Self posting video gets him Nine months inside
Discussion
black-k1 said:
The problem here is speed and different peoples feelings about speed. Speed is essential for travel but too much speed becomes a danger. There would have been no issue if he'd ridden entirely at the legal limit but he MIGHT still have killed someone.
So, at what speed does riding (which always MIGHT kill someone) stop being "safe" and become so dangerous that it deserves a 9 month prison term? (Remembering that other crimes such as assault, ABH, GBH where there is no "safe" level, and people DO get hurt) often don't end up in prison sentences).
The riding was totally inappropriate and the speed was excessive so I'm not, in any way, defending the rider, but personally, I think the punishment was totally disproportionate to the crime. It does the UK justice system no favours when things like this happen and I really think there are no winners in this.
It is why we have Judges and Juries so they can make that assessment and issue an appropriate sentence for the crime committed.So, at what speed does riding (which always MIGHT kill someone) stop being "safe" and become so dangerous that it deserves a 9 month prison term? (Remembering that other crimes such as assault, ABH, GBH where there is no "safe" level, and people DO get hurt) often don't end up in prison sentences).
The riding was totally inappropriate and the speed was excessive so I'm not, in any way, defending the rider, but personally, I think the punishment was totally disproportionate to the crime. It does the UK justice system no favours when things like this happen and I really think there are no winners in this.
I am happy they made the correct assessment in this case given the certainly of endangerment/risk to life when at those speeds.
He will be out in 3 remember, which maybe is a bigger problem for the reputation of the law than the sentence given.
ORD said:
black-k1 said:
The problem here is speed and different peoples feelings about speed. Speed is essential for travel but too much speed becomes a danger. There would have been no issue if he'd ridden entirely at the legal limit but he MIGHT still have killed someone.
So, at what speed does riding (which always MIGHT kill someone) stop being "safe" and become so dangerous that it deserves a 9 month prison term? (Remembering that other crimes such as assault, ABH, GBH where there is no "safe" level, and people DO get hurt) often don't end up in prison sentences).
The riding was totally inappropriate and the speed was excessive so I'm not, in any way, defending the rider, but personally, I think the punishment was totally disproportionate to the crime. It does the UK justice system no favours when things like this happen and I really think there are no winners in this.
Plenty of winners. Every single road user who is a bit safer for that tw+t never riding like that again! And perhaps others will take note of the sentence and restrain themselves, too. So, at what speed does riding (which always MIGHT kill someone) stop being "safe" and become so dangerous that it deserves a 9 month prison term? (Remembering that other crimes such as assault, ABH, GBH where there is no "safe" level, and people DO get hurt) often don't end up in prison sentences).
The riding was totally inappropriate and the speed was excessive so I'm not, in any way, defending the rider, but personally, I think the punishment was totally disproportionate to the crime. It does the UK justice system no favours when things like this happen and I really think there are no winners in this.
He would have killed someone eventually riding like that. I think that is more likely than not.
If we're so "wont somebody think of the children" about it, what about community service with RTA survivors in hospital? Or ride-alongs with ambo crews? That's far more likely to give him some perspective about his how actions might impact others, instead of just make him angry at himself for posting them on the web.
That could easily have been me and then some, 20 years ago. I've slowed down because my attitude has changed through experience. How will this lad's breadth of experience have increased by the time he gets out? It wont have. No one has been helped through community service, its cost you and I money, he's learned nothing except the law is an ass and don't post stupid stuff online etc etc
Totally counter productive, the whole thing.
Reardy Mister said:
Really? You're advocating taking a young lad who was momentarily irresponsible and putting him into a criminal factory, deceasing his chances of getting a job, or a missus, or insurance, or a loan etc etc for something that was a bit likely? Ye gads, I despair.
If we're so "wont somebody think of the children" about it, what about community service with RTA survivors in hospital? Or ride-alongs with ambo crews? That's far more likely to give him some perspective about his how actions might impact others, instead of just make him angry at himself for posting them on the web.
That could easily have been me and then some, 20 years ago. I've slowed down because my attitude has changed through experience. How will this lad's breadth of experience have increased by the time he gets out? It wont have. No one has been helped through community service, its cost you and I money, he's learned nothing except the law is an ass and don't post stupid stuff online etc etc
Totally counter productive, the whole thing.
A short time in jail for a driving offence is going to prevent him getting a job and a wife? Pretty unrealistic!If we're so "wont somebody think of the children" about it, what about community service with RTA survivors in hospital? Or ride-alongs with ambo crews? That's far more likely to give him some perspective about his how actions might impact others, instead of just make him angry at himself for posting them on the web.
That could easily have been me and then some, 20 years ago. I've slowed down because my attitude has changed through experience. How will this lad's breadth of experience have increased by the time he gets out? It wont have. No one has been helped through community service, its cost you and I money, he's learned nothing except the law is an ass and don't post stupid stuff online etc etc
Totally counter productive, the whole thing.
The problem with community sentences is that nobody takes them remotely seriously. Sure, that kind of thing would affect me and you, but it wouldnt do a thing to discourage other bell-ends, and this kind of person is hardly going to pay much attention. It isnt like he doesnt know that what he did was dangerous. He just didnt care.
Do you think anyone would see a story about this douche bag doing some community service and think "Oh. I had better not ride like a cock!". Not a chance.
And I have literally no sympathy for the guy. Unless he is galactically stupid, he put his own desire to show off above the safety of strangers.
Reardy Mister said:
Really? You're advocating taking a young lad who was momentarily irresponsible and putting him into a criminal factory, deceasing his chances of getting a job, or a missus, or insurance, or a loan etc etc for something that was a bit likely? Ye gads, I despair.
If we're so "wont somebody think of the children" about it, what about community service with RTA survivors in hospital? Or ride-alongs with ambo crews? That's far more likely to give him some perspective about his how actions might impact others, instead of just make him angry at himself for posting them on the web.
That could easily have been me and then some, 20 years ago. I've slowed down because my attitude has changed through experience. How will this lad's breadth of experience have increased by the time he gets out? It wont have. No one has been helped through community service, its cost you and I money, he's learned nothing except the law is an ass and don't post stupid stuff online etc etc
Totally counter productive, the whole thing.
perfectly put.If we're so "wont somebody think of the children" about it, what about community service with RTA survivors in hospital? Or ride-alongs with ambo crews? That's far more likely to give him some perspective about his how actions might impact others, instead of just make him angry at himself for posting them on the web.
That could easily have been me and then some, 20 years ago. I've slowed down because my attitude has changed through experience. How will this lad's breadth of experience have increased by the time he gets out? It wont have. No one has been helped through community service, its cost you and I money, he's learned nothing except the law is an ass and don't post stupid stuff online etc etc
Totally counter productive, the whole thing.
Sad to say but ORDS, you seems to be driven by punishment and retribution. That's the overwhelming impression form your posts.
And as RM says, if the object really was to send a message, then there's far more productive avenues than a sentence at the tax payers expense.
bass gt3 said:
perfectly put.
Sad to say but ORDS, you seems to be driven by punishment and retribution. That's the overwhelming impression form your posts.
And as RM says, if the object really was to send a message, then there's far more productive avenues than a sentence at the tax payers expense.
Punishment and deterrence. The guy doesnt need educating to know that riding at those speeds was putting lives at risk.Sad to say but ORDS, you seems to be driven by punishment and retribution. That's the overwhelming impression form your posts.
And as RM says, if the object really was to send a message, then there's far more productive avenues than a sentence at the tax payers expense.
ORD said:
bass gt3 said:
perfectly put.
Sad to say but ORDS, you seems to be driven by punishment and retribution. That's the overwhelming impression form your posts.
And as RM says, if the object really was to send a message, then there's far more productive avenues than a sentence at the tax payers expense.
Punishment and deterrence. The guy doesnt need educating to know that riding at those speeds was putting lives at risk.Sad to say but ORDS, you seems to be driven by punishment and retribution. That's the overwhelming impression form your posts.
And as RM says, if the object really was to send a message, then there's far more productive avenues than a sentence at the tax payers expense.
bass gt3 said:
I hope you've never made a mistake or done something monumentally stupid....
You dont mistakenly ride at those speeds. And it's not (just) stupid - it is a conscious decision to put your desire to show off to your mates ahead of the safety of people that you dont know. Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
Stickyfinger said:
ORD said:
You dont mistakenly ride at those speeds. And it's not (just) stupid - it is a conscious decision to put your desire to show off to your mates ahead of the safety of people that you dont know.
Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
perfectly put.Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
Anyway, I'm off for a sunny weekend, you keep nailing people to your cross....
Ciao
Stickyfinger said:
ORD said:
You dont mistakenly ride at those speeds. And it's not (just) stupid - it is a conscious decision to put your desire to show off to your mates ahead of the safety of people that you dont know.
Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
perfectly put.Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
Reardy Mister said:
Stickyfinger said:
ORD said:
You dont mistakenly ride at those speeds. And it's not (just) stupid - it is a conscious decision to put your desire to show off to your mates ahead of the safety of people that you dont know.
Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
perfectly put.Nobody is stupid enough that you can call that behavior a mistake.
They always travel in groups...
Reardy Mister said:
Why are you still here?
Why are you posting when you have bugger all to say that is constructive to the point being discussed ?This is a very important subject is it not ? One concerning the attitude some have to the reckless endangerment of my life and yours, as such I will contribute despite the totally unhelpful and quite frankly "lacking" comments like yours....
bass gt3 said:
You come across as a very intelligent and very vindictive person. Sad really.
Anyway, I'm off for a sunny weekend, you keep nailing people to your cross....
Ciao
I see nothing vindictive in my attitude, if however you do then you must condone or wish to reduce the sentence issued for a totally willful act of public endangerment. I do not obviously.Anyway, I'm off for a sunny weekend, you keep nailing people to your cross....
Ciao
Edited by Stickyfinger on Friday 28th August 13:52
Edited by Stickyfinger on Friday 28th August 13:53
Stickyfinger said:
Reardy Mister said:
Why are you still here?
Why are you posting when you have bugger all to say that is constructive to the point being discussed ?This is a very important subject is it not ? One concerning the attitude some have to the reckless endangerment of my life and your, as such I will contribute despite the totally unhelpful and quite frankly "lacking" comments like yours....
You're here to garner a consensus of support from the BB corner because this is a hobby horse of yours...
And please, DON'T EVER profess to do something in my name. Who appointed you?
Stickyfinger said:
bass gt3 said:
You come across as a very intelligent and very vindictive person. Sad really.
Anyway, I'm off for a sunny weekend, you keep nailing people to your cross....
Ciao
I see nothing vindictive in my attitude, if however you do then you must condone or wish to reduce the sentence issued for a totally willful act of public endangerment. I do not obviously.Anyway, I'm off for a sunny weekend, you keep nailing people to your cross....
Ciao
Edited by Stickyfinger on Friday 28th August 13:52
bass gt3 said:
Ahhhhhh, and it becomes clear..
You're here to garner a consensus of support from the BB corner because this is a hobby horse of yours...
And please, DON'T EVER profess to do something in my name. Who appointed you?
Nope....I don't want dangerous fools risking my life and I don't like dangerous fools risking the life of those who have nothing except pure luck to keep them alive. You're here to garner a consensus of support from the BB corner because this is a hobby horse of yours...
And please, DON'T EVER profess to do something in my name. Who appointed you?
bass gt3 said:
No, you're the stupid one. My comment was aimed at ORDS. You add zero value....
Then don't include my post/name in your post/quoteEdited by Stickyfinger on Friday 28th August 13:59
Not sure 'vindictive' is entirely fair. I'm not terribly compassionate sometimes, I suppose 
In reality, if I were the Judge, I would probably have been utterly appalled by the riding but would have (as someone has said) tried to educate at least as much as punish.
I am probably just sounding off a bit after having been shocked by the riding. To be honest, I am far more sensitive about dangerous road driving and riding since I started having my baby son in the car with me. It's a real eye opener to think a bit more about how easily things can go wrong if people take risks.
In reality, if I were the Judge, I would probably have been utterly appalled by the riding but would have (as someone has said) tried to educate at least as much as punish.
I am probably just sounding off a bit after having been shocked by the riding. To be honest, I am far more sensitive about dangerous road driving and riding since I started having my baby son in the car with me. It's a real eye opener to think a bit more about how easily things can go wrong if people take risks.
Nope.
Can I ask as openly as possible, what is your reaction to the effect this rider (sadly dead) had on the driver and their friends and family. It was his choice to ride like that, so what would you say to them ?
Forget it...bad luck....??
Really, what would you say, and please do not take it as anything other than a question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y965HcoUULQ
Can I ask as openly as possible, what is your reaction to the effect this rider (sadly dead) had on the driver and their friends and family. It was his choice to ride like that, so what would you say to them ?
Forget it...bad luck....??
Really, what would you say, and please do not take it as anything other than a question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y965HcoUULQ
Stickyfinger said:
Nope.
Can I ask as openly as possible, what is your reaction to the effect this rider (sadly dead) had on the driver and their friends and family. It was his choice to ride like that, so what would you say to them ?
Forget it...bad luck....??
Really, what would you say, and please do not take it as anything other than a question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y965HcoUULQ
Are you suggesting speed caused this accident? I'd advocate it was a contributing factor but ultimately came down to the car driver not looking down the road. Can I ask as openly as possible, what is your reaction to the effect this rider (sadly dead) had on the driver and their friends and family. It was his choice to ride like that, so what would you say to them ?
Forget it...bad luck....??
Really, what would you say, and please do not take it as anything other than a question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y965HcoUULQ
Speed in itself isn't dangerous. Why can't people get their heads around that?
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