535D, LCI, economy - remap needed?

[Welshbeef]

Vee said:

Do you ever read what you post ?
You've linked to a bloody pre LCI car at 35mpg.

This looks like the LCI

http://www.nextgreencar.com/view-car/3667/BMW-5-Se...

EIther way, the OPs mpg is far too low and there is probably something amiss with his car.
First point of call should be to check I operating temperatures - if it doesn't get near 88c it needs the thermostats looking at first. Checking the temps doesn't need any complicated equipment either iDrive or hidden menu should do it.

Given it shows the "Real mpg" as 36 its what he I'd getting.

[gizlaroc]

x12yhp said:

Sorry, I think the car is 2008.

The skoda was a superb 2012, 170BHP diesel. It supposedly will do 60 mpg and this is what I got over 20k mileage. On a 60mph motorway run, I would easily get 65 and sometimes in excess of 70mpg. So it annoys me immensely that the same driving style cannot get anywhere near to what BMW quote. I can be very confident that it IS possible to get the numbers quoted by Skoda so I am inclined to suggest, given my experience and what people are saying, that BMW are talking through their backsides.

I had hoped that the 535D would be a great fun car which could still be frugal (according to the stats) on the motorway. From all that is being posted here, this seems not to be the case. I suspect it won't last all that long in my garage and I don't know I could believe any future BMW stats.

Have you checked the thermostats?

Before going off on one, I would do so, as if they are not getting to temp you can be using anything up to 40% more fuel.

If it is not sitting at 90ºc, and getting there in around 10 mins, and sitting at around 80ºc you will be using around 10% more fuel, if it is sat at 75ºc it is using nearly 20% more fuel.


The test tells you what you will get at 39mph, so unless you are doing 39mph it tells you fk all.

Your Passat was obviously geared to your driving style perfectly, this is why people need to test cars properly before buying them, what suits one owner may not suit the next. One will be happy and one will be gutted.

[x12yhp]

Welshbeef said:

Given it shows the "Real mpg" as 36 its what he I'd getting.

Except I am not getting anywhere near 36. I have about 2/3 of my driving at 60mph on motorways and, over the 2k miles I have had it, I am not even getting 30mpg. On the drive back with the car, motorway at 60mpg for about 200 miles, I would only just have got 36. So it feels to me that I am well out...

[Welshbeef]

x12yhp said:

Except I am not getting anywhere near 36. I have about 2/3 of my driving at 60mph on motorways and, over the 2k miles I have had it, I am not even getting 30mpg. On the drive back with the car, motorway at 60mpg for about 200 miles, I would only just have got 36. So it feels to me that I am well out...

Get to the M way when engine is up temp reset the trip cruise control on at 70mph do this on a flat section with no traffic to hold you up.
Report back in the mpg you achieved.



When did you last v max revs? Literally on the limited in gear?

[gizlaroc]

x12yhp said:

Except I am not getting anywhere near 36. I have about 2/3 of my driving at 60mph on motorways and, over the 2k miles I have had it, I am not even getting 30mpg. On the drive back with the car, motorway at 60mpg for about 200 miles, I would only just have got 36. So it feels to me that I am well out...

HAVE YOU CHECKED YOUR THERMOSTATS??


Seriously, if they are knackered the car is over fuelling.

If they are not getting to 90ºc your DPF will not regen, it will be blocked and causing you to use more fuel.



Just search youtube on how to check, it takes minutes to do.



http://www.bmwland.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&...

[Vee]

Welshbeef said:

Given it shows the "Real mpg" as 36 its what he I'd getting.

Except he is getting the PRE LCI combined number you've quoted on an LCI car at motorway speeds ?
So not normal.

Welshbeef said:

Get to the M way when engine is up temp reset the trip cruise control on at 70mph do this on a flat section with no traffic to hold you up.
Report back in the mpg you achieved.

When did you last v max revs? Literally on the limited in gear?

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

[Welshbeef]

Vee said:

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Lots of long high revs really get the DPF to regenerate while doing so 3rd gear @70 mph for a couple of miles should make a world of difference

[anonymous-user]

Welshbeef said:

Vee said:

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Why?

[Vee]

Welshbeef said:

Vee said:

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Lots of long high revs really get the DPF to regenerate while doing so 3rd gear @70 mph for a couple of miles should make a world of difference

Must try that with mine, although I'm scared of blowing a hose somewhere.

[drmark]

Welshbeef said:

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Lots of long high revs really get the DPF to regenerate while doing so 3rd gear @70 mph for a couple of miles should make a world of difference

Regen criteria bit more complex than that and, at the risk of all sounding like a broken record, if the engine is not getting up to temp because of duff THERMOSTATS then no amount of high revs / driving in third for 2 miles (?) will make any difference.
OP please listen to those of us pointing you to the thermostats

Edited to add regen criteria:

DPF regeneration cannot take place unless specific ‘enabling’ criteria are met. These specific conditions must be met for regeneration to start, such as engine speed above idle, sufficiently high exhaust temperature and a differential pressure reading indicating a build-up of pressure. However, there are some less obvious enabling criteria that need to be met or addressed to allow DPF regeneration to occur:


• Fault Codes:

Regeneration will not happen if there are fault codes present for the DPF sensor, exhaust temperature sensors and the fuel filler cap


• Fuel:

Regeneration may not occur if there is insufficient fuel in the vehicle, typically there must be over a quarter of a tank of fuel (20 litres) present


• Soot Loading:

Passive regeneration will not occur if the calculated soot load is above 45% on average


• Oil Quality:

If the oil is degraded or diluted with diesel on vehicles fitted with oil quality monitors, passive regeneration may not occur until the quality monitor is reset


• Additives:

Regeneration will not occur if the diesel exhaust fluid tank is empty on vehicles equipped with additive systems such as Ad Blue


• Fixed Life Reached:

Some manufacturers view the DPF as a renewable item and once the given mileage is reached it may not regenerate (as low as 75,000 miles)

[Welshbeef]

REALIST123 said:

Welshbeef said:

Vee said:

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Why?

All generators need to be run under full load not just started up really put a full test on. Tickling the throttle is not what they need.


Why? You'll need a technical response from a physics perspective and also a practical response from an engineer confirming.


Why do you think the opposite?

[anonymous-user]

Welshbeef said:

REALIST123 said:

Welshbeef said:

Vee said:

I would guess he knows how to reset the mpg.
What is the significance of vmax revs ?

Diesels need to be put under full load often - could be all the previous owners didn't so needs a proper Italian tune up.

Why?

All generators need to be run under full load not just started up really put a full test on. Tickling the throttle is not what they need.


Why? You'll need a technical response from a physics perspective and also a practical response from an engineer confirming.


Why do you think the opposite?

Who said I think the opposite?

You made the statement; I've never seen any qualified evidence to say that view is valid, that's all.

It's certainly not necessary for DPF regeneration.

[drmark]

Welshbeef said:

All generators need to be run under full load not just started up really put a full test on. Tickling the throttle is not what they need.


Why? You'll need a technical response from a physics perspective and also a practical response from an engineer confirming.


Why do you think the opposite?

There are good reasons for that with generators - and they don't have much to do with cars

[x12yhp]

Welshbeef said:

Get to the M way when engine is up temp reset the trip cruise control on at 70mph do this on a flat section with no traffic to hold you up.
Report back in the mpg you achieved.



When did you last v max revs? Literally on the limited in gear?

10 miles, at 60, got me about 33.5 mpg. 70mph on the way back got about 31.

I drive in auto mode so likely don't max revs, will try tomorrow.

gizlaroc said:

HAVE YOU CHECKED YOUR THERMOSTATS??


Seriously, if they are knackered the car is over fuelling.

If they are not getting to 90ºc your DPF will not regen, it will be blocked and causing you to use more fuel.



Just search youtube on how to check, it takes minutes to do.



http://www.bmwland.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&...

I have not done so but will do now.

I called in with my local BMW and discussed but they werent much good. There aren't any fault codes and they pretty much said that this means there is unlikely much they could do. Best they suggested was trying BP instead of sainsburys fuel. I mentioned the thermostats but the guys said this wouldn't be it because the car would then be running somewhat poorly - which it isn't - so is this likely nonsense to get rid of me?

Thanks

[Welshbeef]

x12yhp said:

Welshbeef said:

Get to the M way when engine is up temp reset the trip cruise control on at 70mph do this on a flat section with no traffic to hold you up.
Report back in the mpg you achieved.



When did you last v max revs? Literally on the limited in gear?

10 miles, at 60, got me about 33.5 mpg. 70mph on the way back got about 31.

I drive in auto mode so likely don't max revs, will try tomorrow.

gizlaroc said:

HAVE YOU CHECKED YOUR THERMOSTATS??


Seriously, if they are knackered the car is over fuelling.

If they are not getting to 90ºc your DPF will not regen, it will be blocked and causing you to use more fuel.



Just search youtube on how to check, it takes minutes to do.



http://www.bmwland.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&...

I have not done so but will do now.

I called in with my local BMW and discussed but they werent much good. There aren't any fault codes and they pretty much said that this means there is unlikely much they could do. Best they suggested was trying BP instead of sainsburys fuel. I mentioned the thermostats but the guys said this wouldn't be it because the car would then be running somewhat poorly - which it isn't - so is this likely nonsense to get rid of me?

Thanks

Is the tyre pressure 2.3bar?

But this sounds like the thermostats are worn out ie they don't close so the engine never gets to correct operating temp as such the ECU makes the engine run rich until it does get hot (which if broken never will).


Thermostats really are consumable items

[GreigM]

x12yhp said:

I mentioned the thermostats but the guys said this wouldn't be it because the car would then be running somewhat poorly - which it isn't - so is this likely nonsense to get rid of me?

They must be the worst "specialists" in BMW history if they obviously have no knowledge of the singularly most common issue on a 5 series diesel. You cannot tell without watching the temps as the car is driven.

You can either check them via the OBC menu (a bit fiddly), or any cheap OBD interface (available on ebay from about £3) and a phone odb app would show the temps.

[Transiter]

Welshbeef said:

Increase the tyre pressure to 2.3 bar.



Mine is a pre LCI so no Eco pro.

I have climate on all the time ditto heated seats and hit full revs a few times each journey/commute.
I believe the pre LCI has an official combined of 45mpg whereas the LCI 50mpg.

I use cheapest diesel available - Tesco supermarket currently with the 20p off.

I may be well off as I've not been on PH long but are you not the guy that doesn't post up pictures because of data protection? Does the picture being upside down confuse fraudsters?

[Welshbeef]

GreigM said:

They must be the worst "specialists" in BMW history if they obviously have no knowledge of the singularly most common issue on a 5 series diesel. You cannot tell without watching the temps as the car is driven.

You can either check them via the OBC menu (a bit fiddly), or any cheap OBD interface (available on ebay from about £3) and a phone odb app would show the temps.

Just change the two parts job done

[gizlaroc]

x12yhp said:

I mentioned the thermostats but the guys said this wouldn't be it because the car would then be running somewhat poorly - which it isn't - so is this likely nonsense to get rid of me?

Thanks

Jesus wept, and we are meant to be paying these tts £120+ an hour?!!

A fking joke!!

[Ken Figenus]

Way too low. My E61 LCI 535D did 42 on a run to Edinburgh at 75mph. It averages 34-36 on a mix of 20% town, 40% A road and 40% motorway.

There is some internet folklore/BS on the 2 stats (mine runs below 90 C but is fine), but there is a hidden menu you can activate to display engine temp - its convoluted so Google it!