Discussion
dannylt said:
Amazing so many people are happy to invalidate their insurance then in my view... but that's been discussed to death. I'm looking for just ANYONE who HAS declared it...
The insurance companies could refuse to pay out, if there is ANY undeclared modification to your car.
So, to an extent, i think it is a case of how much one allows themselves to get paranoid about insurance.
When we buy a car on the used market, it may well have had a remap we don't know of, it perhaps has a bigger spoiler or performance exhaust we either thought was standard, or assumed would not matter to the insurers, it could have a cold air intake system we haven't declared, etc etc etc. Do you declare the tiniest mod? I really don't know.
Literally millions of cars in the UK are different, in some way, from standard. Should everyone declare every single change? Where do you draw the line? They can refuse to pay out for any alteration.
My Dad and I were talking about this last night, as he was very senior in claims in a very large insurace co for his entire working career (he packed it in about 10 years ago).
He said in his day if they had found out the car had been modded then they would have taken a view as to if the mod had been a contributing factor in the event that led to the claim. If it was then they would not have paid out, if it was not then they probably would have done (very honest chap my dad).
However he then said that times have changed and there is no way that you would get away with it now, and sited a case recently where someone did not get a payout becuase they had failed to declare sn sp30!
Would they find out? Not sure, but remember there will be a paper (or electronic trail, who is to say that in the event of a fatal accident the insurance co will not look at the mapping, it will only take seconds to compare the chip to a std map if they have the right equipment (which they will have).
D
He said in his day if they had found out the car had been modded then they would have taken a view as to if the mod had been a contributing factor in the event that led to the claim. If it was then they would not have paid out, if it was not then they probably would have done (very honest chap my dad).
However he then said that times have changed and there is no way that you would get away with it now, and sited a case recently where someone did not get a payout becuase they had failed to declare sn sp30!
Would they find out? Not sure, but remember there will be a paper (or electronic trail, who is to say that in the event of a fatal accident the insurance co will not look at the mapping, it will only take seconds to compare the chip to a std map if they have the right equipment (which they will have).
D
Thats right I thought a £350 extra cost was good value - everyone is telling me it make the 535 an m5 beater (lets not go there)
But doesny every insurance company asked you if the car is modified, so tell them up front and get them to decide rather than run the risk of losing a claim for 350£ a year.
But doesny every insurance company asked you if the car is modified, so tell them up front and get them to decide rather than run the risk of losing a claim for 350£ a year.
Well i had a DMS 535d M-Sport for about 3 months & the lure of getting myself an M5 was way too strong so i sold the 535d & bought an Interlagos Blue M5 in May this year.
I can tell you without any shadow of doubt that anyone who thinks a DMS 535d can even get close to keeping up with an M5 is on drugs.
Don't get me wrong, my DMS 535d was an amazing stealth rocket ship & on paper only a second slower to 60, however at speeds past 60 the M5 would just roar away so given the 1 second gap up to 60 & the stroll away after 60, whoever thinks the 535d is as quick is dreaming.
Add to that the fact i got my M5 DMS'd within 1 week of getting it & mine is now a very very brutal monster.
That said, their are many cars that a DMS 535d could play with on a level playing field & those i did get a chance to annoy when i had my 535d were proper pi$$ed when they realised they'd been taken by a diesel. On paper the 535d is as quick as an M3, however on a track & through twisties, the M3 would probably walk it.
To conclude, the 535d is awesome & if you have it DMS'd it's even more awesome & a real flying machine, but still not a match for an M5
I can tell you without any shadow of doubt that anyone who thinks a DMS 535d can even get close to keeping up with an M5 is on drugs.
Don't get me wrong, my DMS 535d was an amazing stealth rocket ship & on paper only a second slower to 60, however at speeds past 60 the M5 would just roar away so given the 1 second gap up to 60 & the stroll away after 60, whoever thinks the 535d is as quick is dreaming.
Add to that the fact i got my M5 DMS'd within 1 week of getting it & mine is now a very very brutal monster.
That said, their are many cars that a DMS 535d could play with on a level playing field & those i did get a chance to annoy when i had my 535d were proper pi$$ed when they realised they'd been taken by a diesel. On paper the 535d is as quick as an M3, however on a track & through twisties, the M3 would probably walk it.
To conclude, the 535d is awesome & if you have it DMS'd it's even more awesome & a real flying machine, but still not a match for an M5
A full diagnostic check by a dealer will reveal any form of non OE mapping (DMS included) and previous changes to the mapping as everything is stored within the DME. DMS's only saving grace is that it doesn't store fault codes that appear right away on the diagnostics machine... if you use other mappers.. these can be identified straight away. But a if a dealer spends 15mins or so to check the DME throughly a DMS remap can be easily detected (I only know this through one current BMW master tech..so this may not be gospel). Of course if your turbo goes they will undergo all checks to avoid paying out as will insurers. So declare it with your insurance, but either way you lose the BMW warranty on your drivetrain.
Mine is insurance declared & as for being detectable, i have to disagree as it's widely known that the DMS mapping is not identified under normal dealer conditions & only if the main ecu were sent back to Germany for thorough testing could it perhaps be found but i can't see any conditions where this would happen.
According to DMS they have had no reports of their maps being identified by BMW dealers or BMW themselves & given that Service Technicians only probably get to drive one M5 every couple of weeks, they'll hardly notice the performance differences amongst all the other car's they drive. Of course their are more 535d's on the road, but again DMS are not aware of any detection & i'm more than happy with that.
According to DMS they have had no reports of their maps being identified by BMW dealers or BMW themselves & given that Service Technicians only probably get to drive one M5 every couple of weeks, they'll hardly notice the performance differences amongst all the other car's they drive. Of course their are more 535d's on the road, but again DMS are not aware of any detection & i'm more than happy with that.
More interesting will be the 335d - has anyone driven this yet? I drove the 535d (saloon, unmodified) last week and thought it was such an awesome all-rounder, I almost ordered one to replace the Mrs aging Cayenne Turbo. The Cayenne is an impressive machine, no question, but if you press on you get less than 10mpg, not to mention the appetite for Mobil 1. And lets not talk about depreciation! In the real world, on the road, the BM will quite easily keep up with the Cayenne, but all this comparing with 'real' sports cars is getting a bit silly. My daily driver is a Porsche 997TT which replaced a Porsche 996C4S and the handling, balance, composure, not to mention exclusivity of these cars is way out the BM's league. But as an all-round and (relatively) cheap to buy/run sports/executive/family/cruiser, I don't think it gets better than the 535D, so will most probably buy one very soon... unless anyone has any better ideas?
Edited by Dazmo on Friday 6th October 13:27
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