Discussion
Ok, 60,000 mile older, but the 636 is a wheelie monster. And I'm not a wheelie god. How do I;-
a) keep the front wheel down on a GP start
b) control the front for a constant height wheelie
I did a monster hoist accidentally outside a pub. About 50 people saw it, but it nearly flipped. The XJR didn't do this !!!
rgds.
a) keep the front wheel down on a GP start
b) control the front for a constant height wheelie
I did a monster hoist accidentally outside a pub. About 50 people saw it, but it nearly flipped. The XJR didn't do this !!!
rgds.
Nutter 
A mate of mine does them off the clutch and uses the back brake to steady the bike , i start off in 1st get to 9k go full throttle and the front comes up on its own then i control it with the throttle just cant do clutch wheelies , i just lean further forward to stop the front coming up though somtimes the rear tyre lights up 
>> Edited by dennisthemenace on Tuesday 3rd September 15:55
A mate of mine does them off the clutch and uses the back brake to steady the bike , i start off in 1st get to 9k go full throttle and the front comes up on its own then i control it with the throttle just cant do clutch wheelies , i just lean further forward to stop the front coming up though somtimes the rear tyre lights up >> Edited by dennisthemenace on Tuesday 3rd September 15:55
start off with small ones and just give it more throttle to get the front up , keep the back brake covered if it comes up too high give it a tap and it will bring the front end down try and make the coming down smooth though to many hard landings with knacker fork seals and head bearings.
my wheelies arent that high but i can do a good 100 meters if i get it right
>> Edited by dennisthemenace on Tuesday 3rd September 16:48
my wheelies arent that high but i can do a good 100 meters if i get it right
>> Edited by dennisthemenace on Tuesday 3rd September 16:48
The letting out of the clutch has too be rapid but not "dumped" as is often said. Wind it up to about 6K-7K doing a good rolling speed 10-20mph, off revs, clutch in, on revs, then out quickly combined with a gentle tug and up she comes, find the balance point which is always higher than you think then hold it on power, grab 2nd before you rev out of the power but remember to roll off throttle as this is the most likely place to flip it then repeat up through gears as far as you can. Always keep back brake covered as dabbing it will bring you down PDQ and when you get really good watch for the front wheel slowing down otherwise when you put it down it's similar to and aircraft landing and will give the mother of all tank slappers
I'm no expert but I've done a few, first bit of advice is what bike to learn on:
1. someone else's!
2. Old motocrosser or trailie.
Personally I don't do them (deliberatley) on the Duke
as
1. The balance point is so high that it's scary.:biggirlsblouse:
2. Dukes are well known for sh1tting their oil into the airbox when "airborne":buggerwhatamess:
3. Costs alot of money if you drop it.
4. Hurts if you get it wrong and I'm not keen on Hospital food!
However that said it does hook'em up beautifully smooth and slowly - plenty of mid-range helps.
Anyway if your bike has the power then use it, it comes up much smoother than with the clutch IMO (and Duke clutches are too fragile!), my prefered way:
1st gear, get up to around your peak torque (5-7000rpm on a 916) at a steady pace then shut the throttle quickly and "snap" it open again - up she comes, keep the back brake covered JIC, in fact many of the best control the balance with a combination of throttle and rear brake that way you don't need to be accelerating too hard to stay up (me, I can only hold it up for any time by accelerating).
Clutch wheelies are a bit easier to do as you can do'em at higher speeds,(better balanced), but they knacker your clutch and can be a bit violent on lift-off, a mate of mine's speciality is the 60mph "hoist" (using the clutch) when behind you then overtaking you at anything up to about 110ish on his R1 - fcuking nutter shagged his clutch in 3000 miles! (Yamaha replaced it under warranty as they said that it should last much longer!)
My favourite is old 'crossers as they wheelie easy (low weight, high power, upright riding position etc) and they don't break too easily when you flip'em, my KTM 500 is a top wheelie-monster and it's about knackered so it doesn't matter if (when!) I flip it.
with the KTM I don't need the clutch as it is very powerful, light and short (easy to flip).
Best way to learn.
1. There is a guy runs a "wheelie school" with (his!) 1200 bandits fitted with an "anti-flip" device who reckons he can teach anyone in a day without too much danger. He also sells the "anti-flip" device as a kit.
2. Get an old crosser (and a back protector) on a field and use the "trial and error" method. (can be painful - but fun)
3. Just go for it, on the road, on your own (new!) bike and hope for the best! :fcukingmentalist:
as you say keep it shiny side up (well at 45 degrees anyway!)
Now if I could just do a "stoppie".......
:allthesamedangersbuthurtsmoreifyoufcukup:
>> Edited by cazzo on Tuesday 3rd September 20:53
1. someone else's!
2. Old motocrosser or trailie.
Personally I don't do them (deliberatley) on the Duke
as 1. The balance point is so high that it's scary.:biggirlsblouse:
2. Dukes are well known for sh1tting their oil into the airbox when "airborne":buggerwhatamess:
3. Costs alot of money if you drop it.
4. Hurts if you get it wrong and I'm not keen on Hospital food!
However that said it does hook'em up beautifully smooth and slowly - plenty of mid-range helps.
Anyway if your bike has the power then use it, it comes up much smoother than with the clutch IMO (and Duke clutches are too fragile!), my prefered way:
1st gear, get up to around your peak torque (5-7000rpm on a 916) at a steady pace then shut the throttle quickly and "snap" it open again - up she comes, keep the back brake covered JIC, in fact many of the best control the balance with a combination of throttle and rear brake that way you don't need to be accelerating too hard to stay up (me, I can only hold it up for any time by accelerating).
Clutch wheelies are a bit easier to do as you can do'em at higher speeds,(better balanced), but they knacker your clutch and can be a bit violent on lift-off, a mate of mine's speciality is the 60mph "hoist" (using the clutch) when behind you then overtaking you at anything up to about 110ish on his R1 - fcuking nutter shagged his clutch in 3000 miles! (Yamaha replaced it under warranty as they said that it should last much longer!
) My favourite is old 'crossers as they wheelie easy (low weight, high power, upright riding position etc) and they don't break too easily when you flip'em, my KTM 500 is a top wheelie-monster and it's about knackered so it doesn't matter if (when!) I flip it.
with the KTM I don't need the clutch as it is very powerful, light and short (easy to flip). Best way to learn.
1. There is a guy runs a "wheelie school" with (his!) 1200 bandits fitted with an "anti-flip" device who reckons he can teach anyone in a day without too much danger. He also sells the "anti-flip" device as a kit.
2. Get an old crosser (and a back protector) on a field and use the "trial and error" method. (can be painful - but fun)
3. Just go for it, on the road, on your own (new!) bike and hope for the best! :fcukingmentalist:
as you say keep it shiny side up (well at 45 degrees anyway!)
Now if I could just do a "stoppie".......
:allthesamedangersbuthurtsmoreifyoufcukup:
>> Edited by cazzo on Tuesday 3rd September 20:53
An old moped is a good tool to learn on too. I remember practicing for hours on my FS1-E. I was chuffed as hell when I managed to wheelie 30ft. Then some smartarse jumped on and wheelied about 1/4 mile up the road, turned round, and wheelied all the way back again.
Some folk have the natural balance, some don't. Personally I don't, and rely on brute force and reactions. Those that do can probably wheelie anything and keep it up (whhe-eey) for hours.
Stoppies - I think I may have had possibly the first road bike to be able to do this - the original GSXR750. Light, monster powerful brakes, decent forks and sticky rubber. Used to do them a lot (and "power" wheelies too - nice sharp power band meant any apex to a gradient was a 130mph takeoff zone!)
>> Edited by philshort on Tuesday 3rd September 21:06
Some folk have the natural balance, some don't. Personally I don't, and rely on brute force and reactions. Those that do can probably wheelie anything and keep it up (whhe-eey) for hours.
Stoppies - I think I may have had possibly the first road bike to be able to do this - the original GSXR750. Light, monster powerful brakes, decent forks and sticky rubber. Used to do them a lot (and "power" wheelies too - nice sharp power band meant any apex to a gradient was a 130mph takeoff zone!)
>> Edited by philshort on Tuesday 3rd September 21:06
quote:
An old moped is a good tool to learn on too. I remember practicing for hours on my FS1-E.
My first wheelies were on a twist-n-go moped (apart from pushbike as a kid) - lots of brute force required to get it up (phnarr phnarr!) but good balance required to keep it up (ooh missus!)
If I remember correctly, Some bloke wheelied the entire IOM TT course! - had an electric motor on the front wheel to keep it spinning as the gyroscopic force helps balance.. but still 20 odd miles of curves etc :takeshatoffinrespect:
quote:
Stoppies - I think I may have had possibly the first road bike to be able to do this - the original GSXR750.
Did my first stoppie on a push bike (straight over the bars!) but I've always thought the long rolling stoppies look the dogs' but never achieved more than a quickie myself though.
BTW the Boys in Blue don't like wheelies, something about not being in "proper control" of the bike but IMO anyone who can pull a 300yd minger is in perfect control
Remember not only are wheelies big and clever...but the bigger they are the cleverer they are.
quote:
1. There is a guy runs a "wheelie school" with (his!) 1200 bandits fitted with an "anti-flip" device who reckons he can teach anyone in a day without too much danger. He also sells the "anti-flip" device as a kit.
Friend of mine went on this with his Mrs who had bought the day for them as a pressie. He did ok (had previously flipped an R1 on an M25 slip road at "high speed") She came home a little battered and bruised with a couple of stiches in her chin having successfully flipped the un flipable 1200 Nail oooops sorry Bandit. It's a good way to learn sure but don't go expecting anything really flash every single bike will have a shagged clutch and will have been on it's back more times than the local Tom.
this flip-prevention device... wonder how effective it is, and how much? what you reckon my insurance company (or old Bill!) would reckon if they saw it fitted?
If you have a failsafe device to stop flips, then it really takes the risk out of it.. mmmmmm. Interesting.
cheers for the advice lads.
If you have a failsafe device to stop flips, then it really takes the risk out of it.. mmmmmm. Interesting.
cheers for the advice lads.
quote:
So wahts everyones worst wheelie then ?? mine was hitting the kill switch has i was pulling the front up , nearly dropped the bike
More bad ones than good but the most memorable:
1. Most embarrassing - As a 17yr old with newly acquired first "proper" bike (Ducati 250 Scrambler) performing for the "Ladeeez" (group of 16/17 yr old schoolgirls!) gave it too much gas combined with piss-poor technique ending up with bike vertical and me trying to run after it holding on the bars, inevitably me and bike finished on the deck, this was at a busy roundabout at around rush hour, no physical injury and bike only slightly bent, but my pulling power/street cred seriously damaged!
Result - Made the girls laugh but didn't drop their "knickers" as I had hoped!
2. Most painful - On a new (borrowed!) VTR 1000 (Firestorm), giving it some on exit from a bend, rear wheel losing grip on some loose stuff, gripping again lifting front up, me sliding backwards down the seat pulling throttle open and then in a panic shutting throttle, front crashing down, bang, smash, crash, wobble, slap, highside, oh sh1t, finally finishing with me face down in a pile of grit and bike sliding up the verge.
Result - £400 damage, broken collarbone, cracked ribs.
3. Most amusing - A couple of months ago "showing" the kids (and their mates) how to wheelie a Quad (kid's quad 50cc - very short wheelbase) came up too high (vertical!) me flat on my back in front of the kids, whilst quad carries on going on 2 wheels for about 15 feet, kids thought it was funny!
Result - "my dad's a plonker"
quote:
this flip-prevention device... wonder how effective it is, and how much? what you reckon my insurance company (or old Bill!) would reckon if they saw it fitted?
As I understand it, it is a type of limit switch with a long arm, you position it under the no. plate so that the arm makes contact with the road when the bike is at or past the balance point. The switch is then wired into your kill switch so that when it contacts the road it kills the engine, causing loss of power/engine braking to bring you down, as soon as you're below the balance point again the engine comes back on (sort of like a traction control).
In theory you can't flip but as Mel said it can be flipped I would imagine if you hook up too quickly it could be too late by the time it kills the motor.
If fitting it I would definately fit an overide as it would be very tempting/entertaining for your mates to flick the switch with their foot whilst riding alongside.
Don't know about the Insurance (why tell'em), doubt old Bill would notice and anyway it's a safety aid like a traction control so should be welcomed.
As for cost, basically it's just a switch, a bracket and some wiring - shouldn't be much and if you can find a suitable switch you could always make your own. Maybe a tilt switch would work but it would need to not register hard braking or acceleration, one advantage of a tilt switch would be it could be positioned internally (under the seat) Mmmm...
Spyball alarm anyone!
Seems like such a common sense device - you could have it so a wheelie never went past 30 degrees, or whatever angle you felt safe at. The boring ones out there could even set it for zero degrees...
I assume that a swing arm attachment would be ok for this. Sounds just too good to be true? - would this allow the 'perfect' wheelie? the misfire would stop as soon as the elevation becomes safe, so would the bike then 'float' at the preset level?
I could see this becoming the next big "must have" accessory.
C
I assume that a swing arm attachment would be ok for this. Sounds just too good to be true? - would this allow the 'perfect' wheelie? the misfire would stop as soon as the elevation becomes safe, so would the bike then 'float' at the preset level?
I could see this becoming the next big "must have" accessory.
C
Thanks for the info guys - It looks like I'll be trashing the bike this weekend then.....
I've got an old 1970 Triumph trophy 250 street scrambler thing that I might practice on before risking it on my proper bike. I didn't think it would have enough power, but if you guys have done it on a twist and go it should be OK.
sjm
I've got an old 1970 Triumph trophy 250 street scrambler thing that I might practice on before risking it on my proper bike. I didn't think it would have enough power, but if you guys have done it on a twist and go it should be OK.
sjm
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