the bb trackday thread.

[sc0tt]

BobSaunders said:

How do you find small boy bikes Scott? I am considering using them for Oulton soon. A little concerned about binning their bikes..

Really good mate. I think the answer is have a spare £500 incase you do. I was worried first time out but to be honest you sort of forget about it throughout the day.

I then saw a binned bike and promptly remembered

Mat's bikes are brilliant though. You can see how well kept they are.

Ride perfect. On good tyres and if you need anything changing mat sorts it. Do it.

[gwm]

We were very lucky with the weather, fkin' miserable up here now.


(that lovely heavy drizzle Scotland does so well)

[anonymous-user]

bass gt3 said:

^This..

seriously, doesn't it strike you as obvious? Otherwise why would you even bother with groups? Would you propose everyone just goes out and sorts it out for themselves???
There's a level of control and competence A group riders expect and deserve from other similar riders. It isn't just about outright pace but track awareness and etiquette.

It's only obvious that people always over rate themselves, so the grouping is largely irrelevant until you get someone cutting your nose off or running wide with no notice, which is too late. Only did a couple and a similar pattern emerged. At least on race day you can identify novices etc. I reckon it goes with the territory and if you're quick enough to be pushing every fast group it's time to get into club racing?

[bass gt3]

yonex said:

bass gt3 said:

^This..

seriously, doesn't it strike you as obvious? Otherwise why would you even bother with groups? Would you propose everyone just goes out and sorts it out for themselves???
There's a level of control and competence A group riders expect and deserve from other similar riders. It isn't just about outright pace but track awareness and etiquette.

It's only obvious that people always over rate themselves, so the grouping is largely irrelevant until you get someone cutting your nose off or running wide with no notice, which is too late. Only did a couple and a similar pattern emerged. At least on race day you can identify novices etc. I reckon it goes with the territory and if you're quick enough to be pushing every fast group it's time to get into club racing?

There's no overrating, we are all timed with compulsory transponders so it's there in black & white. The clock don't lie. If you're too slow or too fast for your respective group you get moved after the 2nd session. Problem is people booking into A group when they know full well they're not up to the required standard and then causing grief for everyone else, or coming a cropper from over trying or getting flustered by the passing. A group rules are pretty relaxed, and we'll pass anywhere except stuffing it up the inside while the guy is turned.
And maybe we do club race, hence being in the A group and that is our setup and practice
When you have 20 guys circulating in the 1:42 to 1:52 times throwing in 10 novices doing 2:15's to 2:30 is little better than a recipe for disaster, especially on a 4.2km fast circuit.
The whole idea of groups is to allow the fast guys to go fast and the novices to ride without being passed or bombed by massively faster riders and learn the craft. But I would of thought this was obvious?

Edited by bass gt3 on Wednesday 27th May 18:24

[legzr1]

A few years ago I was in Fast group at Croft doing ok - a couple a fair bit quicker, a few a fair bit slower with the majority all within a few seconds a lap of each other.
Also a few fairly rapid club racers out practising with a couple of lads lapping in the 1.25's on R6's (talented young bds...)

I'd followed this same group of riders for two or three sessions - we always seemed to leave pits around the same time and ended up,having fun lap after lap - some on 600's holding excellent corner speed, others (like myself) losing out on corner entry but gaining once upright.

Passing was clean and fair amongst the five or six of us - eventually I made it up to the lead rider after around 40 laps of trying - now was my time, kept him in sight through Hawthorn and nailed it out of the chicane, through the kink into tower.
Done him on the brakes then clung on the the 'lead' for a whole lap!

Then, back into Tower and the fking marshals start waving fking blue fking flags at me - eh? It's a trackday isn't it? Not a race! I'm not a racer!

So, I slowed, turned into Tower on the correct line as you do then headed far left to allow the obviously fast racers past - maybe I'd been pissing them off blocking into corners then tearing off up the next straight...


Who comes by?

The same group of riders I'd been dicing with all fking day.


Marshals - they're bds

[Biker's Nemesis]

Yeah, lets all race and pay twice the amount you would for track day and only get 2 x 6 lap races.

At least you get a plastic cup in club racing and then you can sit all smug because you've been a mediocre "racer".

[legzr1]

bass gt3 said:

There's no overrating, we are all timed with compulsory transponders so it's there in black & white. The clock don't lie. If you're too slow or too fast for your respective group you get moved after the 2nd session. Problem is people booking into A group when they know full well they're not up to the required standard and then causing grief for everyone else, or coming a cropper from over trying or getting flustered by the passing. A group rules are pretty relaxed, and we'll pass anywhere except stuffing it up the inside while the guy is turned.
And maybe we do club race, hence being in the A group and that is our setup and practice
When you have 20 guys circulating in the 1:42 to 1:52 times throwing in 10 novices doing 2:15's to 2:30 is little better than a recipe for disaster, especially on a 4.2km fast circuit.
The whole idea of groups is to allow the fast guys to go fast and the novices to ride without being passed or bombed by massively faster riders and learn the craft. But I would of thought this was obvious?

Edited by bass gt3 on Wednesday 27th May 18:24

I wouldn't bother trying to justify your position any further - it all makes perfect sense and I'm not sure how anyone could disagree (unless they're out for a bite naturally...).

The only thing I can add is that something I find more common on UK circuits is the opposite - capable and decent riders opting out of inters and dropping to novice trying to prove something perhaps - similarly massive differences in pace and experience to your example but TDO's seem to rely on novices having the balls to go and complain if the instructors miss anything.

[sc0tt]

Booked my ACU







Kidding

Where can I get these plastic cups though?

[sc0tt]

Heres me getting passed by Mouldy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfQ5eLfJvUg&fe...

[bass gt3]

legzr1 said:

I wouldn't bother trying to justify your position any further - it all makes perfect sense and I'm not sure how anyone could disagree (unless they're out for a bite naturally...).

Seems that way....

legzr1 said:

The only thing I can add is that something I find more common on UK circuits is the opposite - capable and decent riders opting out of inters and dropping to novice trying to prove something perhaps - similarly massive differences in pace and experience to your example but TDO's seem to rely on novices having the balls to go and complain if the instructors miss anything.

Headhunters? tts.

[curlie467]

legzr1 said:

The only thing I can add is that something I find more common on UK circuits is the opposite - capable and decent riders opting out of inters and dropping to novice trying to prove something perhaps - similarly massive differences in pace and experience to your example but TDO's seem to rely on novices having the balls to go and complain if the instructors miss anything.

I think this happened today at Oulton.
I booked into Novice again and while the group was a slow Novice group, there was a good standard of riding (bar the excitable lad on the R6 who red flagged 2 sessions for us) and nobody was doing any banzai manouvres to hit apexes. This remained until the afternoon when suddenly there were 5 or 6 bikes that I hadn't seen previously and all were much much quicker than the morning riders (good riders but they should have been up a group as should I but I booked too late), I can only think that they dropped down a group as Matt said they had shuffled people around a bit so I couldn't go up to inters.
Then rain stopped play anyway.

[LoonR1]

I don't get this transponder obsession. No Limits don't do it, for valid reasons IMO, but FE do use them. So if you want a transponder day go on an FE one.

Today I would've been kicked out of Fast probably as I was just getting my head in gear and sorting out a few niggles, by the end I was running with the best of them. Would I have been safer in Inters?

[wtdoom]

bass gt3 said:

legzr1 said:

I wouldn't bother trying to justify your position any further - it all makes perfect sense and I'm not sure how anyone could disagree (unless they're out for a bite naturally...).

Seems that way....

legzr1 said:

The only thing I can add is that something I find more common on UK circuits is the opposite - capable and decent riders opting out of inters and dropping to novice trying to prove something perhaps - similarly massive differences in pace and experience to your example but TDO's seem to rely on novices having the balls to go and complain if the instructors miss anything.

Headhunters? tts.

This is a genuine question , I never thought about this before but how do you guys gauge when it's time to move up a group ?

[sc0tt]

LoonR1 said:

I don't get this transponder obsession. No Limits don't do it, for valid reasons IMO, but FE do use them. So if you want a transponder day go on an FE one.

Today I would've been kicked out of Fast probably as I was just getting my head in gear and sorting out a few niggles, by the end I was running with the best of them. Would I have been safer in Inters?

Vagina sorted?

[Biker's Nemesis]

wtdoom said:

This is a genuine question , I never thought about this before but how do you guys gauge when it's time to move up a group ?

When you're running rings around everyone, every session at different tracks.

[curlie467]

Had a great day though and was good to catch up with Loon again.

Lots of progress made today I feel, concentrated on using the right gears today and that made a big difference and I was much happier on the bike. Did an ace wheelie coming out of druids!

Got much better at right handers too, tough to get consistent lines though due to the amount of traffic but am not too worried about that as I know I can run reasonable(ish) lines round there with a clear lap.
I don't think consistency is my strong point but I am learning lots each time I ride the bike and mustn't forget I have only done 5 days of riding.

Wouldn't mind a bash in the intermediate group to see what the difference is and maybe got the odd tow.

Bike ran faultlessly all day as per usual.

[LoonR1]

sc0tt said:

Vagina sorted?

Yep. I'm back and I'm awesome again.

[curlie467]

LoonR1 said:

sc0tt said:

Vagina sorted?

Yep. I'm back and I'm awesome again.

He's back! looking good out there and the big smile said it all! Hoorah.

[LoonR1]

A bit of fettling yesterday with the bars, plus Ben's magic touch today with the throttle and a few other little tweaks has transformed the bike and boosted my confidence no end. Now all I have to sort out is my fitness,maps I could hold onto the really quick guys for three laps, but then got tired and they started pulling gaps very quickly.

[sc0tt]

LoonR1 said:

A bit of fettling yesterday with the bars, plus Ben's magic touch today with the throttle and a few other little tweaks has transformed the bike and boosted my confidence no end. Now all I have to sort out is my fitness,maps I could hold onto the really quick guys for three laps, but then got tired and they started pulling gaps very quickly.

Yeah I didnt realise you need to be a little bit fit for this