Petrol Station Argument - Sitting on the Bike?
Discussion
Steve Bass said:
Yet when my flight was diverted/hijacked and had to land in Harare, we were NOT allowed off the plane as it refuelled and took on fresh chicken giblets.
At no point did anyone offer me a helmet or a walky talky so I say it's all madnness.
The above may/may not assist in anyones argument but you're free to use it as anecdotal evidence...
Aircraft don't fall over and over-filling (or slipping with the nozzle in hand) doesn't pour fuel over your crown jewels, causing you to tip the aircraft over into the tanker!At no point did anyone offer me a helmet or a walky talky so I say it's all madnness.
The above may/may not assist in anyones argument but you're free to use it as anecdotal evidence...
Mad Jock said:
The 2nd bloke wasn't sitting on the bike and got worse injuries from the fire caused by his total lack of attention.How can you not notice that the bike is overflowing with fuel? If he'd been sitting on it he's have noticed earlier!
Trabi601 said:
I'm in the business. It's not legislative, but something recommended by fire officers / petroleum officers and is generally an adopted policy by petrol retailers.
It's dangerous - the consequence of something going wrong is very high and the risk is moderate - on a live forecourt this isn't an acceptable balance / risk assessment.
Slipping whilst refuelling, then ending up pinned under a bike with fuel pouring out onto you isn't a good thing - especially as you then put a member of staff / public at risk assisting you in picking up the bike. It's quiet easy to break bones if you get pinned between the pump island and a fallen bike.
The other risk is that of fire - whilst rare, it's not unknown for a spillage whilst 'straddling' to cause fatalities. There was one a few years ago in India, where a young child riding pillion was burned to death when her father had a spillage whilst straddling a hot bike.
A couple of years ago, a BP station in Northern Ireland had a forecourt fire which burned out an entire island and a motorbike due to a spilling whilst filling on the bike - it even melted the canopy sheeting.
As a biker myself, the additional fuel you get in is so marginal, I don't understand why it's seen as a big issue. Certainly not worth the risk of a fall or fire to squeeze in a few extra drops.
I stay on the bike too but that's a good post, I'll get off next time (if I remember)It's dangerous - the consequence of something going wrong is very high and the risk is moderate - on a live forecourt this isn't an acceptable balance / risk assessment.
Slipping whilst refuelling, then ending up pinned under a bike with fuel pouring out onto you isn't a good thing - especially as you then put a member of staff / public at risk assisting you in picking up the bike. It's quiet easy to break bones if you get pinned between the pump island and a fallen bike.
The other risk is that of fire - whilst rare, it's not unknown for a spillage whilst 'straddling' to cause fatalities. There was one a few years ago in India, where a young child riding pillion was burned to death when her father had a spillage whilst straddling a hot bike.
A couple of years ago, a BP station in Northern Ireland had a forecourt fire which burned out an entire island and a motorbike due to a spilling whilst filling on the bike - it even melted the canopy sheeting.
As a biker myself, the additional fuel you get in is so marginal, I don't understand why it's seen as a big issue. Certainly not worth the risk of a fall or fire to squeeze in a few extra drops.
Trabi601 said:
Steve Bass said:
Yet when my flight was diverted/hijacked and had to land in Harare, we were NOT allowed off the plane as it refuelled and took on fresh chicken giblets.
At no point did anyone offer me a helmet or a walky talky so I say it's all madnness.
The above may/may not assist in anyones argument but you're free to use it as anecdotal evidence...
Aircraft don't fall over and over-filling (or slipping with the nozzle in hand) doesn't pour fuel over your crown jewels, causing you to tip the aircraft over into the tanker!At no point did anyone offer me a helmet or a walky talky so I say it's all madnness.
The above may/may not assist in anyones argument but you're free to use it as anecdotal evidence...
BTW, I think you're taking this all too seriously
Personally, if it's so dangerous, I think I should be able to have a ciggy as i fill up as it might be my last. Like a condemned man kinda thing. Human rights init....
boxxob said:
mph1977 said:
graham22 said:
The safety factor here is so obvious it worries me what sort of person is disputing it:
It's the kind of person who confuses the plural of anecdote with data ... It's the kind of person who thinks rules are for others , they are exceptional becasue they are mummy's special little soldier ...
boxxob said:
mph1977 said:
boxxob said:
mph1977 said:
graham22 said:
The safety factor here is so obvious it worries me what sort of person is disputing it:
It's the kind of person who confuses the plural of anecdote with data ... It's the kind of person who thinks rules are for others , they are exceptional becasue they are mummy's special little soldier ...
You're sort of right: I was foolish to engage you and you're little angsty outbursts in conversation.
Trabi601 said:
BP sites in S. Africa are independently owned businesses - I'm not sure what legal framework exists for ensuring an independent operator is complying with company policy out there, but it can be a very murky area.
What legal framework? Do you really think the houses of parliament have just recently passed a law so motorcycles can't sit on their bikes at the petrol pump? WinstonWolf said:
So we now have a scenario where you have petrol on your b
ks (we both know this DOES happen) above a source of ignition and you still can't figure out what can go wrong???
The bike starts to slip as your feet are on diesel, you have a petrol nozzle in one hand and an open tank of fuel. How many hands do you have free to control the situation?
This must be the first time my opinion has been changed by a post on the 'net but it does happen, I can see how things could escalate quickly in the wrong circumstances.
You have the scenario of spilling fuel regardless of you being on it or not. So that's moot. If the engine is not running there's no source of ignition. So that's unchanged whether I'm on it or not. I don't dispute a bike is more stable on it's kickstand but how long are your bloody arms that a free hand can stop the bike falling if you lose both feet? Again moot.ks (we both know this DOES happen) above a source of ignition and you still can't figure out what can go wrong???The bike starts to slip as your feet are on diesel, you have a petrol nozzle in one hand and an open tank of fuel. How many hands do you have free to control the situation?
This must be the first time my opinion has been changed by a post on the 'net but it does happen, I can see how things could escalate quickly in the wrong circumstances.
You're also phenomenally missing my point, imaginary or not, I do not dispute the potential existence of a hazard, I dispute the risk. I could, for example, be eaten by an alligator. But as I live in the UK, the risk of such an event is so low, I don't change my behaviour to account for it. Moreover, since there has not been a wild alligator sighting in the recorded history of the UK, and no one can prove otherwise, I don't think I should be told it's essential to alter my behaviour on the grounds of safety from alligators. Especially if the behaviour that allegedly makes me safer, remains unproven.
Now you may think it's ridiculous analogy, but I actually struggle to see why it's not equivalent.
Prof Prolapse said:
You have the scenario of spilling fuel regardless of you being on it or not. So that's moot. If the engine is not running there's no source of ignition. So that's unchanged whether I'm on it or not. I don't dispute a bike is more stable on it's kickstand but how long are your bloody arms that a free hand can stop the bike falling if you lose both feet? Again moot.
You're also phenomenally missing my point, imaginary or not, I do not dispute the potential existence of a hazard, I dispute the risk. I could, for example, be eaten by an alligator. But as I live in the UK, the risk of such an event is so low, I don't change my behaviour to account for it. Moreover, since there has not been a wild alligator sighting in the recorded history of the UK, and no one can prove otherwise, I don't think I should be told it's essential to alter my behaviour on the grounds of safety from alligators. Especially if the behaviour that allegedly makes me safer, remains unproven.
Now you may think it's ridiculous analogy, but I actually struggle to see why it's not equivalent.
I don't stand on cracks in the pavement for fear of it being the initial signs of a sink holeYou're also phenomenally missing my point, imaginary or not, I do not dispute the potential existence of a hazard, I dispute the risk. I could, for example, be eaten by an alligator. But as I live in the UK, the risk of such an event is so low, I don't change my behaviour to account for it. Moreover, since there has not been a wild alligator sighting in the recorded history of the UK, and no one can prove otherwise, I don't think I should be told it's essential to alter my behaviour on the grounds of safety from alligators. Especially if the behaviour that allegedly makes me safer, remains unproven.
Now you may think it's ridiculous analogy, but I actually struggle to see why it's not equivalent.
Prof Prolapse said:
Trabi601 said:
BP sites in S. Africa are independently owned businesses - I'm not sure what legal framework exists for ensuring an independent operator is complying with company policy out there, but it can be a very murky area.
What legal framework? Do you really think the houses of parliament have just recently passed a law so motorcycles can't sit on their bikes at the petrol pump? WinstonWolf said:
So we now have a scenario where you have petrol on your bks (we both know this DOES happen) above a source of ignition and you still can't figure out what can go wrong???
The bike starts to slip as your feet are on diesel, you have a petrol nozzle in one hand and an open tank of fuel. How many hands do you have free to control the situation?
This must be the first time my opinion has been changed by a post on the 'net but it does happen, I can see how things could escalate quickly in the wrong circumstances.
You have the scenario of spilling fuel regardless of you being on it or not. So that's moot. If the engine is not running there's no source of ignition. So that's unchanged whether I'm on it or not. I don't dispute a bike is more stable on it's kickstand but how long are your bloody arms that a free hand can stop the bike falling if you lose both feet? Again moot.ks (we both know this DOES happen) above a source of ignition and you still can't figure out what can go wrong???The bike starts to slip as your feet are on diesel, you have a petrol nozzle in one hand and an open tank of fuel. How many hands do you have free to control the situation?
This must be the first time my opinion has been changed by a post on the 'net but it does happen, I can see how things could escalate quickly in the wrong circumstances.
You're also phenomenally missing my point, imaginary or not, I do not dispute the potential existence of a hazard, I dispute the risk. I could, for example, be eaten by an alligator. But as I live in the UK, the risk of such an event is so low, I don't change my behaviour to account for it. Moreover, since there has not been a wild alligator sighting in the recorded history of the UK, and no one can prove otherwise, I don't think I should be told it's essential to alter my behaviour on the grounds of safety from alligators. Especially if the behaviour that allegedly makes me safer, remains unproven.
Now you may think it's ridiculous analogy, but I actually struggle to see why it's not equivalent.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrCkExl_PdY
Sorry, that's the third example of the thing that can't happen happening on this thread
TVRs regularly go up in flames as the fuel pipe in front of the bulkhead fails igniting fuel on the exhaust. Your claim that there is no source of ignition is wrong...
I must admit to sitting on the bike to fill it up, but I wouldn't question it if I was told to get off it.
I did once however get shouted at over the tannoy on Christmas eve 2 years ago for trying to fuel the car with the interior light on! no word of a lie. The jobsworth wouldn't zero the pump until I turned it off...
I did once however get shouted at over the tannoy on Christmas eve 2 years ago for trying to fuel the car with the interior light on! no word of a lie. The jobsworth wouldn't zero the pump until I turned it off...
jhoneyball said:
put the bike on the center stand if you are worried about the last half litre
I see people mention this a lot, but the majority of bikes don't have a centre stand?My tank is a terrible design, and I lose about 3L of space if it's not bolt up right, but I usually just accept that, it's a toy anyway.
Prof Prolapse said:
Trabi601 said:
BP sites in S. Africa are independently owned businesses - I'm not sure what legal framework exists for ensuring an independent operator is complying with company policy out there, but it can be a very murky area.
What legal framework? Do you really think the houses of parliament have just recently passed a law so motorcycles can't sit on their bikes at the petrol pump? We have the ability to strip someone of their branding if they continually break company health and safety policy - but it's a very messy process to enforce.
It may be that in SA, it's not legally possible, or even more difficult to do this.
Okay so I am newbie at this biking game , my instructor always taught me to fill up at the pumps with the foot stand down but sitting on the bike to get a bit more diesel in.
I adopted this technique for several months , until a recent incident when my sandals were too tight and a litre of shell's finest reached "my parts other fuels aren't suppose to reach".
So what now ? Well I still fill up perched atop my 50cc superbike, but wearing my fire proof underwear , having the fire service on my mobile speed dial and cigarette lighter so I can see how full the tank is
no problem so far , except for the alligators
I adopted this technique for several months , until a recent incident when my sandals were too tight and a litre of shell's finest reached "my parts other fuels aren't suppose to reach".
So what now ? Well I still fill up perched atop my 50cc superbike, but wearing my fire proof underwear , having the fire service on my mobile speed dial and cigarette lighter so I can see how full the tank is
no problem so far , except for the alligators
Adrianw said:
Okay so I am newbie at this biking game , my instructor always taught me to fill up at the pumps with the foot stand down but sitting on the bike to get a bit more diesel in.
I adopted this technique for several months , until a recent incident when my sandals were too tight and a litre of shell's finest reached "my parts other fuels aren't suppose to reach".
So what now ? Well I still fill up perched atop my 50cc superbike, but wearing my fire proof underwear , having the fire service on my mobile speed dial and cigarette lighter so I can see how full the tank is
no problem so far , except for the alligators
I know it's a great laugh but fires on bikes are a real potential issue. I adopted this technique for several months , until a recent incident when my sandals were too tight and a litre of shell's finest reached "my parts other fuels aren't suppose to reach".
So what now ? Well I still fill up perched atop my 50cc superbike, but wearing my fire proof underwear , having the fire service on my mobile speed dial and cigarette lighter so I can see how full the tank is
no problem so far , except for the alligators
This is a (very expensive!) old bike that went up in flames at an event in Biarritz earlier this month, caused by a fuel tap failing and allowing fuel to drop onto the engine.
I live in fear of fire when riding the older bikes, and I've come very, very close to losing a bike when a float stuck and sprayed fuel onto the back of the cylinder head. I stood there helplessly watching as steam enveloped the bike, but luckily it didn't ignite.
I'd just like to know if the hot feeling of (unignited) unleaded fuel on your bks is a nice kind of hot like when you put your man meat inside two warm slices of toast which have just come out of a toaster or the not so nice kind of hot like when your S&M partner overdoes the not oil before pouring it on your bks?
ks is a nice kind of hot like when you put your man meat inside two warm slices of toast which have just come out of a toaster or the not so nice kind of hot like when your S&M partner overdoes the not oil before pouring it on your bks? I really didn't enjoy having my balls doused. Twice it's happened when I was under cars changing the fuel filter. To answer your question at first it just feels cold, then itchy hot, then more like someone has stuffed nettled down your under crackers.
It is a good reason not to sit down and fill up if you're clumsy like me.
It is a good reason not to sit down and fill up if you're clumsy like me.
Didn´t this one just do the rounds recently..?
ETA, yup... I´m getting old alreet but still got some grey matter somewhere...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=127...
ETA, yup... I´m getting old alreet but still got some grey matter somewhere...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=127...
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