AC Schnitzer 335d x-drive springs

[335d]

DocSteve said:

Hi,

I can't seem to find many non-RFTs (MPSS included) that are load rated the same as the current ones. I think I have 225/45/18 Y91 at the front and 255/40 95 at the rear and can't see to find any MPSS for both of those axles (or Goodyear F1s either).

Did you find that insurance was an issue with the springs? I'm with Admiral.

Thanks
Steve

Sorry not to have replied earlier.

For my 19" wheels I went from 89 and 92 load ratings on the standard RFT tyres to 93 and 96, but these MPSS are extra load (XL) tyres which apparently have this higher load rating only at higher pressures. At the standard 2.6 bar - they have a load rating of 89 and 92 apparently. I wonder if the 18" MPSS are also XL tyres, and hence the confusion? No expert here so hopefully others will clarify.

My insurance with LV rose by £11 on adding the springs.

[335d]

Wills2 said:

Not sure I agree, I had 19" and it was floaty mess, the sdrive M sport handles well the xdrive doesn't or at least mine didn't.

I agree about the standard xDrive, but the standard sDrive while better, is far from good in my view. I get to make the comparison whenever I have an sDrive M Sport F30 loan car. The ACS springs have improved the handling to well beyond the sDrive level, and quite a few sDrive owners have also now fitted ACS springs (or other suspension upgrades) with very positive results. BMW just didn't make the F30 to handle well in any of its forms, and while the majority may not care, any enthusiastic drivers seem to find the suspension to be the weakest link.

[JNW1]

Ady555 said:

JNW1 said:

the S-Drive versions with M-Sport suspension are much better and hence the shortcomings with the 335d aren't all attributable to size and weight; suspension set-up is a major factor

Yes, suspension set up is a major factor, i am not deneighing that. Are you saying that the S drive handles better in the twisties than the Xdrive?

Yes, I'd say an M-Sport S-Drive is significantly better than a standard X-Drive and still has an edge over an X-Drive with adaptive suspension running in Sport mode. I should however add that my comments all relate to pre-LCI cars; my understanding is that LCI X-Drives are an improvement over the earlier versions albeit still far from perfect (and hence there are still people with LCI X-Drives who are switching to ACS springs).

335d also makes a fair point when he says the S-Drives aren't perfect either and hence you'll find some people switching to ACS springs on them as well; however, those drivers are probably the exception rather than the norm and with S-Drive generally the standard M-Sport set-up is good enough for most. To be honest that might be the case for X-drive as well, it's just being on forums like this - which probably have a high proportion of keen drivers - gives an impression that everyone's running ACS springs when in reality I'm sure that's far from the case!

[smashy]

julian64 said:

I've seen a few of these threads now, and they are all very positive for the springs but very information light

Half the claims made for the swap in springs in the way the car handles can't be right. People claim damping improvement and cornering improvement and cornering feel which aren't directly spring linked.

One suspects that when someone buys new springs they automatically want to justify their purchase. I have driven a car with 18" wheels and AC springs and found it worse than my 20" wheels and standard springs in terms of harshness of ride. There was little or no difference in cornering feel which makes sense. I suspect there is an element of wheel size affecting the spring rate.

No one even seems to know what the spring rate is on the upgrade springs for any sort of comparison.

My advice would be to try and find a car with them and try it out rather than take advice on here. Be aware though that an F30 with adaptive suspension does feel a lot different to a car without so you must compare like with like.

When braking on SE suspension the car front goes down and your straining to stay on the seat.Really frustrating,

When I went to Rossiters to get them done as a day out on my s drive Standard suspension with my partner we went along a 5 mile road the sat nav found ( an area called Prick Willow) we were bouncing up and down off the seat so much it was seriously ridiculous. After coming back I said to her id find that road and see if there was any difference, So I hit the accelerator and wow such a difference totally planted,Coming back down the M11 on the outside lane instead of feeling like you were taking off with the undulation and wallowing again nothing the car is now a joy to drive

[Ady555]

I would have thought the Xdrive would have been better in the twisties due to its superior traction..... You would certainly be able to exit a corner faster in the Xdrive. But on paper, i'm guessing there isn't much in it to be concerned about unless it is a wet corner.
Going back to the OP, let us know how you get on with the ACS springs.

[julian64]

smashy said:

julian64 said:

I've seen a few of these threads now, and they are all very positive for the springs but very information light

Half the claims made for the swap in springs in the way the car handles can't be right. People claim damping improvement and cornering improvement and cornering feel which aren't directly spring linked.

One suspects that when someone buys new springs they automatically want to justify their purchase. I have driven a car with 18" wheels and AC springs and found it worse than my 20" wheels and standard springs in terms of harshness of ride. There was little or no difference in cornering feel which makes sense. I suspect there is an element of wheel size affecting the spring rate.

No one even seems to know what the spring rate is on the upgrade springs for any sort of comparison.

My advice would be to try and find a car with them and try it out rather than take advice on here. Be aware though that an F30 with adaptive suspension does feel a lot different to a car without so you must compare like with like.

When braking on SE suspension the car front goes down and your straining to stay on the seat.Really frustrating,

When I went to Rossiters to get them done as a day out on my s drive Standard suspension with my partner we went along a 5 mile road the sat nav found ( an area called Prick Willow) we were bouncing up and down off the seat so much it was seriously ridiculous. After coming back I said to her id find that road and see if there was any difference, So I hit the accelerator and wow such a difference totally planted,Coming back down the M11 on the outside lane instead of feeling like you were taking off with the undulation and wallowing again nothing the car is now a joy to drive

With all due respect you are mainly talking about a change in damping there not spring rates. Did you have dampers changed with springs or just springs?

Out of interest do you know what the change in spring rates by going to schnitzer you have achieved?

[smashy]

If you say so i bow to your knowledge yes i had dampers changed as well ...spring rates not a clue

EDITED just done some googling and it does indeed look like all the benefits I have got getting rid of my Floating Blancmange Syndrome have propably come from changing the Shock Absorbers as well,well thats a spanner in the works I thought it was due to the springs and I just decided to go the whole way as a cream on the top thing ,glad I did

Edited by smashy on Tuesday 21st June 13:11

[Mr_Yogi]

How much are the ACS springs fitted?

Does the F31 have rear air springs like the F11?

I've just had a quote for ACS springs for my 535d, which is for the front only, but they do need to set the rear spring height to match. It seemed rather expensive compared to the less than £200 price of the springs? Is it a big job?

[smashy]

Rossiters themselves charge around £650 for springs and fitting think BMW dealers that do it and there are many charge a bit more

[335d]

Mr_Yogi said:

How much are the ACS springs fitted?

Does the F31 have rear air springs like the F11?

I've just had a quote for ACS springs for my 535d, which is for the front only, but they do need to set the rear spring height to match. It seemed rather expensive compared to the less than £200 price of the springs? Is it a big job?

Typically about £650 fitted at a BMW dealer, or less at a local place.

The F31 has metal springs at the rear, unlike the F11

It does take about 3 or 4 hours I think, but don't ask me why.

[Mr_Yogi]

335d said:

Typically about £650 fitted at a BMW dealer, or less at a local place.

The F31 has metal springs at the rear, unlike the F11

It does take about 3 or 4 hours I think, but don't ask me why.

Thanks, I was quoted nearly £700 for just the front springs and to set the rears.

[LunarOne]

Ady555 said:

Yes, suspension set up is a major factor, i am not deneighing that.

Deneighing? Don't do that to a horse or it will never speak to you again!

[Wills2]

Ady555 said:

Wills2 said:

Not sure I agree, I had 19" and it was floaty mess, the sdrive M sport handles well the xdrive doesn't or at least mine didn't.

Did you have it in Sport mode?
I still think you guys are expecting too much of what is essentially, a big heavy luxary premium brand rep mobile. There is a lot of weight to transfer from side to side when throwing it into corners, coupled with 45 profile tyres if on 18's, Not taking into account if you are running the correct tyre pressures. I still think running 19's is a vast improvement over 18's. The suspension on the 3 series is probably ok for a high percentage of its UK buyers anyway, it's only a selected few that buy a large car like the 3 series and want it to handle like it is on rails. That is why they have the M3 in their range. (i am not claiming that the M3 handles like it is on rails though.) But handles better than the car in question from the op.

Yes all and any of the modes, weight isn't the issue my old m5 was fine at nearly 2 tonnes, tyre pressures were fine and on the button, 3 series isn't a "big" car by any stretch, not like it's on rails just handle in a tidy manner without the float, dive and excessive lean.

Yes aware of the M3 I'm on my 4th.

I've driven so many BMWs over the years but the xdrive 335d was the worst handling by a mile a 318d sport is better.

[DocSteve]

Blimey, I have opened a can of worms with this one!

I've ordered the springs - ACS say they should be with me within two weeks as on back order. I will report back and try not to be biased. I am used to fiddling around with suspension/tyre setup on my track car and the effects it has in that setting plus have owned a number of BMWs including an E60 M5 and an E61 535d M-sport so I hope I will be able to provide some sort of balanced view. Essentially, if I've wasted my money I won't come on here justifying it to myself and others and will concede the point (in theory!)

Steve

[Pie n Chips]

18" OEM MPSS sizes are as follows

225/45 ZR18 95Y Extra Load
255/40 ZR18 99Y Extra Load

Hope that helps someone.
I have Eibach springs fitted to my none adaptive F30 335d, a nice improvement over stock, but there's always room for improvement, but i'm happy with the compromise for a daily. I'd recommend a geo setup after fitting your springs, well as custom as you can get with only toe only adjustment at the front, toe/camber at the rear. My toe was all over the place on the front and rear.

Edited by Pie n Chips on Wednesday 22 June 16:22

[335d]

Pie n Chips said:

18" OEM MPSS sizes are as follows

225/45 ZR18 95Y Extra Load
255/40 ZR18 99Y Extra Load

Hope that helps someone.

I believe that means that at the ordinary (lower) pressure, the tyres have a load rating of 91 and 95 respectively, with 95 and 99 when at high pressure. If that's the case, and hopefully someone will confirm, this is exactly what the OP requires.

[julian64]

do they do 20" rims with the right load rating?

[DocSteve]

335d said:

I believe that means that at the ordinary (lower) pressure, the tyres have a load rating of 91 and 95 respectively, with 95 and 99 when at high pressure. If that's the case, and hopefully someone will confirm, this is exactly what the OP requires.

Thanks both,

This is exactly what I need. Somehow I found MPSS with lower load ratings (88) but having checked out the Michelin website again I can find these tyres which should do the job perfectly. The question is when to do it...

Interesting comment re: the geo setup - the car is new so should be as per manufacturer's settings so I'm not sure I want to deviate from that yet....

[Pie n Chips]

So was mine 16 plate 335d, but once you lower your going to knock the settings out of whack - potentially, so it's worth a check. Here's the factory settings should you need them

[Wills2]

DocSteve said:

Interesting comment re: the geo setup - the car is new so should be as per manufacturer's settings so I'm not sure I want to deviate from that yet....

You need a KDS geo done if you're fitting lowered springs, ACS include it in there fitted price.