Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. Vol 3

Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. Vol 3

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Big Al.

Original Poster:

68,798 posts

257 months

Tuesday 23rd December 2014
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Continued from here

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

It's all yours.......


Blib

43,793 posts

196 months

Tuesday 23rd December 2014
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Is it warm in here? Or, is it me?

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Tuesday 23rd December 2014
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Blib said:
Is it warm in here? Or, is it me?
Maybe somebody has turned up the GCH while they still can sonar

There's some detailed discussion of the Mann case over at CA for anyone interested, it looks like Steve M is also keeping the heat on:

http://climateaudit.org/2014/12/22/oral-argument-1...

Meanwhile there's "plant food for thought" at Watts, here's a taster to whet appetites:

WUWT said:
Therefore, CO2 lags temperature at all measured time scales. CO2 does not drive temperature; temperature (among other factors) drives CO2.
Dig down at this Paleo Study link.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/12/15/paleo-study-...

perdu

4,884 posts

198 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Coo

Look it's all fields round here...






And trees.

Breathing gratefully, CO2.

Andy Zarse

10,868 posts

246 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Hmm looks like Mark Stein's lawyers are being ripped to shreds by Mann's...

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Andy Zarse said:
Hmm looks like Mark Stein's lawyers are being ripped to shreds by Mann's...
They don't have a detailed working knowledge and can't or won't acquire it in the time available. As you can see from SM's commentary they are missing open goals.

Steve M is a brilliant statistician - on a wider basis and except for his time disappearing even more, it's a pity he didn't do a law degree over the weekends. Even so he's one of the PPE good guys.

Mrr T

12,152 posts

264 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Andy Zarse said:
Hmm looks like Mark Stein's lawyers are being ripped to shreds by Mann's...
Why do you say that?

As far as I know the Mark Steyn case is some way from trial. Steyn has fulfilled the Mann lawyers discovery requests who are now resisting the discovery requests on Mann. The case will take some time to come to court.

The current hearing are all about the publishers appear against the SLAPP ruling. Which is nothing to do with climate change.

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Mrr T said:
Andy Zarse said:
Hmm looks like Mark Stein's lawyers are being ripped to shreds by Mann's...
Why do you say that?

As far as I know the Mark Steyn case is some way from trial. Steyn has fulfilled the Mann lawyers discovery requests who are now resisting the discovery requests on Mann. The case will take some time to come to court.

The current hearing are all about the publishers appear against the SLAPP ruling. Which is nothing to do with climate change.
Nothing at all, if you divorce the appeal from its context.

Some discussion here from May, but given the speed with which these things proceed...

http://rankexploits.com/musings/2014/more-mann-can...

Mrr T

12,152 posts

264 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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turbobloke said:
Mrr T said:
Andy Zarse said:
Hmm looks like Mark Stein's lawyers are being ripped to shreds by Mann's...
Why do you say that?

As far as I know the Mark Steyn case is some way from trial. Steyn has fulfilled the Mann lawyers discovery requests who are now resisting the discovery requests on Mann. The case will take some time to come to court.

The current hearing are all about the publishers appear against the SLAPP ruling. Which is nothing to do with climate change.
Nothing at all, if you divorce the appeal from its context.

Some discussion here from May, but given the speed with which these things proceed...

http://rankexploits.com/musings/2014/more-mann-can...
My apologies should have posted "appealing against the SLAPP ruling".

Mr GrimNasty

8,172 posts

169 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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I thought this was worth bringing over from the end of the old thread.

Chris Watton said:
What's this about making up 'ocean acidification', to prop up the MMGW/CC cause?

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/12/23/touchy-feely...

If NOAA have made up this by omitting certain data that is critical to form a balanced conclusion, and they get away with it, we really are in trouble.

Lies are now permitted, indeed, perhaps lies are the new truth, and vice versa.

I liken 'climate science' to a Medieval religion, complete with inquisitors and flagellants! And still they make fortunes out of this, still have jobs and pensions, by pushing lies and deceit - and still the governments base energy plans around this tripe!

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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Mr GrimNasty said:
I thought this was worth bringing over from the end of the old thread.

Chris Watton said:
What's this about making up 'ocean acidification', to prop up the MMGW/CC cause?

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/12/23/touchy-feely...

If NOAA have made up this by omitting certain data that is critical to form a balanced conclusion, and they get away with it, we really are in trouble.

Lies are now permitted, indeed, perhaps lies are the new truth, and vice versa.

I liken 'climate science' to a Medieval religion, complete with inquisitors and flagellants! And still they make fortunes out of this, still have jobs and pensions, by pushing lies and deceit - and still the governments base energy plans around this tripe!
Good call. So, a brief refresher for anyone interested...I appreciate this will not be new to many thread participants...

1 Oceans are permanently slightly alkaline.

2 The scale of acidity and alkalinity is the pH scale, NB this is a logarithmic scale

3 Oceans are around 8 +or- ~0.3 on this scale

4 Oceans they are a permanently buffered solution: CaCO3 (from limestone rocks/coral/shells etc) is insoluble in water but reacts with carbonic acid (H2O + CO2) to make Ca(HCO3)2 aka calcium bicarbonate or calciun hydrogencarbonate for modernists.

5 Ca(HCO3)2 is soluble in water and is alkaline which, via the common ion effect, compensates for any extra acidity caused by extra dissolved CO2 as per normal buffer solution operation.

6 As Prof Ian Plimer so well expressed it: "The oceans can only become acidic if the earth runs out of ocean-exposed rocks."

hidetheelephants

23,772 posts

192 months

Wednesday 24th December 2014
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In Cosmos Carl Sagan described astrology as 'a mixture of fuzzy thinking and pious fraud'; not a bad summation of what we're dealing with here, even if he was firmly in the 'OMG! Climaggeddon!' camp.

voyds9

8,488 posts

282 months

Friday 26th December 2014
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Managed to get a covering of Viner in Sheffield over the last hour and still coming down fast.


Jasandjules

69,825 posts

228 months

Friday 26th December 2014
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voyds9 said:
Managed to get a covering of Viner in Sheffield over the last hour and still coming down fast.
You must be imagining it, because snow is a thing of the past....

Beati Dogu

8,862 posts

138 months

Friday 26th December 2014
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Chris Watton said:
I liken 'climate science' to a Medieval religion, complete with inquisitors and flagellants! And still they make fortunes out of this, still have jobs and pensions, by pushing lies and deceit - and still the governments base energy plans around this tripe!
Certainly carbon trading is just a straight rip from the Catholic church's selling of indulgences.

At least they got St Peters out of it though.

Foppo

2,344 posts

123 months

Friday 26th December 2014
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Listen on you tube to Naomi Klein journalist.

mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

254 months

Saturday 27th December 2014
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Jasandjules said:
voyds9 said:
Managed to get a covering of Viner in Sheffield over the last hour and still coming down fast.
You must be imagining it, because snow is a thing of the past....
Yes, I'm in Sheffield, imagining very wet feet because the imaginary Viner caught me imaginarily napping.

Thank god it's a thing of the past, or I'd be very uncomfortable now.

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Monday 29th December 2014
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Wind is doing a great job providing less than 5% of demand at 1.9 GW - just as well it's so warm and toasty and nobody is at work today.

Mr GrimNasty

8,172 posts

169 months

Monday 29th December 2014
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That's actually better than previous cold spells (where 0.1GW was typical), but then this hasn't been a serious cold spell, but it's still telling that the wind contribution drops to between 0 and 2.5 over the last period as soon as the cold weather arrived - really useful!

Pesty

42,655 posts

255 months

Monday 29th December 2014
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Pope Francis’s edict on climate change will anger deniers and US churches
Pontiff hopes to inspire action at next year’s UN meeting in Paris in December after visits to Philippines and New York

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/27/pope-...
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