S1000rr or 848 evo
Discussion
rapide said:
3DP said:
But an 848 is eminantly thrashable on the road and easy to hammer
I love how 140bhp sportsbikes with a better power to weight ratio than a 999 are now just eminently thrashable to the riding gods 
I've known Scott for a few years and ridden with him a good number of times. He's not amazing on corners, which he'll happily admit and doesn't profess to being a riding god. He does have plenty of balls for thrashing a bike up in a straight line and on moderate sweepers. Neither of us are delusional, both of us would probably qualify as idiots by your measures. He's definitely capable of thrashing an 848 on the road, but perhaps our definitions of 'thrashing' are different.
3DP said:
I don't know why you keep battering this point. You have an 848 you love - great. You fit it with PR3s - great, but tells me most of what I need to know about how you like to ride a sports bike like that. Please don't continue to judge others by your own standards.
I've known Scott for a few years and ridden with him a good number of times. He's not amazing on corners, which he'll happily admit and doesn't profess to being a riding god. He does have plenty of balls for thrashing a bike up in a straight line and on moderate sweepers. Neither of us are delusional, both of us would probably qualify as idiots by your measures. He's definitely capable of thrashing an 848 on the road, but perhaps our definitions of 'thrashing' are different.
I was hardly laboring a point - I was calling out complete BS. Like the kind you continue to spout, assuming someone rides like driving miss daisy because they've fitted a sports touring tyre to a sportsbike. I fitted PR3s because I've been enjoying using it to commute on passable weather days recently, and I have a road trip to Monaco planned for the end of April, so wanted a tyre capable of taking wet weather and miles. I have a set of SCs in the garage for the summer where I'll do a few trackdays (inters) like I have done most years - greatI've known Scott for a few years and ridden with him a good number of times. He's not amazing on corners, which he'll happily admit and doesn't profess to being a riding god. He does have plenty of balls for thrashing a bike up in a straight line and on moderate sweepers. Neither of us are delusional, both of us would probably qualify as idiots by your measures. He's definitely capable of thrashing an 848 on the road, but perhaps our definitions of 'thrashing' are different.
I don't profess to being a riding god either, and yes maybe its just conflicting definitions of 'thrashing'. My definition involves extracting the good majority of the performance of the bike, which in this case leads to 150mph in very little time at all, on a bike that had a race series built around it and has proven capable of taking a real thrashing. So yes, I do think anyone regularly straight line heroing the full performance of an 848 Evo on the road is a idiot. And given the bikes proven capability around corners, if you really think you're somehow giving an 848 Evo a hard time on the road I'm afraid you and your mate are delusional.
rapide said:
3DP said:
I don't know why you keep battering this point. You have an 848 you love - great. You fit it with PR3s - great, but tells me most of what I need to know about how you like to ride a sports bike like that. Please don't continue to judge others by your own standards.
I've known Scott for a few years and ridden with him a good number of times. He's not amazing on corners, which he'll happily admit and doesn't profess to being a riding god. He does have plenty of balls for thrashing a bike up in a straight line and on moderate sweepers. Neither of us are delusional, both of us would probably qualify as idiots by your measures. He's definitely capable of thrashing an 848 on the road, but perhaps our definitions of 'thrashing' are different.
I was hardly laboring a point - I was calling out complete BS. Like the kind you continue to spout, assuming someone rides like driving miss daisy because they've fitted a sports touring tyre to a sportsbike. I fitted PR3s because I've been enjoying using it to commute on passable weather days recently, and I have a road trip to Monaco planned for the end of April, so wanted a tyre capable of taking wet weather and miles. I have a set of SCs in the garage for the summer where I'll do a few trackdays (inters) like I have done most years - greatI've known Scott for a few years and ridden with him a good number of times. He's not amazing on corners, which he'll happily admit and doesn't profess to being a riding god. He does have plenty of balls for thrashing a bike up in a straight line and on moderate sweepers. Neither of us are delusional, both of us would probably qualify as idiots by your measures. He's definitely capable of thrashing an 848 on the road, but perhaps our definitions of 'thrashing' are different.
I don't profess to being a riding god either, and yes maybe its just conflicting definitions of 'thrashing'. My definition involves extracting the good majority of the performance of the bike, which in this case leads to 150mph in very little time at all, on a bike that had a race series built around it and has proven capable of taking a real thrashing. So yes, I do think anyone regularly straight line heroing the full performance of an 848 Evo on the road is a idiot. And given the bikes proven capability around corners, if you really think you're somehow giving an 848 Evo a hard time on the road I'm afraid you and your mate are delusional.
ks... Don't forget that anytime anyone rolls open to anything more than 60% throttle in the mid range of an 1198, they are using more than an 848 can give at WOT. Using extra torque and power does not mean TT pace.Tell you what - you lend me your 848 and I'll show you how to thrash it. Rev it from cold, I'll overheat the clutch, over-rev it, downshift too early, do harsh clutchless changes and land some fully cut throttle wheelies. Then try to tell me you can't thrash a bike like that on the road. Then try it on an S1000RR with slipper clutches, electrics, wet clutch, and 60bhp more and you'll see which will survive it for longer.
Thrash implies a level of mechanical lack of sympathy and using things heavily, not point to point pace or rider skill.
And this is not a demolition of Ducati - I personally have no interest in the S1000RR and am on my 3rd Ducati, but I mollycoddle my Ducatis way more than I do my other Jap bikes.
I stand by what I say that Scott will have far more of a chance of landing a big bill and being aggro'ed by an 848. I also think he would benefit from the electronics suite on the S1000RR (in spite of me preferring a more analogue 848).
3DP said:
Double whammy - You still massively miss the point, while thinking that because you can't or are unwilling to use more than your 848 has to give on the road, anyone else who can or will is talking bks... Don't forget that anytime anyone rolls open to anything more than 60% throttle in the mid range of an 1198, they are using more than an 848 can give at WOT. Using extra torque and power does not mean TT pace.
Tell you what - you lend me your 848 and I'll show you how to thrash it. Rev it from cold, I'll overheat the clutch, over-rev it, downshift too early, do harsh clutchless changes and land some fully cut throttle wheelies. Then try to tell me you can't thrash a bike like that on the road. Then try it on an S1000RR with slipper clutches, electrics, wet clutch, and 60bhp more and you'll see which will survive it for longer.
Thrash implies a level of mechanical lack of sympathy and using things heavily, not point to point pace or rider skill.
And this is not a demolition of Ducati - I personally have no interest in the S1000RR and am on my 3rd Ducati, but I mollycoddle my Ducatis way more than I do my other Jap bikes.
I stand by what I say that Scott will have far more of a chance of landing a big bill and being aggro'ed by an 848. I also think he would benefit from the electronics suite on the S1000RR (in spite of me preferring a more analogue 848).
No points missed. You're just continuing to jump to conclusions about how I ride; and have a different definition of giving a bike a thrashing than I do. ks... Don't forget that anytime anyone rolls open to anything more than 60% throttle in the mid range of an 1198, they are using more than an 848 can give at WOT. Using extra torque and power does not mean TT pace.Tell you what - you lend me your 848 and I'll show you how to thrash it. Rev it from cold, I'll overheat the clutch, over-rev it, downshift too early, do harsh clutchless changes and land some fully cut throttle wheelies. Then try to tell me you can't thrash a bike like that on the road. Then try it on an S1000RR with slipper clutches, electrics, wet clutch, and 60bhp more and you'll see which will survive it for longer.
Thrash implies a level of mechanical lack of sympathy and using things heavily, not point to point pace or rider skill.
And this is not a demolition of Ducati - I personally have no interest in the S1000RR and am on my 3rd Ducati, but I mollycoddle my Ducatis way more than I do my other Jap bikes.
I stand by what I say that Scott will have far more of a chance of landing a big bill and being aggro'ed by an 848. I also think he would benefit from the electronics suite on the S1000RR (in spite of me preferring a more analogue 848).
Your description of thrashing to me is just deliberate abuse, and I don't really know why anyone would do that - but yep, agreed S1000RR will take misuse better. Sounds like a 848 isn't for Scott. He doesn't sound very interested anyway, so I have nothing further to add
I'm not rising further to the other stuff other than to say that I've owned litre bikes in the past, and I still regularly ride mates litre bikes. The opinion that 140bhp is enough for the road is not a rare or controversial one
rapide said:
3DP said:
Double whammy - You still massively miss the point, while thinking that because you can't or are unwilling to use more than your 848 has to give on the road, anyone else who can or will is talking bks... Don't forget that anytime anyone rolls open to anything more than 60% throttle in the mid range of an 1198, they are using more than an 848 can give at WOT. Using extra torque and power does not mean TT pace.
Tell you what - you lend me your 848 and I'll show you how to thrash it. Rev it from cold, I'll overheat the clutch, over-rev it, downshift too early, do harsh clutchless changes and land some fully cut throttle wheelies. Then try to tell me you can't thrash a bike like that on the road. Then try it on an S1000RR with slipper clutches, electrics, wet clutch, and 60bhp more and you'll see which will survive it for longer.
Thrash implies a level of mechanical lack of sympathy and using things heavily, not point to point pace or rider skill.
And this is not a demolition of Ducati - I personally have no interest in the S1000RR and am on my 3rd Ducati, but I mollycoddle my Ducatis way more than I do my other Jap bikes.
I stand by what I say that Scott will have far more of a chance of landing a big bill and being aggro'ed by an 848. I also think he would benefit from the electronics suite on the S1000RR (in spite of me preferring a more analogue 848).
No points missed. You're just continuing to jump to conclusions about how I ride; and have a different definition of giving a bike a thrashing than I do. ks... Don't forget that anytime anyone rolls open to anything more than 60% throttle in the mid range of an 1198, they are using more than an 848 can give at WOT. Using extra torque and power does not mean TT pace.Tell you what - you lend me your 848 and I'll show you how to thrash it. Rev it from cold, I'll overheat the clutch, over-rev it, downshift too early, do harsh clutchless changes and land some fully cut throttle wheelies. Then try to tell me you can't thrash a bike like that on the road. Then try it on an S1000RR with slipper clutches, electrics, wet clutch, and 60bhp more and you'll see which will survive it for longer.
Thrash implies a level of mechanical lack of sympathy and using things heavily, not point to point pace or rider skill.
And this is not a demolition of Ducati - I personally have no interest in the S1000RR and am on my 3rd Ducati, but I mollycoddle my Ducatis way more than I do my other Jap bikes.
I stand by what I say that Scott will have far more of a chance of landing a big bill and being aggro'ed by an 848. I also think he would benefit from the electronics suite on the S1000RR (in spite of me preferring a more analogue 848).
Your description of thrashing to me is just deliberate abuse, and I don't really know why anyone would do that - but yep, agreed S1000RR will take misuse better. Sounds like a 848 isn't for Scott. He doesn't sound very interested anyway, so I have nothing further to add
I'm not rising further to the other stuff other than to say that I've owned litre bikes in the past, and I still regularly ride mates litre bikes. The opinion that 140bhp is enough for the road is not a rare or controversial one
rapide said:
I agree with some of this, except the engine thrashing. That's exactly why I love my 848. If you're thrashing a 200bhp S1000RR on the road you're dulusional or an idiot in my opinion. Even on trackdays 99% of the riders aren't getting close to a geniune thrashing, and the few that are should stop showing off and go racing 
Edit to add. I can't really thrash an 848 either, but you can at least go through a few gears; and just give it the lot here and there without being completely irresponsible
Edit to add. I can't really thrash an 848 either, but you can at least go through a few gears; and just give it the lot here and there without being completely irresponsible
Edited by rapide on Sunday 26th March 21:40
rapide said:
3DP said:
But an 848 is eminantly thrashable on the road and easy to hammer
I love how 140bhp sportsbikes with a better power to weight ratio than a 999 are now just eminently thrashable to the riding gods Expect some comeback after this, especially when you post a pic of Usain Bolt in clogs, or an R1200GS on super corsas, or an 848 on PR3s. Great tyre, but a slow turning, sports touring tyre, prone to tread shuffle when you crack on - it's not even cutting edge in the wet anymore, is not even vaguely ideal on a Ducati chassis known for sluggish turn in. Chances are you'd be quicker and have more fun on a 1098 Streetfighter but that's a popular view that probably doesn't interest you, as much as a popular view that anything with over 100bhp is completely unexploitable on the road, doesn't interest me.
Happy to leave this thread too, as it reminds me why I don't post on here much anymore. Trite comments made by armchair critics who snipe and call BS when something doesn't match their view and they know nothing of the people involved.
Edited by 3DP on Tuesday 28th March 17:40
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