I need a track....
Discussion
All I'm saying is Johnny Upright does this course and goes in as an IAM beardy and comes out as Marquez's new rival in their opinion. You won't learn much in less than an hour on track. I did it in 2006 as the first at time is ever been on track. It blew my mind then. It doesn't now.
Ron Haslam "Premier Course" i.e. 600's shouldn't be viewed as an instruction day... it should only be seen as a very good introduction to track riding, a bit of hand holding etc. for sure you can get some tips on your riding, body position, track technique etc. for 5 mins between the 3 sessions, it may give a foundation to improve your basic fast/track riding but that's about it... You get a mix of people on the course from very capable to really shouldn't be there, but the way they run the time on track it just about works!
I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
LoonR1 said:
All I'm saying is Johnny Upright does this course and goes in as an IAM beardy and comes out as Marquez's new rival in their opinion. You won't learn much in less than an hour on track. I did it in 2006 as the first at time is ever been on track. It blew my mind then. It doesn't now.
You said in 2 lines what took me 4 paragraphs 
you hit the nail on the head...
LoonR1 said:
dapearson said:
And they use CBF1000s, which don't quite have the legs of the 600RRs down the straights.
You're taking the piss. You really think that a 600RR ridden by a novice will be able to outdrag a CBF1000 being ridden by an instructor. I've read some crap in my time on here but that's pretty impressive. I watch one of their instructors run a 1999 R6 round a track faster than most other amateur racers can manage on a 1000cc bike from 2005 on.
Charger500 said:
Ron Haslam "Premier Course" i.e. 600's shouldn't be viewed as an instruction day... it should only be seen as a very good introduction to track riding, a bit of hand holding etc. for sure you can get some tips on your riding, body position, track technique etc. for 5 mins between the 3 sessions, it may give a foundation to improve your basic fast/track riding but that's about it... You get a mix of people on the course from very capable to really shouldn't be there, but the way they run the time on track it just about works!
I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
100% agree. I thought it was a great introduction, but a bike trackday regular wouldn't like it.I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
Charger500 said:
Ron Haslam "Premier Course" i.e. 600's shouldn't be viewed as an instruction day... it should only be seen as a very good introduction to track riding, a bit of hand holding etc. for sure you can get some tips on your riding, body position, track technique etc. for 5 mins between the 3 sessions, it may give a foundation to improve your basic fast/track riding but that's about it... You get a mix of people on the course from very capable to really shouldn't be there, but the way they run the time on track it just about works!
I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
That's essentially what I thought. I've been on the course a few times, initially after not riding for well over a decade and wanting to explore my riding ability again, and mainly resulting from being pissed off riding on the road on my return to 2 wheels... other visits have been more for convenience and going along with a couple of friends who haven't been riding long...
I can highly recommend it as an introduction to track riding, but if you're already track savvy I doubt its for you... you'd be better off hiring you're own instructor for a day!
I've not been on the Elite course on the 'blades but it's likely you'll get better/specific instruction with 1 to 1 instruction, more track time and data logging if you're so good you're not sure what you're doing wrong...
The only tuition I had was the superbike school at knockhill with Mackenzie and McGuiness. 40 riders to 2 or 3 instructors, their remit for the day was just generally to have newcomers go home and feel like they are riding Gods. I gathered this with the sheer politeness and positive feedback I got. I'm guessing its on a par with the Ron day. Send them home having a taste for it and them all happy leaving great reviews.
If I can I'm gonna book onto the James whitham day at croft next month. At least with a structured one to one instruction almost I can tell him to cut the bulls
t and tear my riding apart. I'd sooner an instructor go, your fking st heres what to do rather than, "yes your going good for a newcomer". 
creampuff said:
Anyway, back to my question:
If I want a loan bike and leathers then is Ron Haslam the only option, other than paying about an extra £400 at CSS?
Nothing against Ron Haslam, it is just a bit of a drive to get there and back and I'd prefer weekends.
CSS will also give you a full day rather than just 3 sessions so double the cost of the RH day and then whats the difference ? Also CSS teaches the foundations of a system rather than 'just follow me and nail it' type instruction which truth be told you can get at any trackday.If I want a loan bike and leathers then is Ron Haslam the only option, other than paying about an extra £400 at CSS?
Nothing against Ron Haslam, it is just a bit of a drive to get there and back and I'd prefer weekends.
Other option, pick up some leathers on eBay, book a No Limits trackday, use their excellent instructors sessions 2, 4 and 6 and rent a bike from Smallboys who supports their days.
I know no one that wasn't a complete newbie have anything much good to say about RH because they are beyond the 'initial ego boost' stage.
There are many many experienced riders who have gone to CSS and loved it, and benefited from it, if it wasn't great there would be far fewer riders doing levels 2 3 and 4 but they sell out virtually every event at all levels, how many people go back to RH to keep building their skills ?
Another idea. is a hybrid one, take the No Limits / Smallboys route and book Mike Edwards for instruction. Make that cheaper by taking a mate and sharing Mike.
dapearson said:
Read what i wrote again. I was talking specifically about the STRAIGHTS!!!!!!!!!
And you're still wrong. You won't carry anywhere near the corner speed that an instructor will and that will negate any attempt to be quicker on the straights. You also won't wrong the 600s neck and will probably change up 4-5000 rpm too early. creampuff said:
Hmmmmm, I'm taking a few months off next year. I may look at doing CSS in either Sydney or Los Angeles. Still costs $1,000 (£600) with bike hire though. Or I suppose I could take the Pan European for another punt down the Nurburgring......
Do CSS at Laguna, I did my Levels 3 & 4 there, its awesome for it.When in Oz do a trackday at Phillip Island, they used to be run by CSS but not sure they are anymore, either way its a good circuit but not as good as Laguna ..... you can rent a bike and all the it there through the organisers direct.
LoonR1 said:
And you're still wrong. You won't carry anywhere near the corner speed that an instructor will and that will negate any attempt to be quicker on the straights. You also won't wrong the 600s neck and will probably change up 4-5000 rpm too early.
How on earth can i be wrong when it was something i witnessed for myself!?!?!?!?!?And the lad i was with said the same thing (in fact, he said it to me first!!). The use of CBFs meant that when we were pinning it down the straights, we caught the instructor half way along and had to lift.
In the first session i did short-shift out of habit (i ride a bandit 1250 normally), but soon got out of that habit.
I don't know why i'm defending myself. Just reporting facts that you seem to reject as if you were riding pillion with me.
dapearson said:
How on earth can i be wrong when it was something i witnessed for myself!?!?!?!?!?
And the lad i was with said the same thing (in fact, he said it to me first!!). The use of CBFs meant that when we were pinning it down the straights, we caught the instructor half way along and had to lift.
In the first session i did short-shift out of habit (i ride a bandit 1250 normally), but soon got out of that habit.
I don't know why i'm defending myself. Just reporting facts that you seem to reject as if you were riding pillion with me.
You may well have had it "pinned" but I'll guarantee the instructor didn't. If they opened the bike up you wouldn't see which way they went. You may think you're an awesome rider on track. Newsflash you're highly unlikely to be. And the lad i was with said the same thing (in fact, he said it to me first!!). The use of CBFs meant that when we were pinning it down the straights, we caught the instructor half way along and had to lift.
In the first session i did short-shift out of habit (i ride a bandit 1250 normally), but soon got out of that habit.
I don't know why i'm defending myself. Just reporting facts that you seem to reject as if you were riding pillion with me.
LoonR1 said:
You may well have had it "pinned" but I'll guarantee the instructor didn't. If they opened the bike up you wouldn't see which way they went. You may think you're an awesome rider on track. Newsflash you're highly unlikely to be.
Nope. Far from it. I've never said i was anything other than a novice.So an instructor on a slower bike can out run a novice in a straight line. What are they, Jedi?!
Try reading what i wrote AGAIN you idiot. IN A STRAIGHT LINE!!!!!! Yes over a lap they'd be miles away! I get it. Why the f
k don't you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Edited by dapearson on Tuesday 16th September 18:59
dapearson said:
LoonR1 said:
You may well have had it "pinned" but I'll guarantee the instructor didn't. If they opened the bike up you wouldn't see which way they went. You may think you're an awesome rider on track. Newsflash you're highly unlikely to be.
Nope. Far from it. I've never said i was anything other than a novice.So an instructor on a slower bike can out run a novice in a straight line. What are they, Jedi?!
Fed up arguing with you. I can explain it, but can't help you to understand.
moanthebairns said:
the exit speed would/could be double yours, so yes, given the right corner and straight combination, no problem.
Yes it COULD. I'm sure if they were trying it would.But it wasn't. Maybe for our own safety.
My point is, and always has been, that ON THE DAY, when I WAS THERE, we both found ourselves lifting.
Why has this been made into such a big deal by Loon.
FFS
dapearson said:
Yes it COULD. I'm sure if they were trying it would.
But it wasn't. Maybe for our own safety.
My point is, and always has been, that ON THE DAY, when I WAS THERE, we both found ourselves lifting.
Why has this been made into such a big deal by Loon.
FFS
Why? Because you're talking bBut it wasn't. Maybe for our own safety.
My point is, and always has been, that ON THE DAY, when I WAS THERE, we both found ourselves lifting.
Why has this been made into such a big deal by Loon.
FFS
ks. I reckon I'd probably beat you out of Coppice to the Foggy Esses on a 125 with you on my S1000RR. I know other riders who could do the same to me. Why? Because they can carry far more corner speed than you. Don't think because you caught an instructor that they had their bike pinned too and the bike is slower they were probably at 30% throttle and trying to stop you crashing at the Esses. Gassing Station | Biker Banter | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff