Are 125s actually fun?

[srob]

Yep, there's so much temptation to get your 'fun' kicks from acceleration on big bikes - and there's nothing wrong with that, I did it too - but I fear some people overlook the other fun bits.

Like cornering.

You can throw a little bike about far easier, and hustle down back lanes faster on a small bike than you could ever dream of on a bigger one. You only have to look at the apex speeds of the various classes in MotoGP to see that the smaller bikes are able to carry more speed.

And there's the question I guess, do you get your thrills from corner speed or straightline speed? The most fun bike I've ever had on the road was an RS250 as it had a balance between the size of a small bike but with a good kick up the arse of grunt, but would run out of puff at 120-130. I must be in the minority though as 1L bikes are the norm for the road now, and 600s are beginner bikes it seems and nobody makes a supersport 250 any more

[Biker's Nemesis]

125's are not fun only nobbers ride them

[LuS1fer]

Biker's Nemesis said:

125's are not fun only nobbers ride them

I can't see your profile in work so apologies if this is a whoosh I am missing.

My only observation is that, as a proportion of the biking population, the most nobbers I have seen tend to ride bigger bikes - either far too fast (over-confident poseurs) or far too slowly (incompetent wobbly return to biking blokes).
Believe me, it was hard, with a full licence, to walk out of Thunder Road with the 125 I needed, not the big bike I could have had.
I suppose that make me old and wise ... and not before time.

[Hooli]

srob said:

Of course 125s are fun - any bike is fun in the right situation!

I'd be interested to know at what capacity people think a bike stops being fun. I assume they'd think a CB500 more fun than a Honda RS125, because it's got a bigger engine

It's not capacity, it's performance that limits the fun. When your sat there thinking 'I can walk faster' it's not fun. Probably why your old bikes are such fun, they might be slow (mostly) but feel fast

[Tim85]

I get at Motorsport level the well sorted 125s or 250s are awesome, but the average rs125 or honda 125 I just don't see cornering any quicker than an r6 or r1. It's not like many of us could ride a 125 at racer level.
99% of the time I corner at speeds that the corner dictates not my bike.
How slow do you all travel to think that a 125 wouldn't be left for dead on the majority of uk roads with the average rider. Even on a twisty road.
Just because people think 125s are gutless and not as fun doesn't mean we're drag lovers. There's plenty of big sweepers where I've cornered faster than 70mph which is as fast as most 125s will ever go at best.

I don't think anyone's categorically saying a 125 can't be fun at some point but 99% of the time for a grown man that's not anorexic I just don't see the attraction as a fun toy.

I think the difference i see is. Yeah a 125 can be fun in the right situation. A pedal and pop 50 is fun in the right circumstances. Would it be fun to live with 24/7. Not for me, no chance

[LiamB]

Biker's Nemesis said:

125's are not fun only nobbers ride them

It's the 50's that are for the speshul ones.

[Hooli]

Tim85 said:

I get at Motorsport level the well sorted 125s or 250s are awesome, but the average rs125 or honda 125 I just don't see cornering any quicker than an r6 or r1. It's not like many of us could ride a 125 at racer level.
99% of the time I corner at speeds that the corner dictates not my bike.
How slow do you all travel to think that a 125 wouldn't be left for dead on the majority of uk roads with the average rider. Even on a twisty road.
Just because people think 125s are gutless and not as fun doesn't mean we're drag lovers. There's plenty of big sweepers where I've cornered faster than 70mph which is as fast as most 125s will ever go at best.

I don't think anyone's categorically saying a 125 can't be fun at some point but 99% of the time for a grown man that's not anorexic I just don't see the attraction as a fun toy.

I think the difference i see is. Yeah a 125 can be fun in the right situation. A pedal and pop 50 is fun in the right circumstances. Would it be fun to live with 24/7. Not for me, no chance

I used to know a lad on a CBR125 who no-one could keep up with on one twisty road, he never shut the throttle even slightly & just threw it through the bends in a way the heavier bikes couldn't match.

[Tim85]

Hooli said:

I used to know a lad on a CBR125 who no-one could keep up with on one twisty road, he never shut the throttle even slightly & just threw it through the bends in a way the heavier bikes couldn't match.

But was he useless on a bigger bike? I'm sure he was just as competent.

Obviously there's the 1% that can ride the machines to the max and i don't doubt there are people that could show me my arse on a 125. But on most roads I'm sure they'd be just as quick if not more so on an average 600 sports bike

[sc0tt]

srob said:

hustle down back lanes faster on a small bike than you could ever dream of on a bigger one.

100% Incorrect.

[srob]

sc0tt said:

srob said:

hustle down back lanes faster on a small bike than you could ever dream of on a bigger one.

100% Incorrect.

Have you ridden a 125 two-stroke sports bike (be it a road sports or supermoto/off road style sports) to be so “100%” certain, or are you just basing his on having ridden a 1L bike on the road for a year or two?

The acceleration of those little bikes is very, very rapid, as is the stopping power, as is the turn in, the width is tiny and ground clearance is massive. They also have narrow tyres and small brakes so changing direction is far quicker too.

I’m not talking long sweeping bends, I’m talking hairpins and right-angled bends on narrow roads.

If you haven’t tried it, then you should as it really is good fun!

[LiamB]

Everyone should have a go on an unrestricted RS125 at some point, I don't think anyone that hasn't ridden one believes what they are like.

[sc0tt]

srob said:

Have you ridden a 125 two-stroke sports bike (be it a road sports or supermoto/off road style sports) to be so “100%” certain, or are you just basing his on having ridden a 1L bike on the road for a year or two?

The acceleration of those little bikes is very, very rapid, as is the stopping power, as is the turn in, the width is tiny and ground clearance is massive. They also have narrow tyres and small brakes so changing direction is far quicker too.

I’m not talking long sweeping bends, I’m talking hairpins and right-angled bends on narrow roads.

If you haven’t tried it, then you should as it really is good fun!

I'm wondering what you are basing your information on? I'm not saying they aren't a hoot, but I think you are wrong.

[Biker's Nemesis]

LuS1fer said:

I can't see your profile in work so apologies if this is a whoosh I am missing.

My only observation is that, as a proportion of the biking population, the most nobbers I have seen tend to ride bigger bikes - either far too fast (over-confident poseurs) or far too slowly (incompetent wobbly return to biking blokes).
Believe me, it was hard, with a full licence, to walk out of Thunder Road with the 125 I needed, not the big bike I could have had.
I suppose that make me old and wise ... and not before time.

Yep whoosh parrot needed

[RizzoTheRat]

Tim85 said:

I get at Motorsport level the well sorted 125s or 250s are awesome, but the average rs125 or honda 125 I just don't see cornering any quicker than an r6 or r1. It's not like many of us could ride a 125 at racer level.
99% of the time I corner at speeds that the corner dictates not my bike.
How slow do you all travel to think that a 125 wouldn't be left for dead on the majority of uk roads with the average rider. Even on a twisty road.
Just because people think 125s are gutless and not as fun doesn't mean we're drag lovers. There's plenty of big sweepers where I've cornered faster than 70mph which is as fast as most 125s will ever go at best.

I don't think anyone's categorically saying a 125 can't be fun at some point but 99% of the time for a grown man that's not anorexic I just don't see the attraction as a fun toy.

I think the difference i see is. Yeah a 125 can be fun in the right situation. A pedal and pop 50 is fun in the right circumstances. Would it be fun to live with 24/7. Not for me, no chance

You appear to be suggesting that fun=fast, which I would dispute. A low performance bike can be fun at speeds which would be boring on a more capable machine. Plus on most roads going fast enough to have fun on a high performance bike means licence losing speeds.

[srob]

sc0tt said:

I'm wondering what you are basing your information on? I'm not saying they aren't a hoot, but I think you are wrong.

Which bit?

A 125 will weigh in at ~120-130kg (I’m guessing, think my 250 was 140kg with twin disks and another cylinder/pipe and chunkier running gear) so will accelerate and brake well due to a low mass to get moving, and stopped.

They have narrow – therefore lightweight - wheels & tyres and small brake disks, so there’s a lower gyroscopic force and less unsprung weight, making them easier to change direction quickly. The narrower tyres will also help to flick from side to side due to their smaller radius cross profile.

They’re a single cylinder two stroke (both of which make the engine narrow), helping with ground clearance. Typically they package nicely too, with a higher engine due to lower overall engine height. This could raise the CoG, but there’s less in the top of a 2T than a 4 so it’s easily balanced in the 2T’s favour.

A two-stroke will accelerate incredibly hard, admittedly for a shorter amount of time whilst they’re in the powerband. They’re also geared for acceleration, which helps between very tight bends.

[Hooli]

Tim85 said:

But was he useless on a bigger bike? I'm sure he was just as competent.

Obviously there's the 1% that can ride the machines to the max and i don't doubt there are people that could show me my arse on a 125. But on most roads I'm sure they'd be just as quick if not more so on an average 600 sports bike

No idea, last time I saw him he was still on a cbt.

[GTIR]

LuS1fer said:

One of the best bikes for fun, that I ever rode, was an old Suzuki GT125 2 stroke.
.

Bloody hell.

As I read that one revved up in my head! Real distinctive sound.
I had one in about 83, I was sure it was a 250 but I doubt it would have been, had loads of electrical issues with it though. I can't remember for the life of me what happened to it though.

I might have swapped it...

[sc0tt]

srob said:

Which bit?

This bit

srob said:

hustle down back lanes faster on a small bike than you could ever dream of on a bigger one.

There is no way. 100%. I guarantee it.

[srob]

sc0tt said:

srob said:

Which bit?

This bit

srob said:

hustle down back lanes faster on a small bike than you could ever dream of on a bigger one.

There is no way. 100%. I guarantee it.

Did you miss the rest of my post. You know, the bit where I explained on what I’d based my opinion? The physics, bike design, road type etc? Basically, the bit of my post that you didn’t quote. Because that explains it.

I could also add that I’ve ridden the two types of bikes, so my own personal experience can be included too. Have you ridden both? I know you mentioned you’ve ridden a 125 scooter, but that’s not what we’re talking about.

So I’d like to throw the question back to you and ask how you can categorically state that my opinion is 100% incorrect?

[sc0tt]

srob said:

Did you miss the rest of my post. You know, the bit where I explained on what I’d based my opinion? The physics, bike design, road type etc? Basically, the bit of my post that you didn’t quote. Because that explains it.

I could also add that I’ve ridden the two types of bikes, so my own personal experience can be included too. Have you ridden both? I know you mentioned you’ve ridden a 125 scooter, but that’s not what we’re talking about.

So I’d like to throw the question back to you and ask how you can categorically state that my opinion is 100% incorrect?

Yes I have ridden an unrestricted 125 many moons ago.
Yes I have ridden a litre bike.
No I have not ridden them on the same road and raced.
But the old arse dyno tells me that a litre bike would be quicker.

We can agree to disagree. I don't really care.