent roads. But I also wouldn't put it at the bottom of the list or classify it as without any merit.
That's the blurb for adaptive drive, there are links for the other variants aswell (IE just EDC, dynamic drive, etc). As you can see from the blurb the settings are not static, the car will constantly calculate and adjust for road conditions. Stick it in comfort and it will have a slant towards comfort, but will stiften up if needed. I've given an example in my previous post from personal experience.
If you were appraising it with the assumption the modes were all static suspension setups, you may not have picked up on the dynamic aspects of adaptive suspension. I'm not sure the range of conditions you tried the car in and various styles of driving, transitions in driving style etc. If you get another chance to test it, try the example I have previously given (assuming its safe to do so of course).
WRT people's comments about the merits (or lack off) of adaptive suspension I noted they were generally in line with wether one opted for it or not. Those that specd it will often sing its praises, those that didnt will suggest its a waste of money. IMO if you're happy with M Sport on the roads you generally drive, don't bother trying an adaptive equipped car. If you aren't then give it a shot. It wouldn't be at the top of my list of options as generally I drive on decent roads. But I also wouldn't put it at the bottom of the list or classify it as without any merit.
Edited by 5to1 on Wednesday 6th March 19:51
Well I currently have a brand new 320d M Sport on the drive .( loan car )
it doesn't have adaptive suspension but ( at my request ) it does have the larger optional wheels .
I have to say having driven it on a mixture of roads all day today I think it's fine . slightly more refined than the current 10 plate car we have , doesn't bang and crash over bad surfaces and rides speed humps much better than my Porsche with adaptive suspension . yes I know that's not really a valid comparison .....
The auto box shows a distinct difference in character between comfort and sport , not sure I would want to drive it in sport all the time which means if I had adaptive dampers I would be driving round in comfort most of the time .
I note what's been said about it being adaptive all the time but on balance I think I am going to go with the standard passive system .
Reading most of the road tests they seem to favour the adaptive but I haven't seen a test on an M Sport yet , maybe the standard suspension benefits more from the slightly firmer ( at times ) adaptive set up whereas if applied to the M sport it takes it the other way ,
Now what shall I spend that £500 on ?!!
it doesn't have adaptive suspension but ( at my request ) it does have the larger optional wheels .
I have to say having driven it on a mixture of roads all day today I think it's fine . slightly more refined than the current 10 plate car we have , doesn't bang and crash over bad surfaces and rides speed humps much better than my Porsche with adaptive suspension . yes I know that's not really a valid comparison .....
The auto box shows a distinct difference in character between comfort and sport , not sure I would want to drive it in sport all the time which means if I had adaptive dampers I would be driving round in comfort most of the time .
I note what's been said about it being adaptive all the time but on balance I think I am going to go with the standard passive system .
Reading most of the road tests they seem to favour the adaptive but I haven't seen a test on an M Sport yet , maybe the standard suspension benefits more from the slightly firmer ( at times ) adaptive set up whereas if applied to the M sport it takes it the other way ,
Now what shall I spend that £500 on ?!!
curley said:
The auto box shows a distinct difference in character between comfort and sport , not sure I would want to drive it in sport all the time which means if I had adaptive dampers I would be driving round in comfort most of the time .
Now what shall I spend that £500 on ?!!
You can specify wether drive train, suspension, or both change in each mode. So you could set sport mode to leave the drive train in comfort mode.Now what shall I spend that £500 on ?!!
WRT the £500 burning a hole in your options budget, I'd tick the HUD box if you haven't already : D (although I guess its more then £500
)Edited by 5to1 on Wednesday 6th March 20:03
mzaalam said:
Thanks for that - sometimes it's hard to find a nice balanced opinion on here!
NP, I found the lack of diversity in dealer demonstrators a royal pain in the ***when I was trying to decide on my must have options. Even in London it was like pulling teeth to get behind the wheel of cars with and without Adaptive suspension. Having read the various forums I could see that I was not alone. So it was especially disappointing the forum debates were so polarised along the lines of users own spec.5to1 said:
NP, I found the lack of diversity in dealer demonstrators a royal pain in the ***when I was trying to decide on my must have options. Even in London it was like pulling teeth to get behind the wheel of cars with and without Adaptive suspension. Having read the various forums I could see that I was not alone. So it was especially disappointing the forum debates were so polarised along the lines of users own spec.
You're spot on. All the reviews seem to be based on having the adaptive suspension yet the dealerships don't seem to have the right cars around at all. On a separate note, I can't believe that BMW still don't put in navigation and dimming flipping mirrors in as standard when it's £38k for a basic 330d M sport. It just means people spend their 'extras' money on some of those 'basics' rather than the interesting kit bmw would want to be selling more of.
mzaalam said:
You're spot on. All the reviews seem to be based on having the adaptive suspension yet the dealerships don't seem to have the right cars around at all.
On a separate note, I can't believe that BMW still don't put in navigation and dimming flipping mirrors in as standard when it's £38k for a basic 330d M sport. It just means people spend their 'extras' money on some of those 'basics' rather than the interesting kit bmw would want to be selling more of.
Next they'll charge you for a spare wheel....... Oh wait On a separate note, I can't believe that BMW still don't put in navigation and dimming flipping mirrors in as standard when it's £38k for a basic 330d M sport. It just means people spend their 'extras' money on some of those 'basics' rather than the interesting kit bmw would want to be selling more of.
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