ultimate unlimited race bike

[itannum990]

Couldn't sleep last night so I was pondering what the ultimate unlimited race bike would take shape as. Imagine the redbull x-newey jobby. No rules, no limits, no budget.

Say for circuit and roads.. with a couple of crates of spare parts to enable the switch to be made.

Only constraints would be two wheels, rider on board, and vaguely pump fuel.



For me, it would be a narrow angle v6 - 1400cc, no point having any more power as traction-wheely electronics would be constantly reining it back, but still more than enough for very high top speeds despite godawful aero. Wouldn't go with dustbin fairing, just unworkable but a shape which allows the rider to get fully tucked behind, I think modern bikes are about as good as it can get in this regard.
Active suspension gps controlled, I'll go with conventional forks as engine won't leave enough space for anything else - but every aspect of setup constantly self adjusting including headstock angle, wheelbase and ride height as well as damping and preload controlled by servos for every section of the circuit, no need to compromise one area to aid another..

Would need large fuel tank (s?) Near 30 litres ideally, right underneath rider so weight distribution isnt moving fore and aft. Titanium exhausts, titanium composite crankshaft and rods (with dlc coating on bearing surfaces) As far as I have seen aluminium is still king for frames, so we'll stick with a minimal ally moncoque subframed design, with carbon-kevlar composite fairings and everything else, pegs bars etc.

Of course the main component that holds a racing bike back is the rider - for him improvements are made (slightly) by use of human growth hormone, to keep weight to a minimum, only lean 'useful' mass and speed up injury recovery, tacrine to aid circuit familiarisation, and epo for fitness and endurance. That and being the bd test tube son of Marc Márquez and Micheal Dunlop in the first place.

Gentlemen, how would you proceed?

[Fleegle]

Would it have jetwash-proof electrical connectors?

[LiamB]

Lay off the crack, you'll sleep easier.

And it needs a cup holder, I saw a BMW GS with one the other day and it was AMAZING

[itannum990]

Fleegle said:

Would it have jetwash-proof electrical connectors?

I hadn't thought deeply about the intricacies, but ok yes.

And an ashtray. But no cupholder. That would be daft.

[ylovebuffalo]

I'd of thoguht some form of active aero...that would allow air braking etc?

[itannum990]

I'd considered that, but A: wings wouldn't work, and B:there is a bloody great lump of movable aerodynamic device right in the centre of the bike..


Oh yes I forgot.. pneumatic valves, seamless shift, yes you'd need to throw the engine away after a race but you'd win.. but how would you be beaten?

Edited by itannum990 on Monday 29th September 12:40

Edited by itannum990 on Monday 29th September 13:08

[srob]

It wouldn't have a four stroke engine, it wouldn't have USD forks, it wouldn't have a headstock, it (probably) wouldn't have a swingarm rear suspension. It wouldn't have fixed bodywork. It wouldn't have a frame, it wouldn't have an ECU. It wouldn't have chain drive, it wouldn't have a gearbox, it wouldn't have conventional disk brakes. I doubt it'd have hubs, I doubt it would have bearings.

Or didn't you mean quite that unlimited

[RemaL]

2 wheel drive? just a though

[ylovebuffalo]

itannum990 said:

I'd considered that, but A: wings wouldn't work, and B:there is a bloody great lump of movable aerodynamic device right in the centre of the bike..


Oh yes I forgot.. pneumatic valves, seamless shift, yes you'd need to throw the engine away after a race but you'd win.. but how would you be beaten?

Edited by itannum990 on Monday 29th September 12:40

Edited by itannum990 on Monday 29th September 13:08

I was thinking of panels/flaps that flip out in front of the riders legs upping the frontal area of the bike hence becoming an air brake. You wouldnt want any sort of air braking on the rider themselves as it would rip them off the bike like opening a parachute. Ultimately the braking will be determined by the grip available and how much load you could take through the riders arms without them snapping

[itannum990]

srob said:

It wouldn't have a four stroke engine, it wouldn't have USD forks, it wouldn't have a headstock, it (probably) wouldn't have a swingarm rear suspension. It wouldn't have fixed bodywork. It wouldn't have a frame, it wouldn't have an ECU. It wouldn't have chain drive, it wouldn't have a gearbox, it wouldn't have conventional disk brakes. I doubt it'd have hubs, I doubt it would have bearings.

Or didn't you mean quite that unlimited

Why not? My example is limited only by my imagination, please describe yours? (Dont say Tron bike..)

[itannum990]

ylovebuffalo said:

I was thinking of panels/flaps that flip out in front of the riders legs upping the frontal area of the bike hence becoming an air brake. You wouldnt want any sort of air braking on the rider themselves as it would rip them off the bike like opening a parachute. Ultimately the braking will be determined by the grip available and how much load you could take through the riders arms without them snapping

Yeah now I am with you. That would work, as you say up to the limit of the rider. How far are we from that point now I wonder?



Two wheel drive..? Hasn't that been tried and found to be grossly inefficient, plus front wheel is basically not in a position to provide much drive at most points?

[MrKipling43]

You'd definitely have active aero of some kind - would help reduce the wheelies by having a huge effect at 'slow' speed, winding off as speed went up to decrease drag, reducing the need for electronic intervention.

[srob]

itannum990 said:

srob said:

It wouldn't have a four stroke engine, it wouldn't have USD forks, it wouldn't have a headstock, it (probably) wouldn't have a swingarm rear suspension. It wouldn't have fixed bodywork. It wouldn't have a frame, it wouldn't have an ECU. It wouldn't have chain drive, it wouldn't have a gearbox, it wouldn't have conventional disk brakes. I doubt it'd have hubs, I doubt it would have bearings.

Or didn't you mean quite that unlimited

Why not? My example is limited only by my imagination, please describe yours? (Dont say Tron bike..)

You're thinking that the ultimate bike would be a derivative of the current design, I'm fairly sure it wouldn't be. All current race bikes are made within some constraint or another, whether the rules of the series, the pressures of what people want on the road or simply budget.

I'm sure that a two-stroke could be made far faster than a four stroke, with the budget and development. You only have to look at how they went from 500cc two-strokes to 1000cc four strokes to acknowledge the difference. What would a 1L two-stroke be like? Or a rotary engine - not necessarily a wankle? With variable compression, a remote receiver ECU that could adapt for weight, tyre pressures, location etc, fluid drive, active hub centre style steering, hubless chassis bolted straight to the stressed engine?

And with bodywork, why would it have any fixed surfaces? Why couldn't a 'bubble' be created with directional air vents?

All of the above may not work as it's five minutes of thinking about it from a bloke, but I'm sure that there's a whole lot of completely different technology that would piddle all over a current MotoGP bike, given a blank sheet, a blank cheque and a facility full of engineers. I for one would love to see it happen, but it won't

Oh and two wheel drive wouldn't just aid with getting the power down. How about a bike that could sense that you're about to lose the front and back the rear wheel off and the front on, pulling it around like a front wheel drive car approach? Plus stability under engine braking.

[itannum990]

Many good points sir. I had discounted two strokes too, if only development was still ongoing we could be seeing insane outputs from super lightweight engines. Again with hub centre steering, as far as I understand it, this is not ruled out of top level race series's is it? I'm sure there have been superbikes running it fairly recently, just not as competitive as conventional forks?
Active aero definitely. Kawasaki seem to agree