High mileage N47 without problems (120D, 320D, 520D etc)
Discussion
In contrast to all the internet based horror stories, my 123d is on 103k, is going very well and has been a great little car. If it breaks I'll fix it, keep on using it and that's that.
I remember when I had an Impreza every single one was supposed to have chocolate engine components and when I had a 996 every single engine was a ticking time bomb, well not in my experience they weren't. Internet stories are often just that, occasionally with a little truth mixed in somewhere, but at some point it becomes generally accepted as 'truth' often by those who will just believe what they read on the internet.
Oh, and BTW I have a TVR (with a speed 6 engine) that has NEVER gone wrong, despite the internet
I remember when I had an Impreza every single one was supposed to have chocolate engine components and when I had a 996 every single engine was a ticking time bomb, well not in my experience they weren't. Internet stories are often just that, occasionally with a little truth mixed in somewhere, but at some point it becomes generally accepted as 'truth' often by those who will just believe what they read on the internet.
Oh, and BTW I have a TVR (with a speed 6 engine) that has NEVER gone wrong, despite the internet
Flying machine said:
In contrast to all the internet based horror stories, my 123d is on 103k, is going very well and has been a great little car. If it breaks I'll fix it, keep on using it and that's that.
I remember when I had an Impreza every single one was supposed to have chocolate engine components and when I had a 996 every single engine was a ticking time bomb, well not in my experience they weren't. Internet stories are often just that, occasionally with a little truth mixed in somewhere, but at some point it becomes generally accepted as 'truth' often by those who will just believe what they read on the internet.
Oh, and BTW I have a TVR (with a speed 6 engine) that has NEVER gone wrong, despite the internet
...and the ones that are going well on the internet are internet stories as well dont forget ,probably from BMW workers.I remember when I had an Impreza every single one was supposed to have chocolate engine components and when I had a 996 every single engine was a ticking time bomb, well not in my experience they weren't. Internet stories are often just that, occasionally with a little truth mixed in somewhere, but at some point it becomes generally accepted as 'truth' often by those who will just believe what they read on the internet.
Oh, and BTW I have a TVR (with a speed 6 engine) that has NEVER gone wrong, despite the internet
.........only joking ok.
va1o said:
You could just get an aftermarket warranty. I've heard good things about the official BMW warranty and it should pick up any failures. Costs you a bit now but it gives you peace of mind.
I could, but over the last 10 years or so I've found it cheaper over time to self-insure and just keep an emergency fund invested case it's needed. Most insurance companies aren't really interested in providing warranties in things past 100K anyway. It'd only take a month or so to get the engine rebuilt and although this is the main daily driver I have other cars I can use if I need them. There's one here that's just sold with 212,000 miles on it...
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/b...
... and I really can't see any reason why mine won't be still going in another five years' time.
Edited by Lowtimer on Saturday 28th September 14:08
Lowtimer said:
I could, but over the last 10 years or so I've found it cheaper over time to self-insure and just keep an emergency fund invested case it's needed. Most insurance companies aren't really interested in providing warranties in things past 100K anyway. It'd only take a month or so to get the engine rebuilt and although this is the main daily driver I have other cars I can use if I need them.
Fair enough I guess that approach works too, but have to bear in mind a rebuild would run well into 4 figures. Lowtimer said:
There's one here that's just sold with 212,000 miles on it...
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/b...
... and I really can't see any reason why mine won't be still going in another five years' time.
How do you know it hasn't already had the chain fail and engine rebuilt? http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/b...
... and I really can't see any reason why mine won't be still going in another five years' time.
va1o said:
Fair enough I guess that approach works too, but have to bear in mind a rebuild would run well into 4 figures.
Not a problem. The depreciation on a new one would be much more. And I simply don't believe it's more than a few per cent chance of failure. Whereas the depreciation is an absolute total 100% certainty.va1o said:
How do you know it hasn't already had the chain fail and engine rebuilt?
As someone else said above, we had exactly this sort of internet-based excitement in the Porsche world with the 996 / Boxster water-cooled flat-six engines and their intermediate shafts. That was another case where "everyone knew" that they were all ticking time bomb, but the premature failure rate on those some years later has turned out to be in the single digits, percentage-wise, probably something in the rough area of 5%. Enough to make an absolutely huge, massive tidal wave amount of internet complaints, but still a 19 in 20 chance that any individual one was fine.
Edited by Lowtimer on Saturday 28th September 18:55
We had 2 2009 n47 cars, one did 96k the other 70k, standard BMW servicing, we had no noise of issues.
We have 2 2012 n47 cars, one had the chain replaced at 19k, due to it being audible over road noise at 60mph. Car has done another 14k and noise is returning. The other car has done 37k and it's also audible in the car.
We have 2 2012 n47 cars, one had the chain replaced at 19k, due to it being audible over road noise at 60mph. Car has done another 14k and noise is returning. The other car has done 37k and it's also audible in the car.
Good, specific factual data: thanks.
Interesting that both 2012s have done it, and at low mileage too, whereas both your high mileage older cars were OK.
Given that you have the same drivers, and (I imagine) very similar types of usage for all four cars, that rather suggests that some element of the design changes made for the later production may actually have made things worse rather than better.
Interesting that both 2012s have done it, and at low mileage too, whereas both your high mileage older cars were OK.
Given that you have the same drivers, and (I imagine) very similar types of usage for all four cars, that rather suggests that some element of the design changes made for the later production may actually have made things worse rather than better.
Lowtimer said:
Good, specific factual data: thanks.
Interesting that both 2012s have done it, and at low mileage too, whereas both your high mileage older cars were OK.
Given that you have the same drivers, and (I imagine) very similar types of usage for all four cars, that rather suggests that some element of the design changes made for the later production may actually have made things worse rather than better.
There's only one change, my commute is much shorter, and my car was the one with the chain replaced. I was doing 110 miles a day, but now do 10 (we do swap cars though to try and even out both cars mileage, as she still does 100 miles a day in hers).Interesting that both 2012s have done it, and at low mileage too, whereas both your high mileage older cars were OK.
Given that you have the same drivers, and (I imagine) very similar types of usage for all four cars, that rather suggests that some element of the design changes made for the later production may actually have made things worse rather than better.
I did read some suggestion that dpf regen was maybe part of the issue (bore wash putting diesel in the oil, which then thins the oil) but no proof ever found.
I wonder also if the 2012 car issue is sound proofing related, the 2012 cars are f20's whereas the 2009 were e87's. So we are hearing more through the cabin which has drawn attention to it.
It feels like the 2012 cars are flimsy in comparison to the older cars, and I wonder if design has changed somewhere to cut costs.
smashy said:
Dont do it. Get a 3 ltr if you must!!Your safe then.
Having looking into it some more, it turns out you aren't any safer with a 3.0 diesel than with a 2.0. A bit of googling shows that the 3.0 litre N57 engine has exactly the same rear mounted cam chain, and exactly the same wear / failure issues, as the 2.0 litre N47. It is less well publicised than the N57 issues because they sell something like 20 four-cylinder diesels for every six-cylinder diesels 3.0, so there are that many more four-pots out there.Edited by smashy on Saturday 28th September 00:11
Mind you, over on General Gassing today there's a bloke with a 3.2 litre Audi that's done exactly the same thing, and I was surprised to find that's a rear-mounted cam chain too.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Lowtimer said:
farbbm said:
IT1GTR said:
223k still going strong 
What model and age of BM have you got IT1GTR?
, just realized that as the car im on about is an e46 320d, I don't think it's the same lump.Yes, I think that's pretty much where I am on this.
I've always done premature oil changes as I don't think anything over 10,000 miles interval is sensible, so I'm planning to push on for at least another two or three years, say 160,000 miles, and see what the car feels like then. I do stay on top of it mechanically so at its current 100,000 miles it drives beautifully and the interior is still fresh, so really all it needs at the moment is a new windscreen: the current one is fairly hazy with tiny abrasions.
I've always done premature oil changes as I don't think anything over 10,000 miles interval is sensible, so I'm planning to push on for at least another two or three years, say 160,000 miles, and see what the car feels like then. I do stay on top of it mechanically so at its current 100,000 miles it drives beautifully and the interior is still fresh, so really all it needs at the moment is a new windscreen: the current one is fairly hazy with tiny abrasions.
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