Mito 443 Project
Discussion
Yazza54 said:
I chose the gold wheels to go with the blue/black, it was always going to be those colours just wasn't sure what "scheme" on the fairings. Always thought it was a good colour combo since seeing it on the 4c8 R1s... But can't please everyone!
Sorry - not trying to have a go. It's a very beautiful thing and I'm no designer. Just interested in the thought process.hebegb said:
Sorry mate - I was unclear ( in thinking and verse) I did actually mean the exhaust bracket , mistook it from memory and the images as a seat unit support .....but now you mention the fairing support brackets too.... you are kind of drawn to them as the most significant " breach" of unbroken flow and colour match of the bike - stunning - just my tuppence from the squinty eyed layman that I am ......ps my personal viewing would be fine at approx. 10.30 Sat. morning, I shall prepare fine back bacon and egg , with a bucket of builder's tea for you - don't be late .
Bit of a cheat but it's great what you can do with a bit of 10 quid carbon wrap, no longer stands out
Really quite pleased today, feel like I'm going in the right direction. Finally got a chance to try it with the next needle up in the carbs (leaner). f**k me it was horrific. Flat as a kipper then taking off like a scalded cat and wanting to stand on its back wheel... BUT the funny thing was, it was quite happy accepting full throttle, something it always had a problem with. Whilst horrendous it was apparent I'd shifted the problem lower down and now it was too weak at lower revs/throttle openings.
Back home I went as it was frankly unrideable..and lifted the needle two steps. Blow me it's better than ever. Much happier to roll on, stronger than ever at the top end too. Feeling really positive about it now. im going to get a few more emulsion tubes for fine tuning etc. But I feel like I've really seen some potential today, absolute animal, power wheelied past a car rolling on felt awesome albeit not on purpose...! I wouldn't say it's right but I can see some light at the end of the tunnel, I was starting to think the carbs weren't much good but they just need more fiddling. Can tell it's somewhere nearer now as changing the needle height made such a big difference, before we played around with it every which way and it made very little difference.
Other bits - going to fit a bigger rad as I'm not happy with fluctuating temps, going up when giving it the beans so going to a bigger rad and a bypass thermostat to try and steady the temps. Then at some point over the winter I'll get it to John Warrington again and see how we can do on the Carbs and ignition mapping. I suspect there's more power coming but I'd be happy if the mid range is improved and nothing else.
Back home I went as it was frankly unrideable..and lifted the needle two steps. Blow me it's better than ever. Much happier to roll on, stronger than ever at the top end too. Feeling really positive about it now. im going to get a few more emulsion tubes for fine tuning etc. But I feel like I've really seen some potential today, absolute animal, power wheelied past a car rolling on felt awesome albeit not on purpose...! I wouldn't say it's right but I can see some light at the end of the tunnel, I was starting to think the carbs weren't much good but they just need more fiddling. Can tell it's somewhere nearer now as changing the needle height made such a big difference, before we played around with it every which way and it made very little difference.
Other bits - going to fit a bigger rad as I'm not happy with fluctuating temps, going up when giving it the beans so going to a bigger rad and a bypass thermostat to try and steady the temps. Then at some point over the winter I'll get it to John Warrington again and see how we can do on the Carbs and ignition mapping.
I suspect there's more power coming but I'd be happy if the mid range is improved and nothing else.
Good news,
Setting them up when they're not standard is a Black art but once set up a 2 stroke will pull from low speeds in a higher gear than many people would expect.
There's nothing better than a 2 stroke rasp when you're rolling on and off the throttle low down in traffic.
Out on my 125lc yesterday and the Fizzy today.
Setting them up when they're not standard is a Black art but once set up a 2 stroke will pull from low speeds in a higher gear than many people would expect.
There's nothing better than a 2 stroke rasp when you're rolling on and off the throttle low down in traffic.
Out on my 125lc yesterday and the Fizzy today.
Good news Ryan,
Couple of points to remember though..
You don't have powervalves so you'e always going to struggle with low end to a point. The port mapping will be biased to the top end so it's very compromised off the bottom. Just one of those things exacerbed with larger carbs....
Also, are you working through the jetting using the 1/4. 1/2. 3/4/ WO throttle method? Rememebr each jet plays a specific yet overlapping role in the jetting based on throttle position, unlike FI bikes that are based on TPS vs RPM.
Have you managed to hook up the TPS yet?? Having different ignition maps for the 1/3rd, 2/3rd and WO throttle positions will help a bit.
Have you got the Pilot/Airscrew jetting correct? If this isn't right, everything else will suffer...
lso, do you have a Boost bottle hooked up between the inlet tracts? if not, definately look at getting one set up. Absolutely helps with the low end response. Yamaha were fitting them for years, even on the 2T singles. often overlooked but worth it
re the temps, do you have a themostat fitted at the moment?
Looking at the current rad, is it possible for air to spill over the sides and away between the rad and the inside of the bodywork?
if so, you need to close this off before anything else. Air will always take the easiest path, and if it can get away around the rad it will. Look to the LC's as a reference, they had a black plastic cowl around the rad. Maybe you can fashion something similar, with an inch ali flat bar around the edge of the rad to stop air spilling over. Also maybe look at a temp activated fan to help out. Bigger rads only work if you can manage the airflow....
Couple of points to remember though..
You don't have powervalves so you'e always going to struggle with low end to a point. The port mapping will be biased to the top end so it's very compromised off the bottom. Just one of those things exacerbed with larger carbs....
Also, are you working through the jetting using the 1/4. 1/2. 3/4/ WO throttle method? Rememebr each jet plays a specific yet overlapping role in the jetting based on throttle position, unlike FI bikes that are based on TPS vs RPM.
Have you managed to hook up the TPS yet?? Having different ignition maps for the 1/3rd, 2/3rd and WO throttle positions will help a bit.
Have you got the Pilot/Airscrew jetting correct? If this isn't right, everything else will suffer...
lso, do you have a Boost bottle hooked up between the inlet tracts? if not, definately look at getting one set up. Absolutely helps with the low end response. Yamaha were fitting them for years, even on the 2T singles. often overlooked but worth it
re the temps, do you have a themostat fitted at the moment?
Looking at the current rad, is it possible for air to spill over the sides and away between the rad and the inside of the bodywork?
if so, you need to close this off before anything else. Air will always take the easiest path, and if it can get away around the rad it will. Look to the LC's as a reference, they had a black plastic cowl around the rad. Maybe you can fashion something similar, with an inch ali flat bar around the edge of the rad to stop air spilling over. Also maybe look at a temp activated fan to help out. Bigger rads only work if you can manage the airflow....
Edited by Steve Bass on Sunday 1st November 19:38
I know Steve, but the fuelling was that pants on the dyno in the mid range we knew a lot of it was to do with that. I never expected, and certainly don't want a 4 stroke linear experience 
When I say it had a flat spot today I'm talking FLAT, like f
k me it's gonna cut out flat. It'll roll on now, even to full throttle under load, albeit not with an immediate surge but no bogging, which is a good starting point! It may well need the next needle up and more playing around at the bottom end. I think I'm at the point where I have a direction to go in and it needs some proper dyno time with plenty of bits to try.
TPS not hooked up yet, plan to do that before next dyno visit. I still don't think the gearings right either but it felt much happier today than it ever has so I think I'll wait until I've got it set up better before jumping the gun on that.
I've had anywhere between 50-70 on the temp gauge and that really makes me uneasy, because of expansion rates. At the end of the day it's my well being concerned about more than the motor. It has no stat at the moment but even if it did it would likely just run above the stat temp all the time. it hasn't got a shroud as such but the fairing does direct towards it. I've already ordered the rad now so will so how that goes, mine is fairly small after all so I'm not surprised I'm having these problems.
When I say it had a flat spot today I'm talking FLAT, like fk me it's gonna cut out flat. It'll roll on now, even to full throttle under load, albeit not with an immediate surge but no bogging, which is a good starting point! It may well need the next needle up and more playing around at the bottom end. I think I'm at the point where I have a direction to go in and it needs some proper dyno time with plenty of bits to try.TPS not hooked up yet, plan to do that before next dyno visit. I still don't think the gearings right either but it felt much happier today than it ever has so I think I'll wait until I've got it set up better before jumping the gun on that.
I've had anywhere between 50-70 on the temp gauge and that really makes me uneasy, because of expansion rates. At the end of the day it's my well being concerned about more than the motor. It has no stat at the moment but even if it did it would likely just run above the stat temp all the time. it hasn't got a shroud as such but the fairing does direct towards it. I've already ordered the rad now so will so how that goes, mine is fairly small after all so I'm not surprised I'm having these problems.
Biker's Nemesis said:
Good news,
Setting them up when they're not standard is a Black art but once set up a 2 stroke will pull from low speeds in a higher gear than many people would expect.
There's nothing better than a 2 stroke rasp when you're rolling on and off the throttle low down in traffic.
Out on my 125lc yesterday and the Fizzy today.
Setting them up when they're not standard is a Black art but once set up a 2 stroke will pull from low speeds in a higher gear than many people would expect.
There's nothing better than a 2 stroke rasp when you're rolling on and off the throttle low down in traffic.
Out on my 125lc yesterday and the Fizzy today.
Cool that you're still loving it and the novelty hasn't worn off. They seem to really get under people's skin. Nostalgia I guess? Different for me cos I wasn't around when RDs, gammas, etc etc were.
Yazza54 said:
I know Steve, but the fuelling was that pants on the dyno in the mid range we knew a lot of it was to do with that. I never expected, and certainly don't want a 4 stroke linear experience When I say it had a flat spot today I'm talking FLAT, like fk me it's gonna cut out flat. It'll roll on now which is a good starting point! It may well need the next needle up and more playing around at the bottom end. I think I'm at the point where I have a direction to go in and it needs some proper dyno time with plenty of bits to try.
TPS not hooked up yet, plan to do that before next dyno visit. I still don't think the gearings right either but it felt much happier today than it ever has so I think I'll wait until I've got it set up better before jumping the gun on that.
I've had anywhere between 50-70 on the temp gauge and that really makes me uneasy, because of expansion rates. At the end of the day it's my well being concerned about more than the motor. It has no stat at the moment but even if it did it would likely just run above the stat temp all the time. it hasn't got a shroud as such but the fairing does direct towards it. I've already ordered the rad now so will so how that goes, mine is fairly small after all so I'm not surprised I'm having these problems.
When you fit the new radmake sure air can't get between the sides of the fairing and the edge of the rad. Whether you use stick on foam or whatever, you must seal it up. When I say it had a flat spot today I'm talking FLAT, like fk me it's gonna cut out flat. It'll roll on now which is a good starting point! It may well need the next needle up and more playing around at the bottom end. I think I'm at the point where I have a direction to go in and it needs some proper dyno time with plenty of bits to try.TPS not hooked up yet, plan to do that before next dyno visit. I still don't think the gearings right either but it felt much happier today than it ever has so I think I'll wait until I've got it set up better before jumping the gun on that.
I've had anywhere between 50-70 on the temp gauge and that really makes me uneasy, because of expansion rates. At the end of the day it's my well being concerned about more than the motor. It has no stat at the moment but even if it did it would likely just run above the stat temp all the time. it hasn't got a shroud as such but the fairing does direct towards it. I've already ordered the rad now so will so how that goes, mine is fairly small after all so I'm not surprised I'm having these problems.
also, I was looking at my mates casings the other day and the feed from the waterpump is tiny, couldn't believe how small the orifice was. Did you open it up at all?? if not, have a look at it and see what can be done. alternatively, electric water pump and bypass the crap mechanical pump
As for the jetting, totally understand the desire for the 'hit' but you're alwways going to struggle with the non PV config and larger carbs. Considering the 350 LC ran 28mm carbs vs your 36's it's always going to be an uphill battle. But also have a look at the 'Boost bottle' solution. Won't be a panacea but deffinately helps. It's not for nothing every road 2T since the LC had pipes or such off the manifolds
mark the throttle with 1/4-1/2-3/4 marks and set the jetting based on holding the throttle steady at that position and jetting accordingly. By holding the throttle steady at these positions, you're restricting which jets are in play and then it's only the motors airflow thats determining how much fuel is getting pulled in. Then you can set the jets. But you MUST get the pilot right otherwisw everything goes cockeyed as each jet builds on the previous. So if you strar wrong, you stay wrong..
Not wishing to teach the sucking of eggs but just reminding
And i think i have the RS finally sorted and running well. Pulls hard from 8k and not too shabby below. Temps are more stable with the thermostat fitted as well
Edited by Steve Bass on Sunday 1st November 19:53
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