suspension help

[Tim85]

is the fact you cant move freely anything to do with the positioning of your new rear sets? i know when i tried mine in the furthest back top position my knees where so high i couldnt move at all. I know theres obviously something that needs adjusting i just cant get it in my head why youd really need new anything on such a 'young' bike. Im sure standard 675 suspension should really see most of us fine with just some adjustments. Thats not to say your wrong its just if it was me id be getting someone to look at it and just refreshing stuff before buying fancy parts.

[neelyp]

moanthebairns said:

bass gt3 said:

neelyp said:

When we tried to get more sag but the preload rings were right at the top of the thread so there was no more adjustment left.

Ok, well that's not good. A spring needs a degree of static preload so you shouldn't be winding it out so far. The normal is around 12mm
The thing to do here is figure out he fitted spring weight. It's very possible that a previous owner fitted a very heavy spring to replace the standard item. At 11st, you're well within the standard spring range, you shouldn't be having any trouble.

Out of interest, with the spring completely unwound, what sag numbers were you getting?

Almost 30 mm

This could be the case. The previous owner was a fair size man. I test rode one and it handled like a house fly turned in so quick and was great. Now it's unbearable on mines.

Could it be he had a stiff shock. That would explain a lot.

I'm doubting this, he had it 6 years and did 1400 miles, I very much doubt he changed the shock.

[bass gt3]

neelyp said:

I'm doubting this, he had it 6 years and did 1400 miles, I very much doubt he changed the shock.

which is why I'm asking if there's any id marks on the spring. i have a standard rear shock from my 675 in the shed so i can compare. worst case we can measure the wire diameter and compare
the alternative is someone isn't measuring correctly or at the correct place

Edited by bass gt3 on Tuesday 21st April 16:07

[neelyp]

I'll get him to sit on mine and we'll see what the sag is on that.
I'm wondering if the linkages could be doing with a grease, would that have any effect?

Also I measured from the exhaust heatshield to the floor, is there a specific place it should be measured from?

[SAS Tom]

moanthebairns said:

It does. We measured the peg height at the changes and there was a considerable difference. Let's remember I'm on the last threads of the shock as well and still not achieving the correct sag

The peg height in relation to the seat doesn't change so wouldn't affect how comfortable you are.

[legzr1]

Mr OCD said:

The cheapest fix is you getting fitter... laying off the crap you eat and doing some form of exercise would be a better idea. No amount of money spent on suspension is going to fix the problems you have with being exhausted.

To be fair, Croft can be a very tiring circuit especially when it's as warm as it was yesterday.

[moanthebairns]

SAS Tom said:

moanthebairns said:

It does. We measured the peg height at the changes and there was a considerable difference. Let's remember I'm on the last threads of the shock as well and still not achieving the correct sag

The peg height in relation to the seat doesn't change so wouldn't affect how comfortable you are.

I corrected myself a few posts ago. I said pegs as I wasn't thinking and I was fking about with them a few days ago.

Physical fitness has nothing to do with this. I rode a daytona before and it handled so much better than mimes.

My rear shock is 10 years old and due a rebuild. Also believe it or not I'm not unfit. I'm 27 And whilst I eat and smoke st I'd dare to say my fitness is of a higher standard than most on here I can still run for 60 minutes playing 5s

[Tim85]

i think its time to just celebrate your new job and just treat/bankrupt yourself with ohlins all round.

these should be a nice start

http://www.crescent-motorcycles.com/shop/show_prod...

Edited by Tim85 on Tuesday 21st April 16:33

[fergus]

Tim85 said:

is the fact you cant move freely anything to do with the positioning of your new rear sets? i know when i tried mine in the furthest back top position my knees where so high i couldnt move at all.

MTB - you didn't mention you had new rearsets fitted.... Personally, I'd set these as low as possible, and only move them if you're getting your toes down on a regular basis. No point being crunched on to a bike as it's counter productive to feeling relaxed

As Steve (Bass) has alluded to, I think at circa 11 stone, the stock spring (assuming this is what's fitted) will be fine. If the spring isn't powdercoated or looks "new", I'd assume it's stock. Try again at setting the sag. Normally, I'd used the middle of the rear axle nut as the reference point and then mark a point on the rear subframe directly above this (use a plumb line and use a bit of duct tape with a horizontal line on it) to measure the unloaded and "rider" travel to calculate "rider sag". If you use any other position, this isn't standard and you could inadvertently (most likey) under estimate the sag you have, hence wind up the preload to almost be out of adjustment - which may be what you've done.

where did you measure to set the sag figure you've quoted?

[MrOrange]

Mr OCD said:

The cheapest fix is you getting fitter... laying off the crap you eat and doing some form of exercise would be a better idea. No amount of money spent on suspension is going to fix the problems you have with being exhausted.

It's still pretty early in the year - maybe a bike fitness thing? I'm an old b'stard and find it takes me a while to get supple again after a winter off/pootling. Add the early start to the bikey year (it's often still bloody snowing in April) and maybe you're expecting/remembering October last year? That will fk with your head, it does mine!

[moanthebairns]

Its not fitness or start of the season I've done 5. I've always thought it.

Everyone om here says the standard is fine. Ok I'm in no position to say they are wrong. But when I went to see the suspension guys at croft he said. We can do the best with whst we have but for your weight I'd be looking at new springs.

The local suspension sspecialist when I quoted my weight also said straight away mew springs

Now This could just be to make a few quid but these are the people who I've been listening to.

My rearsets are as low as can go.

I'll need to get photos of the shock

[fergus]

If you're running a spring with a higher spring rate, this will most likely give you a more positive rake (assuming no other changes) which should help rather than hinder your turn in. It won't be ideal for grip, etc, but turn in should be better than "stock".

[moanthebairns]

Right. I'll get some photos tonight. I'll start fresh with suspension

I'll try one more Track day. If it continues the I'm no further forward and need to get new springs.

I don't need a new shock or piston kit

[bass gt3]

neelyp said:

I'll get him to sit on mine and we'll see what the sag is on that.
I'm wondering if the linkages could be doing with a grease, would that have any effect?

Also I measured from the exhaust heatshield to the floor, is there a specific place it should be measured from?

your measurements could be a problem. You must measure vertically from the rear axle to a point of reference on the rear body.

[Tim85]

We're all just trying to help/give advice. Granted some now a lot more than others but it's probably hard for them to tell you exactly what to do with them being half way across the globe in some cases. If a professional suspension guy that's had hands on the bike said get a new spring then I wouldn't waste any time doing another day if you can afford it then just do it.

[Nords]

Tim85 said:

i think its time to just celebrate your new job and just treat/bankrupt yourself with ohlins all round.

these should be a nice start

http://www.crescent-motorcycles.com/shop/show_prod...

Edited by Tim85 on Tuesday 21st April 16:33

That or a set of lightweight wheels...

Wheels are the best mod I have ever made...

[moanthebairns]

No markings on the spring.

Mckeann has kindly offered to do the sag with me again checking it

He also pointed out his mate had the same issue. He found out as he turned in he was pushing on the inside bar but not Pulling the outside inward.

I'll be honest. I don't even think of that any more it just happens. So perhaps I need to go back to basics and pull. I'm pretty sure I just push the inside and the outside is doing nothing. Perhaps that would explain why I'm struggling now I'm quicker.

Also there is a linkage thing that changes the way the rear shock works. Perhaps bass could explain as I'm sure he mentioned before.

If bass figures are correct I can only get it whilst on the top thread of the spring.

Whilst I appreciate the input I'm not saying anyone is wrong Or I'm not listening. It's just I have one person saying this sag. Another this. A source thus. Experts telling me get new springs. Others saying it's fine.

[moanthebairns]

http://www.675.cc/675/threads/fork-springs-rate.14...

Interesting read.

It's widely acknowledged on 675 the rear shock is too stiff and they can vary from spring to spring. Source T3 racing. So it could not be all in my head.

[moanthebairns]

Done some calculations. I'm A 9 in the infront. So seems I have the right springs in thE stock suspension as that's. 9 this was set up by suspension specialists and I have no real problems with that

Its

the rear. Who knows. But I'm tempted to just get a new spring for 85 for my weight. The standard ones are wisely acknowledge d as being st as I say.

[neelyp]

Got him to sit on ma ma ma my Daytona last night and it barely sagged at all, I'm probably around fifteen stone without bike gear and it doesn't really move that far with me on it. This is with the preload adjuster not far off the top of the thread, certainly less than 10mm.