Advice on cornering please folks

[hackett]

Hi people i'm new to road biking i did motocross for 10 years and I like to think of myself as "quite experienced" when it comes to riding crossers. I've recently taken my test and have decided to go down the route of getting a sports bike for my daily commute. Now i've done about 400 miles since passing my test and every mile has been extra cautious believing that any moment someone will assassinate me with their car. This i'm sure is a good mind set to have!

Any way i've been slowly progressing on the corners trying to gradually get over further and all is going smooth so far touch wood.

My question is.....how do you guys know when your tyres are upto "cornering" temperature? I've just driven to work bearing in mind its late and quite cold i just couldn't bring myself to get the bike over at all as i'm terrified the tyres are just going to let go! I sat at a constant 70 mph for about 4 miles with minor bends/curves in the road and then stopped to actually feel the rear tyre and it still felt no where near warm enough to grab the tarmac.

Any advice greatly recieved.

Edited by hackett on Tuesday 23 September 00:58

[outlaw biker]

Sorry, you stopped to feel the tyre??? Say that again pleeeease......

[hackett]

I know i laugh at it now just keep it to yourself....at least i didn't actually write it in a post on the internet...oh wait

Hey its all experience

[outlaw biker]

We'll keep this just between you and me....you never wrote that ok! What type of cornering are we talking about here? Are you trying to scuff the titanium shoulder plates on your new Dainese leathers?

Just go with it. Relax. But don't quote me on that

[hackett]

Trust me we're not talking knee down or anything just a nice amount of lean.

Shiny leathers, me?? pffft trust me other bikers laugh at me in my Army boots jeans and bike jacket i look like a right scruffy tt but i'm enjoying it lol

Edited by hackett on Tuesday 23 September 01:11

[outlaw biker]

Well hey, the maximum speed limit in this country is 70mph and you're getting around the corners...whats the worry?

[hackett]

I live in the north of Scotland, most of the bends on my way to work if you took them at the speed limit you would be dead. It would be nice to have the confidence to lean the bike over more but like i said my main worry is tyre temperature. I'll just carry on pootling around until that screw becomes loose in my head which stops me wanting to stay alive then i'll go for it .

Right must do some work...........thanks for replies

[Motorrad]

Sounds like you're doing the right thing and riding within your limits. Also car drivers are out to kill you so best to assume so from the off.

If you feel the need to stop and fondle rubber every now and again who are we to judge?

[Rach*]

hackett said:

I live in the north of Scotland, most of the bends on my way to work if you took them at the speed limit you would be dead. It would be nice to have the confidence to lean the bike over more but like i said my main worry is tyre temperature. I'll just carry on pootling around until that screw becomes loose in my head which stops me wanting to stay alive then i'll go for it .

Right must do some work...........thanks for replies

Are you here at Lossie or Kinloss? If so I feel your pain! As a newbie up here I find it challenging on the tight twisty roads but I've been going out with people more experienced, they slow down so I can watch their lines, then follow me to watch mine. My lines/apexing have really come along. I don't feel it takes long to warm them up, just slowly increase your lean rather than trying to get it over straight away.
I take it so easy round the corners up here but getting on as a pillion with the guys who have lived here donkies and know these roads is a real eye opener! I love it

[gareth h]

The tyres are unlikely to just let go unless you do something silly or hit ice/diesel, so don't worry too much unless you are planning to scrub in your knee sliders.

[trumpet600]

hackett said:

Hi people i'm new to road biking i did motocross for 10 years and I like to think of myself as "quite experienced" when it comes to riding crossers. I've recently taken my test and have decided to go down the route of getting a sports bike for my daily commute. Now i've done about 400 miles since passing my test and every mile has been extra cautious believing that any moment someone will assassinate me with their car. This i'm sure is a good mind set to have!

Any way i've been slowly progressing on the corners trying to gradually get over further and all is going smooth so far touch wood.

My question is.....how do you guys know when your tyres are upto "cornering" temperature? I've just driven to work bearing in mind its late and quite cold i just couldn't bring myself to get the bike over at all as i'm terrified the tyres are just going to let go! I sat at a constant 70 mph for about 4 miles with minor bends/curves in the road and then stopped to actually feel the rear tyre and it still felt no where near warm enough to grab the tarmac.

Any advice greatly recieved.

Edited by hackett on Tuesday 23 September 00:58

Ask westy or fraz.

[Pierscoe1]

another noob here.. just checking in to sympathise.
It's very tricky, coming from years of car driving where you can easily push into some understeer and know where the limits are, to being paranoid of the bike just dissappearing from underneath me.... just a question of time and experience I guess.

It's motivating to see experienced riders flay past and get their knee straight down into a corner in front of you though

[mitzy]

It still find it scary going round bends sometimes, use to think , power off, power off, which I now know makes it worse!

I think its being confident in your bike too, my 125 didnt give me that much comfort, wheres the honda does.

I'm not sure if I will ever get my knee down, but thats all the fun about biking , everytime you go out you learn something new.

[Hyperion]

The tyres will keep on gripping until the bike is almost horizontal - it's the skill of the rider and the size of his nuts that matter!

[Twit]

As long as you get the speed right then you will be OK! Bike tyres give a lot of grip in normal conditions, the key thing is to be smooth and not do anything stupid mid corner. Get the bike set up before the corners, try to not to go in on a closed throttle but rather get it balanced and drive through, watch positioning and all the normal stuff. If you do that the bike will be fine and will lean whether or not the tyres are hot or cold!

In my view tyre temperature only really matters if you are truly caning it, but it gets used as an excuse for crashing!! I put it in the same catagory as crashing on diesel spills!! Yes it happens but not that often!

Just relax and let the bike do the work!

[RizzoTheRat]

Trick with a bike is get your speed right before you turn, and make sure you're in the right gear to keep some (not too much) power on through the bend. The geometry of a bike means that wheelbase changes with the pitch of the bike, so if you go from engine braking to accelleration while in a corner you'll drift all over the place as the wheelbase will get slightly longer. Bikes are much less tollerant of such things than (most) cars.

Helps to watch the vanishing point (ie where the left and right hedges meet), if it's getting closer slow down 'cos the beds getting tighter, if it's staying constant the curves staying the same so keep the throttle constant, once it's starts to run away from you the roads straightening up and you can open the throttle to chase it.

Road positioning is another big difference between cars and bikes, on a bike you've got a lot more width available to you, use it. Unlike a track, on the road you're generally limited by visability not by grip. Positioning for the best visability round a bend (ie the outside) enables you to get the power down sooner on the exit and will be quicker and safer than try to take a racing line.

Of the further training options mentioned on several similar thread, bikesafe is the cheapest (free in some regions I believe) so well worth doing.

Things like road positioning are very different between tracks and roads, but one of the big benefits of a track day, or track based training, is it will let you explore the handling of your bike in safety, which will give you a lot more confidence on the road.

Edited by RizzoTheRat on Tuesday 23 September 11:57

[black-k1]

Having confidence in your tyres and their ability to grip is something that will only come with experience. You can have as many people as you want tell you that they will grip and don’t worry, but only you will be able to silence that little voice at the back of your mind that is saying the tyres might let go. The thing is that while you are worried about the tyres letting go you will not relax which will mean that corners will not be smooth which will re-enforce that ‘their going to let go’ feeling. Vicious circle.

You need to slow down and work on taking the corners properly. Concentrate on getting your lines right, ensuring you get your braking and gear selection done before the bend and that you are powering out of the bend. Most importantly, make sure you are looking through the corners at the vanishing point. Your confidence in your tyres will increase without you having to think about it as will your speed through the corners.

[StevRS]

Another newbie here - you're not alone in worrying about the bike disappearing from under you mid-lean. I just work on the assumption that better riders than me have said they couldn't exploit the bike to it's absolute limits so I won't be anywhere near them just yet!

[RizzoTheRat]

StevRS said:

Another newbie here - you're not alone in worrying about the bike disappearing from under you mid-lean. I just work on the assumption that better riders than me have said they couldn't exploit the bike to it's absolute limits so I won't be anywhere near them just yet!

A reasonable assumption but don't rely on it. If you're a bit to snatchy with the throttle for example you could upset a bike in mid corner at a speed where it could comfortable corner if you were smoother. I've got a mate who's quicker than me in the dry but in the wet he tends to be about the same speed or slower than me, mainly because I tend to be smoother. In the dry his more ragged style (and lack of fear) is quicker (but he uses more fuel and eats tyres faster than me on the identical bike and tyres), but in the wet he starts to run out of grip before I do.