Turbo upgrade on RV8
Discussion
I got mine from here
http://www.ferriday.co.uk/?page_id=711
I think the thing to remember here is we are building a rover v8 engine not a formula 1 engine!
Yes they might not tick every box for some people but in the real world they do work when used and do allow a more desirable compression for turbo charging should you wish. Mine didn't miss a beat and the current owner has no complaints either. Used with decent ARP studs you will not get any problems with sealing.
http://www.ferriday.co.uk/?page_id=711
I think the thing to remember here is we are building a rover v8 engine not a formula 1 engine!
Yes they might not tick every box for some people but in the real world they do work when used and do allow a more desirable compression for turbo charging should you wish. Mine didn't miss a beat and the current owner has no complaints either. Used with decent ARP studs you will not get any problems with sealing.
Personally I wouldn't use decompression plates because I'd rather use squish to produce a fast burn. On a 5.0 I'd either use dished pistons (pinto) but it's not a bolt in solution. They can be machined to give a 21cc bowl iirc. The easiest option would be buick 300 heads with their 54cc chambers. I've used those on a 5.4 which had a supercharger. It had to be a low boost engine, 5 psi. On a 5.0 they would work well and allow higher boost. The downside is they're usually in need of a major refurb.
macdeb said:
Bump, anyone? 
That's not how you work it out. You start with the power you wish to have, then determine the airflow required and then look for suitable turbo/s.With an 8:1 c/r I'd use 7-10 psi. As for the camshaft, any street cam will work. My take is that boost tends to amplify the cams inherent characteristics.
Wonder if any of the turbo kits available could show us Compressor maps for the turbos??
Theres alot more to picking a turbo than just a particular turbine size, you need to make sure it can reach your goal and still be in its efficency range.
Think of your desired BHP first and work from there. Im gussing if you only want around 400-450bhp thats not a lot of turbo at all think bigger Mac
Theres alot more to picking a turbo than just a particular turbine size, you need to make sure it can reach your goal and still be in its efficency range.
Think of your desired BHP first and work from there. Im gussing if you only want around 400-450bhp thats not a lot of turbo at all think bigger Mac
Topping 400 would be fine, but anymore than 450 is going to require a load more other stuff as I see it. I'm having the 5th gear mod done to the gearbox and have an upgraded clutch, have MS so mapping should be sorted, also if I use the low comp' forged jobbies I have. Reckon the standard 4.6 is a bang on candidate at a 'true' 8.9:1 and probably how they seem to work so well, but mines a true 9.5:1 with my heads having been skimmed originally and now an additional refacing that was needed I really don't fancy running that at boost if I'm honest.
Alot more turbo information would be great as Neal says, and why I'm 'sort' of thinking around the AR of 0.86 is because whatever information I've gained thus far indicates a sort of drive I'd like ie; not too much lag and not dropping off a cliff higher up. It's working backwards I know but I'm still trying to understand the actual physice more than just bolting anything on.
Alot more turbo information would be great as Neal says, and why I'm 'sort' of thinking around the AR of 0.86 is because whatever information I've gained thus far indicates a sort of drive I'd like ie; not too much lag and not dropping off a cliff higher up. It's working backwards I know but I'm still trying to understand the actual physice more than just bolting anything on.
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 11:57
Just another perspective....
Mine is a crossbolted 4.6 with 4.0 pistons. My block was decked a little when i had the tophats fitted. I have 500 heads that i removed the bump in the chambers and run standard elring gaskets. The engine was built with ARP head studs and main bolts. With a Typhoon cam produces near to 330 bhp at 6000 rpm.
So i think my CR must be up there near to 10:1 if not higher.
I inject over 200 bhp of nitrous oxide at the dragstrip and the only safe guard is 6 degrees taken out of the ignition map when the second MS map is activated by the nitrous system.
Ive ran this set up dozens of times and my heads are still on the block, the gaskets are holding and the grade 7 plugs are fine.
Just saying i think these engines are a lot hardier than we sometimes give credit. Get the mapping right and IMHO i think you can run a large variation of boost, CRs etc and get away without disaster. Just fine tuning and tweaking to improve later. IMHO
Mine is a crossbolted 4.6 with 4.0 pistons. My block was decked a little when i had the tophats fitted. I have 500 heads that i removed the bump in the chambers and run standard elring gaskets. The engine was built with ARP head studs and main bolts. With a Typhoon cam produces near to 330 bhp at 6000 rpm.
So i think my CR must be up there near to 10:1 if not higher.
I inject over 200 bhp of nitrous oxide at the dragstrip and the only safe guard is 6 degrees taken out of the ignition map when the second MS map is activated by the nitrous system.
Ive ran this set up dozens of times and my heads are still on the block, the gaskets are holding and the grade 7 plugs are fine.
Just saying i think these engines are a lot hardier than we sometimes give credit. Get the mapping right and IMHO i think you can run a large variation of boost, CRs etc and get away without disaster. Just fine tuning and tweaking to improve later. IMHO
ChilliWhizz said:
Hmm, I'm a bit worried about you now Mac.....
YOU'RE WORRIED? I'm worried about you worrying!PS; I've just ordered one of Eanns kits!
So, gonna de-burr the block this weekend prior to being acid dipped
Whole rotating assembly to be balanced [pistons/rods/crank/pulleys/flywheel etc]
Flywheel being lightened prior to balance.
Using the Forged pistons with ceramic coated crowns giving CR 8.2:1 after all said and done.
[Allready have ARP studs, flowed and ported BV heads, enlarged/ported and matched inlet manifold, thermal gasket, enlarged throttle plenum, flared 45mm trumpets etc, etc], Cometic MSL head gaskets. Not as 'out there' as some builds going on but hoping for some reliable extra grunt. [if I ever get round to driving the thing]
I thought, if I don't do it now, I never will. Now that's a worry.
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:25
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:26
macdeb said:
YOU'RE WORRIED? I'm worried about you worrying!
PS; I've just ordered one of Eanns kits!
So, gonna de-burr the block this weekend prior to being acid dipped
Whole rotating assembly to be balanced [pistons/rods/crank/pulleys/flywheel etc]
Flywheel being lightened prior to balance.
Using the Forged pistons with ceramic coated crowns giving CR 8.2:1 after all said and done.
[Allready have ARP studs, flowed and ported BV heads, enlarged/ported and matched inlet manifold, thermal gasket, enlarged throttle plenum, flared 45mm trumpets etc, etc], Cometic MSL head gaskets. Not as 'out there' as some builds going on but hoping for some reliable extra grunt. [if I ever get round to driving the thing]
I thought, if I don't do it now, I never will. Now that's a worry.
PS; I've just ordered one of Eanns kits!
So, gonna de-burr the block this weekend prior to being acid dipped
Whole rotating assembly to be balanced [pistons/rods/crank/pulleys/flywheel etc]
Flywheel being lightened prior to balance.
Using the Forged pistons with ceramic coated crowns giving CR 8.2:1 after all said and done.
[Allready have ARP studs, flowed and ported BV heads, enlarged/ported and matched inlet manifold, thermal gasket, enlarged throttle plenum, flared 45mm trumpets etc, etc], Cometic MSL head gaskets. Not as 'out there' as some builds going on but hoping for some reliable extra grunt. [if I ever get round to driving the thing]
I thought, if I don't do it now, I never will. Now that's a worry.
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:25
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:26
Onwards and upwards Mac. Dont forget those pistons will benefit from total seal rings
Interested to know what turbo Eann has recommended. I foresee a huge torque curve and massive grin on your face.
Still wont beat me at the strip tho
macdeb said:
YOU'RE WORRIED? I'm worried about you worrying!
PS; I've just ordered one of Eanns kits!
So, gonna de-burr the block this weekend prior to being acid dipped
Whole rotating assembly to be balanced [pistons/rods/crank/pulleys/flywheel etc]
Flywheel being lightened prior to balance.
Using the Forged pistons with ceramic coated crowns giving CR 8.2:1 after all said and done.
[Allready have ARP studs, flowed and ported BV heads, enlarged/ported and matched inlet manifold, thermal gasket, enlarged throttle plenum, flared 45mm trumpets etc, etc], Cometic MSL head gaskets. Not as 'out there' as some builds going on but hoping for some reliable extra grunt. [if I ever get round to driving the thing]
I thought, if I don't do it now, I never will. Now that's a worry.
Mac that motor spec will be the bPS; I've just ordered one of Eanns kits!
So, gonna de-burr the block this weekend prior to being acid dipped
Whole rotating assembly to be balanced [pistons/rods/crank/pulleys/flywheel etc]
Flywheel being lightened prior to balance.
Using the Forged pistons with ceramic coated crowns giving CR 8.2:1 after all said and done.
[Allready have ARP studs, flowed and ported BV heads, enlarged/ported and matched inlet manifold, thermal gasket, enlarged throttle plenum, flared 45mm trumpets etc, etc], Cometic MSL head gaskets. Not as 'out there' as some builds going on but hoping for some reliable extra grunt. [if I ever get round to driving the thing]
I thought, if I don't do it now, I never will. Now that's a worry.
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:25
Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 12th February 16:26
ks with a Turbo 
QBee said:
ZoDDy said:
But what do you want to know? All turbo conversions are simply great if they are done with some common sense.
Smooth engine character. Lot´s of torque and power and reliable, The turbos won´t boost when driving normally so the
fuel bill will be ok too. The downside is the plumbing when you choose twinturbos, and you will need to fight some underhood temperature
If going twins you will have serveral options at the scrapyard.. Pick the turbo(s) like i did, My 4.6 split in half will be around 2.3 liter like most 4 cylinder turbo cars.. buy two identic ones in good condition and then you have a god start.
My choice is the Mitsubishi.. available, very efficient and no lag. You will find Mitsu TD04 on Volvos and some Saabs.
The Saab TD04HL-15T turbo in twin config is good for 450-500 aggressive horses without pushing them to the limit. (if the engine can flow that amount of air)
I have done some reading about my turbos and the Saab ppl pushing the TD04 charger to almost 300 hp at the wheels on a Saab!
There were 5 Saab Turbos on an airfield TD I did in 2012. They had come down from Scotland IIRC. None were less than 450 bhp. I can probably track down some contact details if you are interested. They were insanely quick for a nearly 2 tonne car.Smooth engine character. Lot´s of torque and power and reliable, The turbos won´t boost when driving normally so the
fuel bill will be ok too. The downside is the plumbing when you choose twinturbos, and you will need to fight some underhood temperature
If going twins you will have serveral options at the scrapyard.. Pick the turbo(s) like i did, My 4.6 split in half will be around 2.3 liter like most 4 cylinder turbo cars.. buy two identic ones in good condition and then you have a god start.
My choice is the Mitsubishi.. available, very efficient and no lag. You will find Mitsu TD04 on Volvos and some Saabs.
The Saab TD04HL-15T turbo in twin config is good for 450-500 aggressive horses without pushing them to the limit. (if the engine can flow that amount of air)
I have done some reading about my turbos and the Saab ppl pushing the TD04 charger to almost 300 hp at the wheels on a Saab!
That sounds interesting. I know that the Saab racers mod the TD04 turbos, the first thing they swap seems to be the exhaustside to a bigger one. When tuning with the No:5 standard exhaust side there will be lot´s of backpressure so the limit is around 300-320 hp:s when the hardware is standard.
I will keep my turbos more or less original coz i really like the punch and the reliability, i have not pushed my car to the limit yet and i quess i will bump into the wall sooner or later but it´s a budget build and i´m not very interested to spend huge money just to cut a few seconds on the strip.
But tuningtips is always welcome when there is some hidden potential to "unlock"
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