F31 335d xDrive - experiences?

[JNW1]

Maracus said:

It's definitely narrower. E91 is 1817mm vs F31 1811mm.

Ok, I was looking at figures including mirrors which are 2013mm for the E91 and 2031mm for the F31! However, having owned both I'd certainly say the F31 feels the bigger, heavier, car from behind the wheel and therefore a touch less agile than the E91 as a consequence; there are obviously benefits that come with the extra size as well (more room inside and a better ride) but IMO the F31 does feel slightly less sporting than its predecessor.

[Wills2]

JNW1 said:

Probably because there are people who do things like quote the sub-5 second 0-60mph time and imply that makes it some sort of M3; as you've confirmed for yourself, it clearly isn't!

That's what confuses people I must admit I was taken in, not that I expected it to be an M3 but I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

[cerb4.5lee]

Wills2 said:

JNW1 said:

Probably because there are people who do things like quote the sub-5 second 0-60mph time and imply that makes it some sort of M3; as you've confirmed for yourself, it clearly isn't!

That's what confuses people I must admit I was taken in, not that I expected it to be an M3 but I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

I think you do get drawn into the 0 to 60 figure but you only have to start looking into the 0 to 100 time to see how much quicker a M3 is and that's not to mention how much better it is at going around corners with its honed chassis etc.

[Wills2]

cerb4.5lee said:

Wills2 said:

JNW1 said:

Probably because there are people who do things like quote the sub-5 second 0-60mph time and imply that makes it some sort of M3; as you've confirmed for yourself, it clearly isn't!

That's what confuses people I must admit I was taken in, not that I expected it to be an M3 but I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

I think you do get drawn into the 0 to 60 figure but you only have to start looking into the 0 to 100 time to see how much quicker a M3 is and that's not to mention how much better it is at going around corners with its honed chassis etc.

It'll do 100 in 12 seconds IIRC Lee, which is pretty nippy the fastest non M car BMW make at the time I bought it, I'd always thought M sport Beemers had a sporty drive to them but things have changed.

[bad company]

Wills2 said:

I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

Sorry, that is ridiculous. Have you ever driven a Citroen?

[cerb4.5lee]

Wills2 said:

cerb4.5lee said:

Wills2 said:

JNW1 said:

Probably because there are people who do things like quote the sub-5 second 0-60mph time and imply that makes it some sort of M3; as you've confirmed for yourself, it clearly isn't!

That's what confuses people I must admit I was taken in, not that I expected it to be an M3 but I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

I think you do get drawn into the 0 to 60 figure but you only have to start looking into the 0 to 100 time to see how much quicker a M3 is and that's not to mention how much better it is at going around corners with its honed chassis etc.

It'll do 100 in 12 seconds IIRC Lee, which is pretty nippy the fastest non M car BMW make at the time I bought it, I'd always thought M sport Beemers had a sporty drive to them but things have changed.

Agree it is still very respectable although the old E92 M3(manual) does it in 10.5 to 100 and that`s not considering what the current one does it in(high 8`s I think).

I agree its a shame how the current M sport cars do seem to be losing their sporty edge but as with every 3 series generation they just seem to get more and more grown up in feel.

[Wills2]

bad company said:

Wills2 said:

I didn't expect a woolly, wobbly thing either.

Sorry, that is ridiculous. Have you ever driven a Citroen?

It's just my opinion which counts for nothing so don't take it to heart.

[Welshbeef]

cerb4.5lee said:

Agree it is still very respectable although the old E92 M3(manual) does it in 10.5 to 100 and that`s not considering what the current one does it in(high 8`s I think).

I agree its a shame how the current M sport cars do seem to be losing their sporty edge but as with every 3 series generation they just seem to get more and more grown up in feel.

I think I've seen stats into the 11"s to 100mph - but either way 10.5 v 12 to 100mph is impressive.

The E39 M5 & XJR v8 are both 12 second cars to 100mph.
The 996 C2S is an 11 second car to 100mph
V8 RS6 is 11.5
E46 M3 12 seconds.

Clearly the new M3 in 8 odd seconds is stupidly fast which isn't much slower than a F40 to that speed

[bad company]

Wills2 said:

It's just my opinion which counts for nothing so don't take it to heart.

Not taking anything to heart but I just can't understand what you are thinking. I'm driving mine from Suffolk to Liverpool Sunday & not expecting to wobble or wobble.

Edited by bad company on Friday 3rd July 23:43

[Welshbeef]

bad company said:

Wills2 said:

It's just my opinion which counts for nothing so don't take it to heart.

Not taking anything to heart but I just can't understand what you are thinking. I'm driving mine from Suffolk to Liverpool Sunday & not expecting to wobble or wobble.

Edited by bad company on Friday 3rd July 23:43

He might have had a fault on his specific example but given his car history they would ride very firm and flat and were sports cars so any softer ride which the 335d has as its SE suspension not M Sport let alone full on sports car suspension would feel softer. Wobbly though is really taking the piss.

[JNW1]

bad company said:

Not taking anything to heart but I just can't understand what you are thinking. I'm driving mine from Suffolk to Liverpool Sunday & not expecting to wobble.

Edited by bad company on Friday 3rd July 23:43

Not quite sure what Wills2 meant by wobbly (maybe that was just him after a few glasses of wine at the end of a long week?!) but from memory I don't think his F31 had adaptive suspension and without it the standard car is definitely a bit soft and floaty if you're trying to go quickly over a twisty, undulating, road. From the sounds of it the ACS springs improve things significantly but reading between the lines I think Wills2 came to the conclusion quite quickly that the 335d wasn't for him and therefore spending money on upgrades would have been throwing good money after bad in his case!

[Wills2]

bad company said:

Wills2 said:

It's just my opinion which counts for nothing so don't take it to heart.

Not taking anything to heart but I just can't understand what you are thinking. I'm driving mine from Suffolk to Liverpool Sunday & not expecting to wobble or wobble.

Edited by bad company on Friday 3rd July 23:43

I was thinking woolly and wobbly is that OK with you? Enjoy your trip....

[cerb4.5lee]

Welshbeef said:

cerb4.5lee said:

Agree it is still very respectable although the old E92 M3(manual) does it in 10.5 to 100 and that`s not considering what the current one does it in(high 8`s I think).

I agree its a shame how the current M sport cars do seem to be losing their sporty edge but as with every 3 series generation they just seem to get more and more grown up in feel.

I think I've seen stats into the 11"s to 100mph - but either way 10.5 v 12 to 100mph is impressive.

The E39 M5 & XJR v8 are both 12 second cars to 100mph.
The 996 C2S is an 11 second car to 100mph
V8 RS6 is 11.5
E46 M3 12 seconds.

Clearly the new M3 in 8 odd seconds is stupidly fast which isn't much slower than a F40 to that speed

With the examples you mention it does show how impressive the performance of the diesel is for sure.

[JNW1]

cerb4.5lee said:

Welshbeef said:

cerb4.5lee said:

Agree it is still very respectable although the old E92 M3(manual) does it in 10.5 to 100 and that`s not considering what the current one does it in(high 8`s I think).

I agree its a shame how the current M sport cars do seem to be losing their sporty edge but as with every 3 series generation they just seem to get more and more grown up in feel.

I think I've seen stats into the 11"s to 100mph - but either way 10.5 v 12 to 100mph is impressive.

The E39 M5 & XJR v8 are both 12 second cars to 100mph.
The 996 C2S is an 11 second car to 100mph
V8 RS6 is 11.5
E46 M3 12 seconds.

Clearly the new M3 in 8 odd seconds is stupidly fast which isn't much slower than a F40 to that speed

With the examples you mention it does show how impressive the performance of the diesel is for sure.

True but I think it's some of these on-paper figures that lure people towards diesel only for them to realise quite quickly that there's more to a good performance car than going fast in a straight line; having said that I still think that for what it is the F31 335d is a pretty decent machine....

[Wills2]

JNW1 said:

bad company said:

Not taking anything to heart but I just can't understand what you are thinking. I'm driving mine from Suffolk to Liverpool Sunday & not expecting to wobble.

Edited by bad company on Friday 3rd July 23:43

Not quite sure what Wills2 meant by wobbly (maybe that was just him after a few glasses of wine at the end of a long week?!) but from memory I don't think his F31 had adaptive suspension and without it the standard car is definitely a bit soft and floaty if you're trying to go quickly over a twisty, undulating, road. From the sounds of it the ACS springs improve things significantly but reading between the lines I think Wills2 came to the conclusion quite quickly that the 335d wasn't for him and therefore spending money on upgrades would have been throwing good money after bad in his case!

I hadn't started on the wine at that point but it had been a long week (1200 miles of driving and several stupidly long 7 hour meetings), perhaps I should explain what I meant by woolly and wobbly.

My car pitched/yawed/rolled and dived over the moorland b roads that I regularly drive on, the SE suspension couldn't cope, the steering was lifeless and that in combination with the handling in my opinion made the car woolly and wobbly.

I also found the brakes to be poor, marking them down for initial bite and found them hard to modulate with a soft, long travel pedal.

On the motorway it was fine, stable and comfy but show it a road with dips/bends/camber and crests and the power/torque was too much for the chassis, personally I feel the cars chassis doesn't match the impressive powertrain.

The 330d sdrive I had for a weekend before I got my 335d handled much better with a more balanced feel, a lighter front end and the adaptive M sport suspension tied everything down.

I have to add that after 9 BMW's I'm very much a fan of their cars, but I didn't like the handling/brakes of my 335d (but what car is perfect?)

My judgement is, some BMWs are not as sporty as they used to be, I know that the above won't find favour with some posters but it's only my lowly opinion.

I'll add that over on F31 post, many of the owners have swapped out the springs for ACS/birds and even gone the whole hog with dampers/springs and stiffer ARBs so I'm not the only one that thinks this, by all accounts this transforms the car with a suspension to match the grunt.

Edited by Wills2 on Saturday 4th July 11:31

[bad company]

Mine is the 335d xDrive MSport. Is the suspension the same as the SE?

[Mustard]

bad company said:

Mine is the 335d xDrive MSport. Is the suspension the same as the SE?

Yep, xDrive models do not have M Sport Suspension

[bad company]

Mustard said:

bad company said:

Mine is the 335d xDrive MSport. Is the suspension the same as the SE?

Yep, xDrive models do not have M Sport Suspension

Oh well, mine must be so wolly & wobbly I don't even notice.

Today is perfect for my TVR Chim 500 tho.

[Mustard]

bad company said:

Mustard said:

bad company said:

Mine is the 335d xDrive MSport. Is the suspension the same as the SE?

Yep, xDrive models do not have M Sport Suspension

Oh well, mine must be so wolly & wobbly I don't even notice.

Today is perfect for my TVR Chim 500 tho.

I wouldn't worry, I deleted on my FIL X3 20d M Sport and my partners F20 116d M Sport and both are fine, and pleased I did in the interests of ride comfort, neither drive on the door handles

FIL has. F30 335d XDrive M Sport coming, only upgrade was Merino Learher (well it was only £1.80 extra a month) 18's, no heated seats , his Scottish and it's only on a 18mth contract (like the F25 and F20 are) if it's free or reduces the rental he'll have it, if not he won't!

[Tengocity]

Wills2 said:

I hadn't started on the wine at that point but it had been a long week (1200 miles of driving and several stupidly long 7 hour meetings), perhaps I should explain what I meant by woolly and wobbly.

My car pitched/yawed/rolled and dived over the moorland b roads that I regularly drive on, the SE suspension couldn't cope, the steering was lifeless and that in combination with the handling in my opinion made the car woolly and wobbly.

I also found the brakes to be poor, marking them down for initial bite and found them hard to modulate with a soft, long travel pedal.

On the motorway it was fine, stable and comfy but show it a road with dips/bends/camber and crests and the power/torque was too much for the chassis, personally I feel the cars chassis doesn't match the impressive powertrain.

The 330d sdrive I had for a weekend before I got my 335d handled much better with a more balanced feel, a lighter front end and the adaptive M sport suspension tied everything down.

I have to add that after 9 BMW's I'm very much a fan of their cars, but I didn't like the handling/brakes of my 335d (but what car is perfect?)

My judgement is, some BMWs are not as sporty as they used to be, I know that the above won't find favour with some posters but it's only my lowly opinion.

I'll add that over on F31 post, many of the owners have swapped out the springs for ACS/birds and even gone the whole hog with dampers/springs and stiffer ARBs so I'm not the only one that thinks this, by all accounts this transforms the car with a suspension to match the grunt.

Couldn't agree more and I'm one of those that has gone down the spring and ARB change route. It's allowed me to keep the adaptive suspension, and deals with much of these issues above in terms of allowing the chassis to match the drivetrain. I'm mulling over some bilstein coilovers, but it would be too much for a daily driver business car that I would use on track maybe once per year, and will buy another weekend toy once our house move is completed.

Edited by Wills2 on Saturday 4th July 11:31