Pay to ride into central London

[Tribal Chestnut]

Richyboy said:

Need to change the title of this thread to "christmas for bike thieves". I hope our insurance doesn't bloody go up.

I don't think there can be any doubt that the thieving bds will seize the opportunity with both greedy, grasping, sweaty, little hands.

[NNH]

Tribal Chestnut said:

LoonR1 said:

What's gated? London? that's got to be a piss take.

Currently motorcycles pass through along with bicycles, not quite sure how the system will work if they try and introduce gates for bikers, whilst still allowing pedal cycles unimpeded access, but I'm sure they've got a suitably draconian plan to enforce it.

I imagine they'll use Oslo's system, where the gate automatically opens if there is an approaching weight of under 115kg. Hopefully we won't have the same problem with large pedal cyclists clattering into the unopened gate at full speed if they forget to bring their "Daimtag" RFID tag to allow them an extra 50kg weight allowance.

[LoonR1]

Tribal Chestnut said:

I don't think there can be any doubt that the thieving bds will seize the opportunity with both greedy, grasping, sweaty, little hands.

A per reason why London is a st place to live. Wonder if that's why you're happy there?

[Tribal Chestnut]

LoonR1 said:

A per reason why London is a st place to live. Wonder if that's why you're happy there?

Yep, cos I'm a miserable ahole obviously.

[Fleegle]

LoonR1 said:

A per reason why London is a st place to live.

No its not

[Willy Nilly]

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

[shielsy]

Quite an interesting predicament for anyone taking a classic into the smog.... Exempt from road tax, but charged £12.50 for emissions. Emissions being a component in road tax calculation on current cars. Quite literally swings and roundabouts.

[LoonR1]

shielsy said:

Quite an interesting predicament for anyone taking a classic into the smog.... Exempt from road tax, but charged £12.50 for emissions. Emissions being a component in road tax calculation on current cars. Quite literally swings and roundabouts.

Well it would be if you'd bothered to read the thread you'd see that historic class tax bikes are exempt.

[shielsy]

Ah yes, I'll get my coat then. Carry on.

[Fleegle]

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

[Willy Nilly]

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

The issue here is local vehicle emissions in a very congested city. Newer engines have to comply with newer (and tighter) regulations (not sure if bikes aren't a tier or 2 behind cars) so will be cleaner. Total vehicle life emissions aren't of much interest to someone living in central London, they just want to breather cleaner air,which probably isn't an reasonable request.

[Fleegle]

Willy Nilly said:

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

The issue here is local vehicle emissions in a very congested city. Newer engines have to comply with newer (and tighter) regulations (not sure if bikes aren't a tier or 2 behind cars) so will be cleaner. Total vehicle life emissions aren't of much interest to someone living in central London, they just want to breather cleaner air,which probably isn't an reasonable request.

So based on your original comment that it won't affect that many people, why spend a shedload of money introducing a new camera system that will capture motorcycle reg plates if it is only going to 'capture' a small percentage in the grand scheme of numbers? All new bikes are being built to certain emission controls now, so why not let it just take its natural course?

[Willy Nilly]

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

The issue here is local vehicle emissions in a very congested city. Newer engines have to comply with newer (and tighter) regulations (not sure if bikes aren't a tier or 2 behind cars) so will be cleaner. Total vehicle life emissions aren't of much interest to someone living in central London, they just want to breather cleaner air,which probably isn't an reasonable request.

So based on your original comment that it won't affect that many people, why spend a shedload of money introducing a new camera system that will capture motorcycle reg plates if it is only going to 'capture' a small percentage in the grand scheme of numbers? All new bikes are being built to certain emission controls now, so why not let it just take its natural course?

They will use the existing cameras, they want to speed the process up, they can make a few quid, they want to be seen to be doing something. They are also being much more lenient on bikes than they were on commercial vehicles. They could start charging bikes that don't meet Euro 4 tomorrow as an example.

[theshrew]

Willy Nilly said:

The issue here is local vehicle emissions in a very congested city. Newer engines have to comply with newer (and tighter) regulations (not sure if bikes aren't a tier or 2 behind cars) so will be cleaner. Total vehicle life emissions aren't of much interest to someone living in central London, they just want to breather cleaner air,which probably isn't an reasonable request.

Im not a 100% sure but I don't think bikes do as they don't have a emissions test for MOT I believe.

I agree with the breath cleaner air comment, I try my best not to go to London tbh I hate it, when I do three things stick in my mind. The air quality, All you can smell is Bus / Taxi fumes flipping horrible. The people are generally wkers, all up there own arses and they all drink shandy.

My step daughter moved to London 2 years ago, she has a dam good job for her age and wants to go far with her career etc. She absolutely loves living there. Personally I couldn't think of anything worse.

London is a love or hate thing. You would have to pay me to ride or drive in that rat run.

[bgunn]

Willy Nilly said:

The issue here is local vehicle emissions in a very congested city. Newer engines have to comply with newer (and tighter) regulations (not sure if bikes aren't a tier or 2 behind cars) so will be cleaner. Total vehicle life emissions aren't of much interest to someone living in central London, they just want to breather cleaner air,which probably isn't an reasonable request.

This is all very nice, but bikes are probably outnumbered by particulate emitting buses and taxis (and lorries and delivery vans) by a factor of 1000:1 - it's clearly a money making scam and relates very little to environmental impact. Think about it, on simple road footprint alone, a bike is far far more efficient a mode of transport for 90% of London's passengers - even more so than the wonderful hybrid buses full of nickel cadmium.

If he really really wants to improve air quality, actually banning vehicles from certain areas is going to be the only way. But then the victorian railway system can't really cope as it is. I'd love to have clean air in London. But I'd also like to get around the bloody city, too

[Pothole]

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

This is where you've let yourself down. This is not about the wider environment, it's about the disgusting air pollution levels in central London. The manufacture of a new motorcycle, unless it's happening in Central London, will have no effect on the air pollution there.

[Fleegle]

Pothole said:

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

This is where you've let yourself down. This is not about the wider environment, it's about the disgusting air pollution levels in central London. The manufacture of a new motorcycle, unless it's happening in Central London, will have no effect on the air pollution there.

Not at all. See through the bullshyte and it's no more than a revenue stream

[Pothole]

Fleegle said:

Pothole said:

Fleegle said:

Willy Nilly said:

When the charge comes in, a bike registered in 2007 will be 13 years old so it's not going to effect that many people, is it?

The bike that I currently take in every day is 17 years old, very well maintained and still looks clean. There is no reason with its current maintenance levels why it shouldn't make it to 2020.

But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia, they seem to overlook the fact that should I replace my bike with a new bike, one will need to be manufactured.......at zero cost to the environment. Like fk.

This is where Boris lets himself down

This is where you've let yourself down. This is not about the wider environment, it's about the disgusting air pollution levels in central London. The manufacture of a new motorcycle, unless it's happening in Central London, will have no effect on the air pollution there.

Not at all. See through the bullshyte and it's no more than a revenue stream

Not what you said in the post I quoted, was it? "But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia..."

So you reckon the air pollution aspect is merely a smokescreen?

[Fleegle]

Pothole said:

ot what you said in the post I quoted, was it? "But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia..."

So you reckon the air pollution aspect is merely a smokescreen?

Is that a pun?

My view is that if they had wanted to quickly reduce the pollution in London, they should have taken a harder line on cabs and buses from the outset. They have been given too much time. This move, bearing in mind the low percentage it will affect in 2020, will have little effect in the scheme of things other than generate a paltry sum

[ORD]

Fleegle said:

Pothole said:

ot what you said in the post I quoted, was it? "But no, with the Government striving for environmental utopia..."

So you reckon the air pollution aspect is merely a smokescreen?

Is that a pun?

My view is that if they had wanted to quickly reduce the pollution in London, they should have taken a harder line on cabs and buses from the outset. They have been given too much time. This move, bearing in mind the low percentage it will affect in 2020, will have little effect in the scheme of things other than generate a paltry sum

Taxis have been left alone (pretty much) because they are heavily unionised, nasty and very well able to cause huge disruption.

The fact that taxis are pootling around all day with engines that produce about 10 times as much harmful pollution as a modern petrol engine is pretty disgraceful.

I would not assume, however, that motorbikes are not heavily polluting. A lot are. And, in many instances, they are more polluting (for local air quality, rather than CO2) than petrol engine cars.