Aprilia RS250 Project
Discussion
MK3 Dan said:
Will admit I’m surprised by the weight the of the OEM pipes, very heavy for what they are, would consider a change if you could get a lightweight version that doesn’t warrant a jetting change.
Std RGV pipes are really heavy, they are double skinned with a mesh type layer inside. Twolane said:
Std RGV pipes are really heavy, they are double skinned with a mesh type layer inside.
Also interesting to find today that clip on's are very heavy. For a lightweight bike there does seem to be a mix of lightweight items and a few random heavy ones - guess some legislation or cost saving has been involved! Didnt get a chance over the weekend but had the day off today so spent a few hours on it.
Pretty much back to nothing now, annoyingly all the ring nut tools I had access too didn't fit the swingarm one so haven't been able to remove this - ordered one up and fingers crossed it will land for this weekend.
Also had the chain guide fall apart on me and they are no longer available - a quick google seems to suggest my only option is a Chinese one from eBay!
Nothing else to scary found, had one of the rear hugger bolts snap in the swingarm which is a pain but should be able to remove it. Some of the rear shock linkage had a couple of unhappy bolts so glad that I am stripping this down and replacing the bearings and regreasing.
Haven't investigated properly but think the rear caliper maybe seized as noted some wear on the inside of it and one piston out a lot further than another.
Borrowed an ultrasonic cleaner to do the carbs but surprised at how much it cleans other items, side by side for comparison on the front calipers (Will come apart and be done properly, this was just to test).
Hopefully the swing arm tool shows up for this weekend and I can complete cleaning it and getting new bearings in to start the rebuild. Need to get on the engine soon!
Pretty much back to nothing now, annoyingly all the ring nut tools I had access too didn't fit the swingarm one so haven't been able to remove this - ordered one up and fingers crossed it will land for this weekend.
Also had the chain guide fall apart on me and they are no longer available - a quick google seems to suggest my only option is a Chinese one from eBay!
Nothing else to scary found, had one of the rear hugger bolts snap in the swingarm which is a pain but should be able to remove it. Some of the rear shock linkage had a couple of unhappy bolts so glad that I am stripping this down and replacing the bearings and regreasing.
Haven't investigated properly but think the rear caliper maybe seized as noted some wear on the inside of it and one piston out a lot further than another.
Borrowed an ultrasonic cleaner to do the carbs but surprised at how much it cleans other items, side by side for comparison on the front calipers (Will come apart and be done properly, this was just to test).
Hopefully the swing arm tool shows up for this weekend and I can complete cleaning it and getting new bearings in to start the rebuild. Need to get on the engine soon!
Steve Bass said:
MK3 Dan said:
Steve Bass said:
I've got the full set of service manuals for the RS and the kit manuals for the RGV. shoot me a mail and I'll send them over if you want...
Thanks Steve, I have sent you a message.
MK3 Dan said:
Also interesting to find today that clip on's are very heavy. For a lightweight bike there does seem to be a mix of lightweight items and a few random heavy ones - guess some legislation or cost saving has been involved!
May be heavy on purpose to damp down vibration? Have you stripped them so you know what weight is due to the clip on, grip, end-weights etc. or is it the clip-on assembly that's heavy?MK3 Dan said:
Got an engine stand put together this evening thanks to a mate who can weld!
Hopefully the get the top ends apart over the next few evenings to see what I am dealing with.
What a great idea! Saving that pic and will do same with mine. Need to get top end done Dec/Jan time after I finish my GSXRHopefully the get the top ends apart over the next few evenings to see what I am dealing with.
Edited by MK3 Dan on Tuesday 14th November 20:27
Edited by MK3 Dan on Tuesday 14th November 20:27
stang65 said:
May be heavy on purpose to damp down vibration? Have you stripped them so you know what weight is due to the clip on, grip, end-weights etc. or is it the clip-on assembly that's heavy?
Completely stripped down for Cerakote so it is just the clip on itself. They are away now, I will weight it once back to see what it is.Birky_41 said:
What a great idea! Saving that pic and will do same with mine. Need to get top end done Dec/Jan time after I finish my GSXR
Was trying to find the best way to be able to access the lower power valve and upright was the best option.Just realised it was your videos I have been watching and making me look forward to getting this out on track, although your riding skills are well beyond mine!
Removed the cylinder heads and cylinders today. Was holding some hope as it apparently had been running and its only done 11,000 miles. Turns out that was false hope and the cylinders are not in great condition so will need replating.
Power valve on the lower cylinder also doesnt move correctly and the bushing has worn so the shaft moves around, more investigation is needed.
Getting the cylinders done will hold me up a little on the timescale and I may need to hold off slightly due to the budget and wanting to do the crank as well.
Power valve on the lower cylinder also doesnt move correctly and the bushing has worn so the shaft moves around, more investigation is needed.
Getting the cylinders done will hold me up a little on the timescale and I may need to hold off slightly due to the budget and wanting to do the crank as well.
MK3 Dan said:
Ouch!! Still, nothing a rebore and replate won't fix, along with shiny new pistons. In fairness, 11000 kms is about the service life of the motor for a top end refresh but in your case, go through it end to end. Take particular care with the throttle to oil pump calibration (easily dome and well described in the manual) and then use only decent quality oil. make sure it's an oil pump system compatible oil as the top oils are often premix only (motul for example)
Once you split the cases, take a good look at the LHS main bearing. it's very susceptible to wear if the oil pump is slightly out of calibration. Not sure new cranks are available anymore but they can be pressed and rebuilt. Sean at TTW is a good port of call...
And once it's built, invest in a simple phone driven miniature wand camera so you can look down into the bores periodically without popping the heads off..
welcome to RS250 ownership
MK3 Dan said:
Removed the cylinder heads and cylinders today. Was holding some hope as it apparently had been running and its only done 11,000 miles. Turns out that was false hope and the cylinders are not in great condition so will need replating.
Power valve on the lower cylinder also doesnt move correctly and the bushing has worn so the shaft moves around, more investigation is needed.
Getting the cylinders done will hold me up a little on the timescale and I may need to hold off slightly due to the budget and wanting to do the crank as well.
I have seen lots of RGV250 cylinders, and that cylinder looks bad ! Power valve on the lower cylinder also doesnt move correctly and the bushing has worn so the shaft moves around, more investigation is needed.
Getting the cylinders done will hold me up a little on the timescale and I may need to hold off slightly due to the budget and wanting to do the crank as well.
Athena now have had the cylinders made, may not fit with your budget but i have these in stock if time scale is a issue.
The Cranks on the RGV/ RS 250 are not the strongest when new, although they were never made to be rebuilt can be rebuilt with care. The center section is pressed together but also welded which makes is tricky, i have seen some shocking attempts !
Let me know if you need help with the crank and such
Steve Bass said:
Ouch!!
Still, nothing a rebore and replate won't fix, along with shiny new pistons. In fairness, 11000 kms is about the service life of the motor for a top end refresh but in your case, go through it end to end. Take particular care with the throttle to oil pump calibration (easily dome and well described in the manual) and then use only decent quality oil. make sure it's an oil pump system compatible oil as the top oils are often premix only (motul for example)
Once you split the cases, take a good look at the LHS main bearing. it's very susceptible to wear if the oil pump is slightly out of calibration. Not sure new cranks are available anymore but they can be pressed and rebuilt. Sean at TTW is a good port of call...
And once it's built, invest in a simple phone driven miniature wand camera so you can look down into the bores periodically without popping the heads off..
welcome to RS250 ownership
That is what I am hoping for Steve, most cost effective for quality at the moment is to get onto Sean at TTW and see what he can do.Still, nothing a rebore and replate won't fix, along with shiny new pistons. In fairness, 11000 kms is about the service life of the motor for a top end refresh but in your case, go through it end to end. Take particular care with the throttle to oil pump calibration (easily dome and well described in the manual) and then use only decent quality oil. make sure it's an oil pump system compatible oil as the top oils are often premix only (motul for example)
Once you split the cases, take a good look at the LHS main bearing. it's very susceptible to wear if the oil pump is slightly out of calibration. Not sure new cranks are available anymore but they can be pressed and rebuilt. Sean at TTW is a good port of call...
And once it's built, invest in a simple phone driven miniature wand camera so you can look down into the bores periodically without popping the heads off..
welcome to RS250 ownership
Side note but see that Sean's website mentions him being airframes in the RAF, knew some people in the RAF when I was a teenager with RS's and I think they may have known Sean, plus my Dad was airframes in the RAF on Harriers!
Something does seem off with how bad this cylinder is and the fact the power valve is faulty. Oil fittings will be replaced and will be ran on Silkolene/Fuchs that is compatible. Have ordered a load of Tygon cheap but it is 2.4mm ID instead of the OEM 2mm so not sure if I can use this?
Suzuki still sell OEM cranks. I am very tempted, if i can sell mine for around £300 then it would cost my very little to fit a brand new one with our trade discount. Worth spending a little more to put brand new OEM in? Then replated cylinders and Pro X pistons wouldnt leave much to chance - other than me putting it together!
chippy348 said:
I have seen lots of RGV250 cylinders, and that cylinder looks bad !
Athena now have had the cylinders made, may not fit with your budget but i have these in stock if time scale is a issue.
The Cranks on the RGV/ RS 250 are not the strongest when new, although they were never made to be rebuilt can be rebuilt with care. The center section is pressed together but also welded which makes is tricky, i have seen some shocking attempts !
Let me know if you need help with the crank and such
Doesnt look great does it!Athena now have had the cylinders made, may not fit with your budget but i have these in stock if time scale is a issue.
The Cranks on the RGV/ RS 250 are not the strongest when new, although they were never made to be rebuilt can be rebuilt with care. The center section is pressed together but also welded which makes is tricky, i have seen some shocking attempts !
Let me know if you need help with the crank and such
Hopefully can be replated if not will look at options, in the trade so hopefully find something at a sensible price.
Understood on the crank, hence my comments in the last post, think new will be the way forward, especially with my pricing.
MK3 Dan said:
That is what I am hoping for Steve, most cost effective for quality at the moment is to get onto Sean at TTW and see what he can do.
Side note but see that Sean's website mentions him being airframes in the RAF, knew some people in the RAF when I was a teenager with RS's and I think they may have known Sean, plus my Dad was airframes in the RAF on Harriers!
Something does seem off with how bad this cylinder is and the fact the power valve is faulty. Oil fittings will be replaced and will be ran on Silkolene/Fuchs that is compatible. Have ordered a load of Tygon cheap but it is 2.4mm ID instead of the OEM 2mm so not sure if I can use this?
Suzuki still sell OEM cranks. I am very tempted, if i can sell mine for around £300 then it would cost my very little to fit a brand new one with our trade discount. Worth spending a little more to put brand new OEM in? Then replated cylinders and Pro X pistons wouldnt leave much to chance - other than me putting it together!
If new cranks are available, I’d definitely take that route. Not cheap but refurbishing an RS never is. I think that’s the key problem here, over their lifetime, the RS needed constant attention, fettling and $$$, something that the average owner couldn’t afford. Side note but see that Sean's website mentions him being airframes in the RAF, knew some people in the RAF when I was a teenager with RS's and I think they may have known Sean, plus my Dad was airframes in the RAF on Harriers!
Something does seem off with how bad this cylinder is and the fact the power valve is faulty. Oil fittings will be replaced and will be ran on Silkolene/Fuchs that is compatible. Have ordered a load of Tygon cheap but it is 2.4mm ID instead of the OEM 2mm so not sure if I can use this?
Suzuki still sell OEM cranks. I am very tempted, if i can sell mine for around £300 then it would cost my very little to fit a brand new one with our trade discount. Worth spending a little more to put brand new OEM in? Then replated cylinders and Pro X pistons wouldnt leave much to chance - other than me putting it together!
This will be an expensive project but the end result will be something very few bikes can get close to… perhaps don’t think of it as an investment
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