F11 535d M-sport, Good idea?
Discussion
Griffrich said:
Hi all,
I've been thinking of a new car ahead of next years ved changes and I'm tempted with a 535d m-sport touring. I'm just after some opinions on whether or not this is good idea in view of the new 5 coming out next year.
Should I wait or go for the sort of tempting deal I could get on a last production run? (circa 25-30% off)
I understand there'll only be a 530d engine in the G30 is that right?
I test drove the 530d m-sport (saloon) and I'm wondering what the main difference is with the 35d engine, I found the 530d had a wee bit of initial lag before taking off.
I suppose my main issue is the design is now 6 years old today, I nearly bought a 520d SE in 2011 before plumping for my A4 Avant so while it'll be a new car in might not feel that much of a step forward.
What does the PH collective think?
Rich.
I got an F11 535d touring Msport in July this year. Carbon black with Oyster interior, with the M-Sport plus pack and HK sound. I love it, has taken 5 of us to Italy and back in complete comfort. Swallows bikes with easy, and somehow manages to average around 40mpg. The 535d engine is a good step up in performance from the 530d, and with current deals available, probably not that much real difference in price. There will certainly be a 535d variant (probably called a 540d in the new car) but it'll be a year away, and you'll almost certainly need to pay list.I've been thinking of a new car ahead of next years ved changes and I'm tempted with a 535d m-sport touring. I'm just after some opinions on whether or not this is good idea in view of the new 5 coming out next year.
Should I wait or go for the sort of tempting deal I could get on a last production run? (circa 25-30% off)
I understand there'll only be a 530d engine in the G30 is that right?
I test drove the 530d m-sport (saloon) and I'm wondering what the main difference is with the 35d engine, I found the 530d had a wee bit of initial lag before taking off.
I suppose my main issue is the design is now 6 years old today, I nearly bought a 520d SE in 2011 before plumping for my A4 Avant so while it'll be a new car in might not feel that much of a step forward.
What does the PH collective think?
Rich.
I have an M2 which has the latest I-drive interface, and to be honest, its not that much different to the 535d, some small detail changes, but nothing significant.
IREvans said:
I got an F11 535d touring Msport in July this year. Carbon black with Oyster interior, with the M-Sport plus pack and HK sound. I love it, has taken 5 of us to Italy and back in complete comfort. Swallows bikes with easy, and somehow manages to average around 40mpg. The 535d engine is a good step up in performance from the 530d, and with current deals available, probably not that much real difference in price. There will certainly be a 535d variant (probably called a 540d in the new car) but it'll be a year away, and you'll almost certainly need to pay list.
I have an M2 which has the latest I-drive interface, and to be honest, its not that much different to the 535d, some small detail changes, but nothing significant.
How do you get 3 children in the back row with isofix seats?I have an M2 which has the latest I-drive interface, and to be honest, its not that much different to the 535d, some small detail changes, but nothing significant.
Welshbeef said:
How do you get 3 children in the back row with isofix seats?
Good question. I used to have a 2013 E70 X5 40d. In that, I put 2 Recaro Young sport on either side of the rear bench for my 3 year olds (non isofix, but teh seat is secured using the rear bench seat belt, and the child seat has harnesses) then my 6 year old would sit on a non isofix child seat in the centre, using the 3rd belt. I used a seat belt extender to allow the 3rd belt to be used. Swapped the X5 for a Merc GL350d (fantastic car) and the same seating arrangement was possible.
Children are now older, so on the F11 535d, I use the same Recaro Young sport on the outside of the rear bench, and my 8 year old is tall enough to sit on the rear bench between both seats, and uses the 3rd belt, and it sits correctly across her shoulder.
Maybe a bit off topic, but if you can't fit multiple Maxi Cosi's in the back something from Multimac might be a solution.
British company.
http://www.multimac.co.uk
Fortunately just one child, so no need for one myself. About the F11, I'd say go for it. Personally I would never pay the full price for options. Waiting for mine, albeit just a 520dA, to arrive in January. Ah well, can always grab the keys of the Caterham if I feel the need for some more speed.
British company.
http://www.multimac.co.uk
Fortunately just one child, so no need for one myself. About the F11, I'd say go for it. Personally I would never pay the full price for options. Waiting for mine, albeit just a 520dA, to arrive in January. Ah well, can always grab the keys of the Caterham if I feel the need for some more speed.
Slightly off topic but I borrowed a 730Ld a couple of weekends ago from my local main dealer. Dropped it off Monday morning and the DP showed me a new PCP deal they're doing to clear the current 5 series stock. 520d SE with £365 deposit and £365 a mth. Guaranteed fv at 12k miles per year. Less than normal depreciation surely. PCP always made sense on a new 7 but this seems a good deal - if you don't care for the new model obviously.
Interesting discussion! My last car was an F11 530d SE with adaptive drive and my current one is an F11 535d Sport with standard sports suspension.
I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
Other options I rate highly include the sun-roof - I wouldn't have a car without one if I had a choice - love the extra sense of light and tipping the roof up gives a slight feeling of connection with the outdoors which I greatly appreciate. Top of the list for me.
Sports auto box with paddle shift - should be standard fit - I am constantly changing myself. Nothing wrong with the gearbox as far as autos go, I just prefer to make my own choice on shift points. Not having the paddles is a pain.
HUD - fantastic, particularly with the satnav.
Comfort seats - I've not had them on either car but everyone seems to rate them very highly so must make it to the list? I still like the sports seats.
Soft close doors - bizarrely I really missed this when I changed from the last car which had it fitted. I think it's great!
535 v 530 - 535 every time. The second (small) turbo provides the sensation of much more torque from slow/ standing starts which I think provides a better driving experience for such a heavy car. There's a slight fuel penalty but I get over 45mpg on a motorway run and if that ain't good enough, I should be looking at a 2.0 litre model in the 3 series range!
Folding/ anti-dazzle mirrors - if not standard, these are an essential for me
Current model vs next years - I really like the sound of the 5 series losing weight - like me it does need to do so! Plus it will be interesting to see how some of the new options such as four wheel steering enhance/ detract from the driving experience. I suspect there will be quite a wait to get your hands on the new 535 equivalent and because of demand for new/ need to get rid of the old, there will be a big price differential. One thing which I do wonder about however, is will government policy push us away from diesel engines (increased road tax, congestion charging, fuel tax, etc) and impose additional depreciation because of this or is there any concensus that they will remain the tip top choice for the next, say, 5 series product cycle? Could it be that we should be looking more towards the petrol equivalent for our next car?
Setting aside my last question (if that is possible!!) I am really struggling after 2 years in the 535 to think what I could get to replace it, other than get another type of car to supplement it! They are truly fab.
Peter
I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
Other options I rate highly include the sun-roof - I wouldn't have a car without one if I had a choice - love the extra sense of light and tipping the roof up gives a slight feeling of connection with the outdoors which I greatly appreciate. Top of the list for me.
Sports auto box with paddle shift - should be standard fit - I am constantly changing myself. Nothing wrong with the gearbox as far as autos go, I just prefer to make my own choice on shift points. Not having the paddles is a pain.
HUD - fantastic, particularly with the satnav.
Comfort seats - I've not had them on either car but everyone seems to rate them very highly so must make it to the list? I still like the sports seats.
Soft close doors - bizarrely I really missed this when I changed from the last car which had it fitted. I think it's great!
535 v 530 - 535 every time. The second (small) turbo provides the sensation of much more torque from slow/ standing starts which I think provides a better driving experience for such a heavy car. There's a slight fuel penalty but I get over 45mpg on a motorway run and if that ain't good enough, I should be looking at a 2.0 litre model in the 3 series range!
Folding/ anti-dazzle mirrors - if not standard, these are an essential for me
Current model vs next years - I really like the sound of the 5 series losing weight - like me it does need to do so! Plus it will be interesting to see how some of the new options such as four wheel steering enhance/ detract from the driving experience. I suspect there will be quite a wait to get your hands on the new 535 equivalent and because of demand for new/ need to get rid of the old, there will be a big price differential. One thing which I do wonder about however, is will government policy push us away from diesel engines (increased road tax, congestion charging, fuel tax, etc) and impose additional depreciation because of this or is there any concensus that they will remain the tip top choice for the next, say, 5 series product cycle? Could it be that we should be looking more towards the petrol equivalent for our next car?
Setting aside my last question (if that is possible!!) I am really struggling after 2 years in the 535 to think what I could get to replace it, other than get another type of car to supplement it! They are truly fab.
Peter
northpolar said:
Interesting discussion! My last car was an F11 530d SE with adaptive drive and my current one is an F11 535d Sport with standard sports suspension.
I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
Other options I rate highly include the sun-roof - I wouldn't have a car without one if I had a choice - love the extra sense of light and tipping the roof up gives a slight feeling of connection with the outdoors which I greatly appreciate. Top of the list for me.
Sports auto box with paddle shift - should be standard fit - I am constantly changing myself. Nothing wrong with the gearbox as far as autos go, I just prefer to make my own choice on shift points. Not having the paddles is a pain.
HUD - fantastic, particularly with the satnav.
Comfort seats - I've not had them on either car but everyone seems to rate them very highly so must make it to the list? I still like the sports seats.
Soft close doors - bizarrely I really missed this when I changed from the last car which had it fitted. I think it's great!
535 v 530 - 535 every time. The second (small) turbo provides the sensation of much more torque from slow/ standing starts which I think provides a better driving experience for such a heavy car. There's a slight fuel penalty but I get over 45mpg on a motorway run and if that ain't good enough, I should be looking at a 2.0 litre model in the 3 series range!
Folding/ anti-dazzle mirrors - if not standard, these are an essential for me
Current model vs next years - I really like the sound of the 5 series losing weight - like me it does need to do so! Plus it will be interesting to see how some of the new options such as four wheel steering enhance/ detract from the driving experience. I suspect there will be quite a wait to get your hands on the new 535 equivalent and because of demand for new/ need to get rid of the old, there will be a big price differential. One thing which I do wonder about however, is will government policy push us away from diesel engines (increased road tax, congestion charging, fuel tax, etc) and impose additional depreciation because of this or is there any concensus that they will remain the tip top choice for the next, say, 5 series product cycle? Could it be that we should be looking more towards the petrol equivalent for our next car?
Setting aside my last question (if that is possible!!) I am really struggling after 2 years in the 535 to think what I could get to replace it, other than get another type of car to supplement it! They are truly fab.
Peter
550i incredible economy for such towering performance. I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
Other options I rate highly include the sun-roof - I wouldn't have a car without one if I had a choice - love the extra sense of light and tipping the roof up gives a slight feeling of connection with the outdoors which I greatly appreciate. Top of the list for me.
Sports auto box with paddle shift - should be standard fit - I am constantly changing myself. Nothing wrong with the gearbox as far as autos go, I just prefer to make my own choice on shift points. Not having the paddles is a pain.
HUD - fantastic, particularly with the satnav.
Comfort seats - I've not had them on either car but everyone seems to rate them very highly so must make it to the list? I still like the sports seats.
Soft close doors - bizarrely I really missed this when I changed from the last car which had it fitted. I think it's great!
535 v 530 - 535 every time. The second (small) turbo provides the sensation of much more torque from slow/ standing starts which I think provides a better driving experience for such a heavy car. There's a slight fuel penalty but I get over 45mpg on a motorway run and if that ain't good enough, I should be looking at a 2.0 litre model in the 3 series range!
Folding/ anti-dazzle mirrors - if not standard, these are an essential for me
Current model vs next years - I really like the sound of the 5 series losing weight - like me it does need to do so! Plus it will be interesting to see how some of the new options such as four wheel steering enhance/ detract from the driving experience. I suspect there will be quite a wait to get your hands on the new 535 equivalent and because of demand for new/ need to get rid of the old, there will be a big price differential. One thing which I do wonder about however, is will government policy push us away from diesel engines (increased road tax, congestion charging, fuel tax, etc) and impose additional depreciation because of this or is there any concensus that they will remain the tip top choice for the next, say, 5 series product cycle? Could it be that we should be looking more towards the petrol equivalent for our next car?
Setting aside my last question (if that is possible!!) I am really struggling after 2 years in the 535 to think what I could get to replace it, other than get another type of car to supplement it! They are truly fab.
Peter
B5 too lovely and offer something different to the M5+touring option too
northpolar said:
Interesting discussion! My last car was an F11 530d SE with adaptive drive and my current one is an F11 535d Sport with standard sports suspension.
I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
Peter - I drove AD/non-AD back to back. Albeit after much trouble and having to pretend I was a used car buyer at a dealer a long way from where I live. And these were F10, not F11.I really miss the adaptive drive which I found to be nigh on perfect for UK roads - it can be a luxo-barge when the surface is rubbish (quite a lot of the time!) and it firms up nicely when you want to press on (not very often on southern England roads with the traffic volumes and camera frequencies!). As others have said, it would be very worthwhile driving back to back if at all possible; trouble being that active is rarer than hens teeth.
I drove the M Sport passive first, and thought - heavy car, not bad in the bends, bouncy and bumpy. Then the AD. I though comfort like an S class and then the first roundabout - I have to have this! Flat, firm, controlled, easy. And it gets better the more you press on.
For the first time in a long time I want to hang on to a car. And that's with it's dreadful electric numb steering!
Only mandatory options for me are: AD, HUD, Sports Auto. Everything else (including Pro Nav) is just frippery.
The first F10 I ever drove had Adaptive Drive and it was really rather special - smooth and comfortable and then without even needing to change drive modes, chuck it into a bend and it was flat and controlled. There is no doubt that it's a very good system and IMHO, performance alone, clearly the best suspension setup on the F10.
However this doesn't mean the passive M Sport setup is bad. Far from it. I was sufficiently happy with the way the M Sport rode and handled on the conventional suspension to not mandate Adaptive Drive in my recent search which made things much easier as there are precious few of them around with it. It's also a shame that it raises the ride height but the performance difference is easily worth the ride height tradeoff.
Not so Variable Damping Control on its own. It continues to confuse me why every single member of the motoring press is obsessed with VDC. You can't even read a lowly 520d SE review without 'VDC IS ESSENTIAL' being uttered every other paragraph. On it's own, with those hydraulic anti-rollbars, VDC gives you a smooth and compliant ride or a firmer ride and then feels like you've just pitched a yacht into the next bend when it's time to corner. IMHO VDC on its own works only if you are buying a car which will literally only ever be used for Motorway cruising or similar. On an M Sport it almost defeats he object of buying an M Sport in the first place. I spent 2 years trying to convince myself that my SE handled well for a large car (At the time my budget extended to a decent spec 530d SE or a 520d M Sport, I chose engine over M Sport which I still don't regret) but the reality is that it doesn't and the M Sport suspension makes a massive difference very little ride quality tradeoff.
However this doesn't mean the passive M Sport setup is bad. Far from it. I was sufficiently happy with the way the M Sport rode and handled on the conventional suspension to not mandate Adaptive Drive in my recent search which made things much easier as there are precious few of them around with it. It's also a shame that it raises the ride height but the performance difference is easily worth the ride height tradeoff.
Not so Variable Damping Control on its own. It continues to confuse me why every single member of the motoring press is obsessed with VDC. You can't even read a lowly 520d SE review without 'VDC IS ESSENTIAL' being uttered every other paragraph. On it's own, with those hydraulic anti-rollbars, VDC gives you a smooth and compliant ride or a firmer ride and then feels like you've just pitched a yacht into the next bend when it's time to corner. IMHO VDC on its own works only if you are buying a car which will literally only ever be used for Motorway cruising or similar. On an M Sport it almost defeats he object of buying an M Sport in the first place. I spent 2 years trying to convince myself that my SE handled well for a large car (At the time my budget extended to a decent spec 530d SE or a 520d M Sport, I chose engine over M Sport which I still don't regret) but the reality is that it doesn't and the M Sport suspension makes a massive difference very little ride quality tradeoff.
My thread has arrived!!
I have strong opinions on this, it's not an easy thing to explain but here goes.
I had an E61 Msport (passive) which I grew to love. It's handing had real depth of character and beautifully neutral at the limit. Ride was firm and in my opinion great on run flats, I think they had the balance spot on. If you buy an Msport what are you expecting?
On that basis I bought another, trusting that BMW wouldn't screw it up; well they did. This time the car was new and to my spec, all the reviews said you must have AD etc etc, so I ordered that and many other options including rear steer. These options are so rare I couldn't t try them out.
After 18 months here are my thoughts.
Adaptive drive:
Before I took delivery I was given an F11 520d Msport (passive) for a few weeks it was ok handling wise though definitely softer and less precise. I thought well I have all these great options so it will be ok.
Took delivery of my car in April 2015. After running it in I started to really push it. The car had no life to it, had no feeling or sensation of driving in the normal sense. everything seemed to be geared towards being as comfortable as possible at all times. When you put it in sport and sport + mode I expected it to be firm, positive, precise; after all I had rear steer as well as trick antiroll bars and dampers.
Completely different car to the previous one. Here is the scary thing, I recon it's faster round my favourite bends, on the limit, than my previous car and I hate to say this, it's probably achieves a higher speed on those very same bends as my Cayman.........it just doesn't FEEL like it and that's the problem right there.
The car, with it's wonderful tech, tries to maximise grip on all 4 wheels but it's all so sterile.
Rear wheel steer is probabley the option I would tick again. I read all this bulls
t about how nimble and agile the car is with rear steer; that's all crap. For me the primary benefit rear steer brings is stability at high speed, and get this, rear steers party piece is that it kills UNDERSTEER.
It does, on occasion, pull off some remarkable manoeuvres at very low speed, like lane changes for example, which when it happens is and feels impressive. But as most of these systems change the rear wheel angle as the speed rises to 37mph most bends you take at that speed the rear wheels are parallel to the front so you don't get any more agility in daily normal driving. It's benefits are at VERY low speed and high speed and that applies to Porsche and everyone else's equivalent systems.
You feel the rear steer acting on the car when on the limit, neutralising the car. My previous car was so well sorted it just didn't need it.
What else.....the E61 employed some lightweight tech of it's own. magnesium, aluminium door skins and bonnet and aluminium front end. I read somewhere that the F11 reverted to steel in key areas to save on cost and simplify crash repair. Look now they have brought this all back and called it something else. CLAR.
If it were me and you loved driving I would look at the new 5 series and If that didn't work I would look at what Porsche had to offer. One of the most irritating things about my car is that it's so heavy that until April this year there were no sports orientated tyres available; the load rating for the tyres and the unusual size means there are very few options.
Overall the F11 535D is a very good car with great tech but NOT a drivers car.
I have strong opinions on this, it's not an easy thing to explain but here goes.
I had an E61 Msport (passive) which I grew to love. It's handing had real depth of character and beautifully neutral at the limit. Ride was firm and in my opinion great on run flats, I think they had the balance spot on. If you buy an Msport what are you expecting?
On that basis I bought another, trusting that BMW wouldn't screw it up; well they did. This time the car was new and to my spec, all the reviews said you must have AD etc etc, so I ordered that and many other options including rear steer. These options are so rare I couldn't t try them out.
After 18 months here are my thoughts.
Adaptive drive:
Before I took delivery I was given an F11 520d Msport (passive) for a few weeks it was ok handling wise though definitely softer and less precise. I thought well I have all these great options so it will be ok.
Took delivery of my car in April 2015. After running it in I started to really push it. The car had no life to it, had no feeling or sensation of driving in the normal sense. everything seemed to be geared towards being as comfortable as possible at all times. When you put it in sport and sport + mode I expected it to be firm, positive, precise; after all I had rear steer as well as trick antiroll bars and dampers.
Completely different car to the previous one. Here is the scary thing, I recon it's faster round my favourite bends, on the limit, than my previous car and I hate to say this, it's probably achieves a higher speed on those very same bends as my Cayman.........it just doesn't FEEL like it and that's the problem right there.
The car, with it's wonderful tech, tries to maximise grip on all 4 wheels but it's all so sterile.
Rear wheel steer is probabley the option I would tick again. I read all this bulls
t about how nimble and agile the car is with rear steer; that's all crap. For me the primary benefit rear steer brings is stability at high speed, and get this, rear steers party piece is that it kills UNDERSTEER.It does, on occasion, pull off some remarkable manoeuvres at very low speed, like lane changes for example, which when it happens is and feels impressive. But as most of these systems change the rear wheel angle as the speed rises to 37mph most bends you take at that speed the rear wheels are parallel to the front so you don't get any more agility in daily normal driving. It's benefits are at VERY low speed and high speed and that applies to Porsche and everyone else's equivalent systems.
You feel the rear steer acting on the car when on the limit, neutralising the car. My previous car was so well sorted it just didn't need it.
What else.....the E61 employed some lightweight tech of it's own. magnesium, aluminium door skins and bonnet and aluminium front end. I read somewhere that the F11 reverted to steel in key areas to save on cost and simplify crash repair. Look now they have brought this all back and called it something else. CLAR.
If it were me and you loved driving I would look at the new 5 series and If that didn't work I would look at what Porsche had to offer. One of the most irritating things about my car is that it's so heavy that until April this year there were no sports orientated tyres available; the load rating for the tyres and the unusual size means there are very few options.
Overall the F11 535D is a very good car with great tech but NOT a drivers car.
DuckDuck said:
One of the most irritating things about my car is that it's so heavy that until April this year there were no sports orientated tyres available; the load rating for the tyres and the unusual size means there are very few options.
I bought a full set of tyres for an F10 (The front tyre size is the same as the size all round on the F11) in 2014 and had a choice between Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 2, ContiSportContact 5/5P and Michelin Pilot Super Sport. How much more sports orientated did you want on an estate car? 
Fox- said:
I bought a full set of tyres for an F10 (The front tyre size is the same as the size all round on the F11) in 2014 and had a choice between Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 2, ContiSportContact 5/5P and Michelin Pilot Super Sport. How much more sports orientated did you want on an estate car?
F11 have a different load rating than the F10.Edited by DuckDuck on Sunday 30th October 23:19
Edited by DuckDuck on Sunday 30th October 23:19
Can you get a 535d in Luxury trim? - that would be my choice.
I don't need or want big wheels or sporty suspension. I do appreciate a comfortable ride, lots of standard kit and I think the Luxury exterior treatment looks a lot more classy. You have to change the wheels for no-cost-option turbines, though.
I don't need or want big wheels or sporty suspension. I do appreciate a comfortable ride, lots of standard kit and I think the Luxury exterior treatment looks a lot more classy. You have to change the wheels for no-cost-option turbines, though.
JMBMWM5 said:
Welshbeef said:
Same here very good.
My only fault with the F10 is weak brakes /that is comparing it to the RS6 though.
My M6 GC CP had week brakes also, for the size of car BMW brakes leave a lot to be desired. My only fault with the F10 is weak brakes /that is comparing it to the RS6 though.
Yet on the TTS they were fine, it seems only porsche/audi know how to fit brakes that actually suit the car.
cerb4.5lee said:
JMBMWM5 said:
Welshbeef said:
Same here very good.
My only fault with the F10 is weak brakes /that is comparing it to the RS6 though.
My M6 GC CP had week brakes also, for the size of car BMW brakes leave a lot to be desired. My only fault with the F10 is weak brakes /that is comparing it to the RS6 though.
Yet on the TTS they were fine, it seems only porsche/audi know how to fit brakes that actually suit the car.
DuckDuck said:
Overall the F11 535D is a very good car with great tech but NOT a drivers car.
DuckDuck,Thank you for the fascinating insight into rear steer. I was fearful of ordering blind, mostly because I didn't like the idea of varying ratio whilst accelerating on a constant radius bend. But the understeer prevention (of course) sounds really quite good...
On AD, I am probably more happy than you because I approach the F10 from a different direction. If I go to an Indian restaurant, I would never order fish and chips. Likewise, if I want a drivers car, I would not look at a 4 door heavy saloon (or estate in your case). I'd buy a Cayman. I actually need a barge (165 mile round trip commute), and I was getting irritated by how I could only have something that did well on the motorway and fell apart like a blancmange when presented with just a slight S bend, or vice versa.
So cars like the 535d are built to be as broad a compromise in as many fields as possible. The optimistic targets being the economy of a 1.5l triple when cruising, but 300 bhp+ when needed. S Class ride on the motorway, Caterham 7 on the bends. All with 5 seats and a boot.
For me, AD is part of that clever saloon car compromise. It allows a softer-than-others ride when needed, but a better-than-others ability and feel when cornering. The car is a compromise, but such that it has the widest extremes of compromise possible. However, not wide enough to become a proper drivers car. For that, you need fewer seats, less weight, pure and direct controls (certainly not an auto in my book) and ideally no turbos and definitely no diesel.
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