RE: New Yamaha R1 - inside line

[Walter Sobchak]

tight5 said:

Needs a mention of the 1199/1299 and RSV4 being crap as well.

[Tim85]

bennyb24 said:

A few people have asked but lets try again - anyone have an idea when 1st ride is ? seems a long time to wait for the launch....

End of February for the official track press launch. No idea when the media will have them over here to group test

[Walter Sobchak]

3DP said:

I think the engine character will be very important. I would hope that Yamaha manage to out-RSV4 the RSV4, but at £15k for a bike that struggles aesthetically, it's going to have to be a good road bike to sell to anyone other than Yamaha junkies. After all, if you just want a ballistic, electronics fest, visually challenged 1000, you already have the ZX10R that's considerably cheaper.

I reckon the BM will be the one to beat and early reports read like they've engineered in some much needed character.

The 1299 and new RSV4 are the curve balls. The 1299 looks to have a good top end and given back the mid range it lost to the 1198, as well as being easier to ride, but an exciting year for the 1000s, however it falls!

I didn't really get on with the 1199 when I rode one, I think if I had more time on it I could have helped with it better, there's no denying its a great bike though, it just didn't suit me best- still think it's the best looking one of the bunch though.
I hope Aprilia haven't made changes to the chassis on the revised version, I've got to say without a doubt it's the best handling bike I've owned or ridden, the engine character is also fantastic on it and if Yamaha have made the R1 feel the same in that respect then they're onto a winner.

[tight5]

Bikes into dealers in March .

[Thrugglevalve]

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

[bass gt3]

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

[Thrugglevalve]

bass gt3 said:

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

In some cases yes. The S1000RR from 193bhp standard has been seen dyno numbers at 186RWHP. 200RWHP was claimant of an interview with Milaukee Yamaha. Maybe you can ask them if they understand the 'concept of mechanical losses'.

[bass gt3]

Thrugglevalve said:

In some cases yes. The S1000RR from 193bhp standard has been seen dyno numbers at 186RWHP. 200RWHP was claimant of an interview with Milaukee Yamaha. Maybe you can ask them if they understand the 'concept of mechanical losses'.

And a race team will tell the truth?? Give me a call when it happens!
FACT is DJ numbers, which are the ones bandied about are as useless as saying you get paid a zillion quarks a trimester.
Whilst the DJ dyno might be measuring 200 somethings, they ain't Horsepower as defined by the scientific method. So to start wittering on about 200 BHP at the crank or at the wheel is self delusional.
Oh, and if you really think a Superbike only looses 12 BHP through the powertrain you are away with the fairies.

[Deranged Granny]

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

No need to get so cranky

[bass gt3]

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

No need to get so cranky

Soz, but it pisses me off this idiotic denial of reality.

[Deranged Granny]

bass gt3 said:

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

No need to get so cranky

Soz, but it pisses me off this idiotic denial of reality.

At the crank... cranky... it wasn't remotely funny to be fair

[Thrugglevalve]

bass gt3 said:

And a race team will tell the truth?? Give me a call when it happens!
FACT is DJ numbers, which are the ones bandied about are as useless as saying you get paid a zillion quarks a trimester.
Whilst the DJ dyno might be measuring 200 somethings, they ain't Horsepower as defined by the scientific method. So to start wittering on about 200 BHP at the crank or at the wheel is self delusional.
Oh, and if you really think a Superbike only looses 12 BHP through the powertrain you are away with the fairies.

Motorcycle.com Superbike test 2010.

[bass gt3]

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

No need to get so cranky

Soz, but it pisses me off this idiotic denial of reality.

At the crank... cranky... it wasn't remotely funny to be fair

You missed out the Ta-Boom Tishhhh

[3DP]

Thrugglevalve said:

Motorcycle.com Superbike test 2010.

1198

[bass gt3]

Thrugglevalve said:

Motorcycle.com Superbike test 2010.

And???

[RemaL]

bass gt3 said:

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Deranged Granny said:

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

RemaL said:

I don't care and why would others?

Does it matter if it's a little underpowered

If having the most powerful bike is important to you then great.

But my bike has more power than yours, Really ?

I dont think it will be under powered compared to the competition. It was released with 200BHP without RAM AIR. 200BHP was bench tested, with RAM Air will most likely get 200BHP at the rear wheel.

FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??
And Craig, seriously, I struggle to believe you really think a BM or ZX is making 200 at the wheel when the manufacturers rate/test at the crank. Or have they invented the lossless transmission and tyre system??
R1 200 AT THE CRANK. TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
S1K 200 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
RSV4 205 AT THE CRANK TRUE BHP as per the Scientific Measure
Any other superbike it's AT THE CRANK!!
Unless we're using Dynojet BHP as our yard stick in which case mybikemakes eleventyten bazillion....
When will people figure out DJ BHP is BULLst! It has fk all relation to reality.

No need to get so cranky

Soz, but it pisses me off this idiotic denial of reality.

At the crank... cranky... it wasn't remotely funny to be fair

You missed out the Ta-Boom Tishhhh

and the from my underpowered post

[RemaL]

bass gt3 said:

Thrugglevalve said:

Motorcycle.com Superbike test 2010.

And???

fking hell Steve it it not obvious

We can all this is



Why the AND!!!!



dear god man it shows the dyne output of sports bikes 5 years ago.


I do wonder about you some times

[Thrugglevalve]

Hang on back the Bus up......

'FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??'

My response:- In some cases yes:- S1000RR. Some bikes lose less than others the S1000RR doesn't lose much at all from quoted Crank horse power of 193.

The graph shows a dyno output of the s1000rr regardless of 2010 it's the same engine and HP up to 2012. If I wasnt in Austria I would post up my own Dyno Results of my S1000RR. They dont lose much at all they lose far less than an 1199 for example. This is also shown with the shear straight line speed with the power it can put down to the tarmac. Hodgson said the same while testing the 1199, RSV4 and S1000 for MCN.

Take as you will that's my 10 Pence worth. Not looking for an argument about BHP but to be criticised, I am well within my right to put my point across.

[bass gt3]

Thrugglevalve said:

Hang on back the Bus up......

'FFS!!!!
Do you have any idea/concept of mechanical losses? Do you seriously think a bike only looses about 10 or 15 bhp from crank to tarmac??'

My response:- In some cases yes:- S1000RR. Some bikes lose less than others the S1000RR doesn't lose much at all from quoted Crank horse power of 193.

The graph shows a dyno output of the s1000rr regardless of 2010 it's the same engine and HP up to 2012. If I wasnt in Austria I would post up my own Dyno Results of my S1000RR. They dont lose much at all they lose far less than an 1199 for example. This is also shown with the shear straight line speed with the power it can put down to the tarmac. Hodgson said the same while testing the 1199, RSV4 and S1000 for MCN.

Take as you will that's my 10 Pence worth. Not looking for an argument about BHP but to be criticised, I am well within my right to put my point across.

So by your reasoning, the S1kRR should be disappearing into the distance at every turn??
Yet, I can speak from experience today at Race practice, the S1000's didn't disappear from the ZX10's or the 1199's. So how can this be??
We even had David McFadden from BSB outwith us today and guess what?? Nope, the S1K's didn't drop him either on the nearly 1km main straight.....
Bottom line is dyno results are speculative BS at best. Funny how the track never lies.....

[Thrugglevalve]

bass gt3 said:

So by your reasoning, the S1kRR should be disappearing into the distance at every turn??
Yet, I can speak from experience today at Race practice, the S1000's didn't disappear from the ZX10's or the 1199's. So how can this be??
We even had David McFadden from BSB outwith us today and guess what?? Nope, the S1K's didn't drop him either on the nearly 1km main straight.....
Bottom line is dyno results are speculative BS at best. Funny how the track never lies.....

LOOK!!

We could argue about this into the early hours until we've both run out of breath. You asked me a question. Ive answered your question. I have put my facts across given in the best of knowledge. If you dont accept it I dont really care, I'm not getting to a ridiculous debate about you and your RACE Practice.

Maybe Dyno results are speculative but it's a consistent measure in near repeatable conditions. Its the only number WHP that people can usually go off and it's generally widely accepted.

Im going to leave you to it and be safe on your bike.