Crash at Nitro Circus
Discussion
George29 said:
Surely they would have to sign disclaimers before doing the trick?
They did it when I went to watch it a couple of years back. If you volunteered you got a free set of MX kit so not a bad incentive
In our industry it doesn't stop you being reimbursed for our negligence, but I'm unsure whether the travelling circus is so closely scrutinised. They did it when I went to watch it a couple of years back. If you volunteered you got a free set of MX kit so not a bad incentive
But I don't believe you'd get away with it personally. Taking an extreme example, I put on a magic show, I ask for a volunteer to complete a disclaimer and then sit them in a long box on wheels. I then cut accidentally cut them in half as I failed to use the faux blades. They're now dead.
Is a court really going to say, "Aye fair enough, you f
ked that one up, they're dead but you didn't mean to and they signed a piece of paper"?Prof Prolapse said:
In our industry it doesn't stop you being reimbursed for our negligence, but I'm unsure whether the travelling circus is so closely scrutinised.
But I don't believe you'd get away with it personally. Taking an extreme example, I put on a magic show, I ask for a volunteer to complete a disclaimer and then sit them in a long box on wheels. I then cut accidentally cut them in half as I failed to use the faux blades. They're now dead.
Is a court really going to say, "Aye fair enough, you fked that one up, they're dead but you didn't mean to and they signed a piece of paper"?
I'm no law expert but surely if someone signs something saying they acknowledge the risks and are still happy to go ahead, then they don't really have much of an argument. But I don't believe you'd get away with it personally. Taking an extreme example, I put on a magic show, I ask for a volunteer to complete a disclaimer and then sit them in a long box on wheels. I then cut accidentally cut them in half as I failed to use the faux blades. They're now dead.
Is a court really going to say, "Aye fair enough, you f
ked that one up, they're dead but you didn't mean to and they signed a piece of paper"?George29 said:
I'm no law expert but surely if someone signs something saying they acknowledge the risks and are still happy to go ahead, then they don't really have much of an argument.
Not an expert either, but I don't think you can indemnify yourself against negligence, or incompetence.One of the most boring but important parts of what I do is to make sure the individuals have consented, and this process has been documented. I would be very confident there is no process of consent to a higher standard in this country, or perhaps even the world, than what exists in clinical research.
In spite of this apparently air tight agreement, we take out policies for hundreds of millions of pounds to cover us against negligence and error, albeit in our protocols, or drugs, we also have strict ABPI guidelines to follow for reimbursement. The NHS also similarly cover their involvement via insurance, but also have a large budget set aside for negligence, error, and vultures. I don't know more than that as I've not worked work there for a long time.
I just can't see why with all our lawyers, we need to spend hundreds of millions as an industry to cover against accidents from consented individuals, if others could just say "sign this and I can kill you by accident".
3DP said:
Oooh dear. Quite a drop.
I'm going to see them at O2 this Sunday. Tickets are stupidly expensive, but looks a good laugh. I guess they won't be trying that trick again...
I wouldn't be so sure, the 3 person flip has gone wrong before yet they are now doing it with 4 people. You can watch it on their YouTube channel.I'm going to see them at O2 this Sunday. Tickets are stupidly expensive, but looks a good laugh. I guess they won't be trying that trick again...
George29 said:
I'm no law expert but surely if someone signs something saying they acknowledge the risks and are still happy to go ahead, then they don't really have much of an argument.
Damn right you're no legal expert. It is impossible in the UK to sign away your rights around injury caused by others negligence. Whether people sue or not is down to their own moral compass. The massive thread in SP&L encouraging someone to sue another person for damage and injury caused on a trackday is a clear example of this.
JacquesMesrine said:
Damn right you're no legal expert. It is impossible in the UK to sign away your rights around injury caused by others negligence. Whether people sue or not is down to their own moral compass.
The massive thread in SP&L encouraging someone to sue another person for damage and injury caused on a trackday is a clear example of this.
I never claimed to be so not sure what that comment was about? The massive thread in SP&L encouraging someone to sue another person for damage and injury caused on a trackday is a clear example of this.
If I signed a document that said words to the effect of 'you may get injured as a result of doing this', then went and did it and got injured, surely the organisers are covered?
George29 said:
JacquesMesrine said:
Damn right you're no legal expert. It is impossible in the UK to sign away your rights around injury caused by others negligence. Whether people sue or not is down to their own moral compass.
The massive thread in SP&L encouraging someone to sue another person for damage and injury caused on a trackday is a clear example of this.
I never claimed to be so not sure what that comment was about? The massive thread in SP&L encouraging someone to sue another person for damage and injury caused on a trackday is a clear example of this.
If I signed a document that said words to the effect of 'you may get injured as a result of doing this', then went and did it and got injured, surely the organisers are covered?
The organiser would not be covered. Have a look at the disclaimers on trackdays amd they all say "save as for injury or death", that is to be sure that the damage and other terms that you sign up to are enforceable and ensures that the injury / death piece is specifically excluded. If they included it, then it would render the whole of the exclusions null and void due to unenforceable terms.
Edited by JacquesMesrine on Friday 5th February 18:53
JacquesMesrine said:
The comment was me specifically agreeing with you that you're no legal expert, which I'll now doubly reiterate and you've posted the same incorrect statement again. You do not know the law here, you are giving an opinion and it is incorrect, you are not a legal expert. You are wrong.
The organiser would not be covered. Have a look at the disclaimers on trackdays amd they all say "save as for injury or death", that is tome sure that the da,age and other terms that you sign up to are enforceable and ensures that the injury / death piece is specifically excluded. If they included it, then it would render the whole of the exclusions null and void due to unenforceable terms.
Again, I never professed to be right. I'm using logic, something you clearly cannot grasp so you will just be a prick about. The organiser would not be covered. Have a look at the disclaimers on trackdays amd they all say "save as for injury or death", that is tome sure that the da,age and other terms that you sign up to are enforceable and ensures that the injury / death piece is specifically excluded. If they included it, then it would render the whole of the exclusions null and void due to unenforceable terms.
George29 said:
Again, I never professed to be right. I'm using logic, something you clearly cannot grasp so you will just be a prick about.
Blimey. You said you weren't a legal expert and I agreed with you. I thought that was a pretty logical statement. I can't do much if you're going to call me a prick for agreeing with you. Does that make you a prick too?I think they may well have been looking to do a backflip but that was an initial 'show' moment where they would stop, atop the jump.
The rider in control may possibly not have had enough oomph to get up the ramp and stop to chat to the compere? He stops short and then unfortunately the bike rolls backwards.
I would be fairly sure that was not the 'real' attempt to backflip.......
The rider in control may possibly not have had enough oomph to get up the ramp and stop to chat to the compere? He stops short and then unfortunately the bike rolls backwards.
I would be fairly sure that was not the 'real' attempt to backflip.......
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