335d/435d or 535d

[Welshbeef]

Why is this turning into a thread about mpg and sneaking in m5's.



Clearly M5's are sublime etc etc but why Would anyone looking DG 235d/335d435d/535d be interested in that I'm the slightest?



The x35d is a fine tool economy and power balance is great - no one is or ever will stats that they sound better than an M(/3/ decent petrol. That's simply not up for debate as its patently true

[JNW1]

Welshbeef said:

The x35d is a fine tool economy and power balance is great

It would be a great balance if it was capable of getting anywhere near the combined figure when driven normally but it's not; still a decent balance but not a great one IMO. Based on experience with my E46 M3 and E92 335i I suspect I'd see something starting with a 3 as an overall average from a new M4 so in that context the 38 I'm getting from my 335d isn't really that spectacular...

[Wills2]

Welshbeef said:

Why is this turning into a thread about mpg and sneaking in m5's.



Clearly M5's are sublime etc etc but why Would anyone looking DG 235d/335d435d/535d be interested in that I'm the slightest?



The x35d is a fine tool economy and power balance is great - no one is or ever will stats that they sound better than an M(/3/ decent petrol. That's simply not up for debate as its patently true

What else would a 35d thread be about? Anyway I was just confirming something to JNW1 so sshhh Welshy.

[Fox-]

Welshbeef said:

Why is this turning into a thread about mpg

Because you are posting in it and it's all you care about, even when you had the RS6?

[Welshbeef]

JNW1 said:

Welshbeef said:

The x35d is a fine tool economy and power balance is great

It would be a great balance if it was capable of getting anywhere near the combined figure when driven normally but it's not; still a decent balance but not a great one IMO. Based on experience with my E46 M3 and E92 335i I suspect I'd see something starting with a 3 as an overall average from a new M4 so in that context the 38 I'm getting from my 335d isn't really that spectacular...

What are real owners getting combined out of the M4?

[JNW1]

Welshbeef said:

What are real owners getting combined out of the M4?

Two or three weeks ago a chap gave his impressions of his M4 after 12k miles on the M-forum. He said he was averaging just under 27mpg overall in running that included lots of short trips but on longer motorway runs it was doing 35-37mpg (so better than the combined figure of 34mpg); on what he described as a fast run he still got over 400 miles from a tank which given the tank's 60 litres converts to just over 30mpg. Obviously one owner isn't necessarily a representative sample but his experience does seem to suggest that driven normally on a run an M4 will at least achieve its combined figure which is in marked contrast to my 335d! If you don't do lots of short runs and/or lots of stop-start work around town I reckon it would be possible to drive normally (including using the performance where safe to do so) and average the right side of 30mpg from an M4; clearly you don't buy a car like that primarily with economy in mind but IMO it's a pretty decent return given the performance on offer.

[ZX10R NIN]

I averaged 26.1mpg out of my F80 M3 in the time I had it the OH is getting 41.9mpg out of the D3

[Fox-]

JNW1 said:

but his experience does seem to suggest that driven normally on a run an M4 will at least achieve its combined figure which is in marked contrast to my 335d!

It's still highlighting crap figures though - you always used to be able to hit extra urban on a steady run not just combined. Both my 530i and my 335i would touch extra urban on a 100+ mile Motorway run.

My 530d doesn't even come close and, like you allude here, just about hits combined on a run.

[julian64]

I think the 335d will hit its value its just how you drive it. I drove 16 miles into work this morning in a 335xd so the car was only up to temperature for half the journey. I reset at the start and drove lke a nun because the fuel reserve was saying 22 miles left in the tank.
When I reached work the car said 46 mpg, but more interestingly the range hadn't moved.

Now that obviously doesn't mean I hadn't used any fuel but it does show that there were great improvements to be made over the top of my normal driving.

Bottom line is that the 335xd probably could make its combined figures, its just having a playful powerful car and being an enthusiastic driver, it going to be rare for me to want to achieve them.

[Wills2]

The best I got from my 335d (f31) was 48mpg in eco pro mode driving like a pussy on a 200 mile motorway run still not the combined claimed number

[JNW1]

julian64 said:

Bottom line is that the 335xd probably could make its combined figures

Perhaps but not if you drive normally! I'm roughly 25% off the combined figure for my F31 and even on a run I've never seen anywhere close to the claimed figure of 50mpg (and to get there I suspect I'd have to drive in such a way as to render having a 335d totally pointless). In contrast, without even trying to drive for economy, my E92 335i would beat its combined figure on a run as would my E46 M3. The diesel is obviously better in absolute terms but in my experience the advantage over petrol is nowhere near what the published figures suggest.....

[335d]

JNW1 said:

I like my F31 335d and rate it as a very competent and capable machine; however, for me it's still a tool to do a job rather than an object of desire. It's probably every bit as quick as my old M3 CS in a straight line (at least up to 100mph) but in terms of being an engaging and fun car to drive it's not in the same league IMO; it's big and heavy and feels it if you try to push on a twisty road. Don't get me wrong, it's suiting my purposes quite nicely at the moment but if I was doing a lower annual mileage and didn't need the carrying flexibility for people and dogs I'd have far rather had one of the last of the E92 M3's. Doesn't make me right of course, just my opinion!

I really like the E92 M3 as well - it would make an ideal weekend car. I understand what you mean about the handling, but I'm wondering if you are still on the original springs? That relatively cheap change improves things significantly - turn in is far sharper and it is much less vague. Apparently non runflats, particularly Michelin PSS make quite a difference too. I'm waiting to wear out my runflats before switching.

Welshbeef said:

Please say you kept the M5 make it the second car the one the special lady you never dispose.

It might now be quicker but the noise it makes is stunning

I had to sell it unfortunately. At the time I lived in London and parked it on the street. It was attracting too much of the wrong kind of attention - parts stolen, damage... so after 18 months it had to go.

[drmark]

Well I get 37 out my F31
35 out of my F11 530d
25 out of 135i
And 9 out of a RRS SVR I test drove recently

Edited to add: we were having fun in the RRS (which sounds epic and climbs hills like a sherpa). I am sure you can get 17 out of it on a good day

Edited by drmark on Tuesday 17th March 17:02

Edited by drmark on Tuesday 17th March 19:37

[Welshbeef]

drmark said:

Well I get 37 out my F31
35 out of my F11 530d
25 out of 135i
And 9 out of a RRS SVR I test drove recently

Edited by drmark on Tuesday 17th March 17:02

So 48% more economical x35d over the 135i.

Do we need to continue to debate this aspect anymore? Its clearly better mpg like for like driving by a very significant margin.

[julian64]

JNW1 said:

julian64 said:

Bottom line is that the 335xd probably could make its combined figures

Perhaps but not if you drive normally! I'm roughly 25% off the combined figure for my F31 and even on a run I've never seen anywhere close to the claimed figure of 50mpg (and to get there I suspect I'd have to drive in such a way as to render having a 335d totally pointless). In contrast, without even trying to drive for economy, my E92 335i would beat its combined figure on a run as would my E46 M3. The diesel is obviously better in absolute terms but in my experience the advantage over petrol is nowhere near what the published figures suggest.....

That is true, but then I've never come across a car where you could drive it normally and get its combined figure. My biggest dissapointment was the M135i. I thought that would be my go to work pocket rocket prior to the 335d. I took one for a test drive back to back with the 335d. Doing the same drive in pretty much the same way the M135 was down in the low twenties 22-23 from memory and the 335 was high 30's 36-37. I thought that was diabolically poor from the 135. I could do better than that with spirited driving in the M5 on the way home!

[Welshbeef]

julian64 said:

That is true, but then I've never come across a car where you could drive it normally and get its combined figure. My biggest dissapointment was the M135i. I thought that would be my go to work pocket rocket prior to the 335d. I took one for a test drive back to back with the 335d. Doing the same drive in pretty much the same way the M135 was down in the low twenties 22-23 from memory and the 335 was high 30's 36-37. I thought that was diabolically poor from the 135. I could do better than that with spirited driving in the M5 on the way home!

That's the nub of it. On this website oddly any diesel ie X35d countless people point out at actual averages people are getting (with the odd oddity like me getting a touch more) then comes the petrol equivalent and hey hold on they pick the oddity who gets great economy whereas the countless others get much much less.


Why is this the case? No one has any vested interest unless trying to flog their own car so is it simply a blunt refusal to accept that a diesel can be pretty effective ( though sounds inferior/silent v a nice petrol).


I simply don't get it.

[akeithj]

OK lets forget about MPG. At the moment there is very little difference in contract price between

1.535d msport
2.435i msport
3.435d msport

So which one would you go for?

Even though its a bit of a big old thing, I do prefer the 535 interior, only trouble it's about 10 inches longer than the 4 series, however what you may loose in performance you make up for in refinement.

[Fox-]

akeithj said:

OK lets forget about MPG. At the moment there is very little difference in contract price between

1.535d msport
2.435i msport
3.435d msport

So which one would you go for?

Even though its a bit of a big old thing, I do prefer the 535 interior, only trouble it's about 10 inches longer than the 4 series, however what you may loose in performance you make up for in refinement.

535d without question, it is a much better car than the 4 Series. The 3/4 Series are like a big 1 Series inside.

[Welshbeef]

akeithj said:

OK lets forget about MPG. At the moment there is very little difference in contract price between

1.535d msport
2.435i msport
3.435d msport

So which one would you go for?

Even though its a bit of a big old thing, I do prefer the 535 interior, only trouble it's about 10 inches longer than the 4 series, however what you may loose in performance you make up for in refinement.

I've driven a 420d M sport fully loaded F30 330d M sport fully loaded and own a F10 535d.

Interior is worlds apart literally its a gulf. However if you've not been in the 5 you'd not be aware of this difference which is to say you'd get used to what it has to offer but once you try the 5 you'll know its such a better spec car.
Note next time I'll be buying the extended leather on the dash - previously id thought what an utter waste.... Um mind changed its now vital and makes things very special indeed

[drmark]

435i (and I am ex mega-spec F11 owner that I Had from new for 70k)
The 4 feels nimbler and fresher. Noticeable smaller too.
Not as refined obviously but close enough for me.
My F11 had adaptive suspension and that might swing me in your list, but an expensive extra on the 5.