LED Headlights

[ChimpOnGas]

purpleliability said:

Also, any thoughts on how to seal up the reflector to reduce the impact of dust and grime?

As horrible as it is, its really only practical to follow TVR's Sikaflex efforts for the lens sealing, but actually I don't believe that's the problem end.

Obviously if the Sikaflex fails at the front, the reflector won't even last one winter so it is important, but if look at the back there is a 1cm gap all around the edge between the reflector and mounting ring glassed into the body.

This is where moisture and dirt enters, especially if the headlight inspection panels aren't sealed well as they are constantly bombarded by spray from the front tyres. How you close that 1cm gap between the reflector and mounting ring is going to be a challenge as that's where the adjustment takes place.

I had considered lacquering the bowls but that scares me now; the silvering will need de-greasing first and the finish is so delicate it may not even take the prep let alone the clear coat finish. To be honest I can see the silvering pickling up which would be heartbreaking.

I don't have an answer to the reflector tarnishing problem, if anyone has any ideas do feel free to suggest them here.

Edited by ChimpOnGas on Saturday 1st November 15:05

[ChimpOnGas]

Dr Mike Oxgreen said:

It doesn't last, though. I had my reflectors replaced about 2 years ago, and they're dotted with little bits of corrosion already.

Also, I suspect Chimpy is talking about light levels a country mile greater than anything the best conventional bulbs can produce.

Indeed, the LED units I'm testing are frighteningly powerful, they are and a league of their own and that's with my current reflectors that are also just a few years old but already showing signs of corrosion.

I have a new set of reflectors I'll be fitting soon, at the moment I'm experimenting with 2k clear coats to see if I can seal them against the inevitable rapid corrosion problem.

Three things I can say so far after two weeks of testing:

1. Even with marginal reflectors the units have taken my headlights on Philips Xtremes from adequate to astonishingly good on dip beam

2. Their brightness will instantly reveal any need for adjustment, its essential you adjust your lights fter fitting

3. The jury is still out on the full beam performance, I'm still testing that one

With my new reflectors I can only see these lights getting even brighter & sharper, which if I'm honest scares me a bit given what I've already witnessed with my slightly dull reflectors.

Watch this space

[ChimpOnGas]

Right, my new reflectors are ready to fit but before we get into that here's a little reminder of what happens to them after just a few years of regular use.



To give you a more accurate idea of how long these reflectors last I'll be taking some snaps of mine when I remove the lenses, they were brand new just four years ago and while not quite as bad as the one above they aren't far off.

Here's the process I adopted in the hope I can make my next set last a bit longer:

1. Intensive three step degrease using U-Pol System 20 panel prep
2. Three coats of HB Body HS-496 2k clear coat (1 day between each coat followed by a five day cure)
3. Step one polish clear coat - using Novus 2
4. Step two polish clear coat using - Mer Ultimate Shine Polish
5. Seal using two coats of Prima Epic synthetic wax (apply, leave 2 hours for polymer bond, buff off, x 2 applications on each reflector)

The end result has come out rather well, the HS-496 2k lacquer is pretty much bullet proof if the prep has been done properly and you allow it to cure for a full 5 days before polishing it with very light compounds.

In my experience the Prima Epic synthetic wax is also extremely long lasting if you let it go off for a couple of hours before buffing the haze to a shine, on each reflector I applied two coats of Epic over the 2k clear coat to give an additional layer of protection.



I've also gone for 40mm circular mirrors bonded to the inner faces of the bulb hoods to help throw the light back into the reflector bowls, I'll be experimenting with hood & without to see which suits the super bright LED H4s best.



I'll update my post when I get some time to fit the new reflectors and get the car on a proper beam setter, for the time being I've crudely lowered the beams a touch in respect of other road users and I've not had a single flash since.

So far, so good

[ChimpOnGas]

blitzracing said:

Looks like Ebay in the UK is catching up now:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PAIR-Of-Car-Super-Bright...

Probably someone that read my post

This is neither a race or a commercial enterprise for me, more a bit of hobby fun so good luck to the vendor.

If you are`thinking of buying these EBay ones just be aware they are the old lesser 2200 lumen version, and very recently superseded by my latest spec 3200 lumen jobbies.

The additional 1000 lumens is roughly equal to the output of a standard H4 incandescent bulb, while the 2200 lumen version will be twice as bright as a standard H4 bulb my ones will be more or less like adding another set of headlights on top of that.

I want to give everyone a proper honest appraisal of these LED units, which is why I'm making sure I'm fitting new reflectors and once installed taking care to set the beams up properly.

Right now all I can say is on dip beam with old tarnished reflectors they are already a massive step up on the excellent Philips Xtreme H4s, the only potential elephant in the room could be their main beam performance.

Lets see what happens when my new two pack clear coated reflectors go in and the headlights are properly adjusted.

[ChimpOnGas]

jamienshelly said:

I wonder what they will be like in the Lupo's ?

I expect they'll work really well, possibly even better than they do in the standard smooth reflector and engraved lens set up.

Try them and update the results here.

[ChimpOnGas]

CHIMV8 said:

SILICONEKID345HP said:

CHIMV8 said:

Nothing wrong with the originals, if you get the reflector/shields recoated, and put higher strength lamps in...not the best pic i must admit LOL

Which higher strength bulbs ?

I'll find out off the guy who did the work,made a huge differance,not as strong as Daves LED version, but depends what you want from originallity wise mods

I remain very impressed with my Philips Xtreme bulbs, certainly a massive step up from standard H4s without the risks associated with high wattage bulbs.

I believe new or re-silvered reflectors are the answer, combined with a set of Philips Xtremes the standard headlights should prove more than adequate, sadly the reflectors don't last 10 minutes unless you can find a way of stopping the rapid corrosion which is why I've gone to great lengths to clear coat mine in an attempt to extend their life.

What the effect of new reflectors with these crazy bright LEDs will be is anyone's guess, perhaps I'll just find them overkill?

But the big one for me is their main beam performance that so far seems like it might just be inferior to a set of the excellent Philips Xtremes.

But I do need to fit my new reflectors and adjust them on a proper beam setter to be sure.

[ChimpOnGas]

Do you boys want to start a separate post on how to wire up high wattage incandescent bulbs?

[ChimpOnGas]

Adrian@ said:

ChimpOnGas said:

Do you boys want to start a separate post on how to wire up high wattage incandescent bulbs?

DOH...Your LED's don't require any uprated power supply and thing won't be affected by heat...that was a thought when 2k lacquering the reflectors

Exactly my point, a new post is normally the best way to go completely off topic

Lets keep this one about the LED headlights shall we, after all the topic is titled "LED Headlights"

[ChimpOnGas]

SILICONEKID345HP said:

ChimpOnGas said:

Exactly my point, a new post is normally the best way to go completely off topic

Lets keep this one about the LED headlights shall we, after all the topic is titled "LED Headlights"

SILICONEKID345HP said:

The wiring to the lights is not to off topic .. Its part of the installation and worth doing.

Not really Sink Plunger

SILICONEKID345HP said:

Any news with the LED`s

Yes, "They don't require a wiring upgrade"

[ChimpOnGas]

ChimpOnGas said:

SILICONEKID345HP said:

ChimpOnGas said:

Exactly my point, a new post is normally the best way to go completely off topic

Lets keep this one about the LED headlights shall we, after all the topic is titled "LED Headlights"

SILICONEKID345HP said:

The wiring to the lights is not to off topic .. Its part of the installation and worth doing.

Not really Sink Plunger

SILICONEKID345HP said:

Any news with the LED`s

Yes, "They don't require a wiring upgrade"

If you want to fit higher wattage bulbs you will need to upgrade your wiring.

If you want to fit these these LED bulb replacement units (which is what this post is all about).... YOU DON'T!!!

IT'S ONE OF THE KEY ADVANTAGES OF GOING LED!!!

So start a new topic, I recommend titling it "High Wattage Headlight Bulbs - How to Upgrade Your Wiring".

I understand people are interested in the results from these LED units, but I can only update this post as I progress with the project, please be patient.

If you want to discuss a different project like fitting higher wattage incandescent bulbs please start a new post.

[ChimpOnGas]

OutlawFlat4 said:

Dave, are you having the new reflectors drilled to the correct beam pattern or leaving them as they are?

J

Yes J, all drilled using a special step drill to avoid picking up and tearing the silvering, an original TVR reflector was used as a jig to ensure the holes were drilled in exactly the right places. Both reflectors were then thoroughly degreased and 2k clear coated for complete protection, especially important in the freshly drilled areas.

They've been sat in the box ready to fit for a couple of weeks now, I've just been too busy of late to get in the garage.

However I do continue to use the car both during the day & at night, I did do some crude adjustment so no more flashing but they really need the new reflectors fitting then setting up on my mate's beam setter before I can give you all a further update.

Definitely a case of.... so far - so good.

Dave.

[ChimpOnGas]

OutlawFlat4 said:

ChimpOnGas said:

Yes J, all drilled using a special step drill to avoid picking up and tearing the silvering, an original TVR reflector was used as a jig to ensure the holes were drilled in exactly the right places. Both reflectors were then thoroughly degreased and 2k clear coated for complete protection, especially important in the freshly drilled areas.

They've been sat in the box ready to fit for a couple of weeks now, I've just been too busy of late to get in the garage.

However I do continue to use the car both during the day & at night, I did do some crude adjustment so no more flashing but they really need the new reflectors fitting then setting up on my mate's beam setter before I can give you all a further update.

Definitely a case of.... so far - so good.

Dave.

I just bought a set off Russ, but wouldn't know how to go about drilling etc. If you fancy doing another set for some beer or actual money, please let me know J

Hi J,

Mine came from Russ too, TBH you probably should have asked him to drill yours before he sent them out but it is a risky business so I'm not sure he openly offers this service.

Russ has the original TVR reflector I mentioned above and that special stepped drill bit which I believe is key to a successful job. Russ is a mate of mine and lives locally to me, we discussed the pros & cons of drilling at length before committing to it. With everything considered I decided drilling was the right way to go, so gave Russ the all clear to tackle the delicate job in the understanding it was at my risk.

The concern is when you drill the reflector you're inevitably introducing a point of failure in the silvering which as we know is already very susceptible to early failure. As it turns out Russ made an excellent job of the drilling, that stepped drill bit left zero visible damage to the silvering and the holes ended up super neat and looking totally factory.

I'm under no illusion we have still broken the silvering so have introduced a few points of failure, which is another reason why I then went to great lengths to clear coat the reflectors.

I'm no professional automotive painter and I've certainly never clear coated chrome or silvering before so the process was to a large degree another leap of faith, even after careful degreasing the first coat or two looked truly awful. Its not like you can key the reflector surface, proper adhesion of the clear coat to the silvering initially appeared to be presenting a real issue.

At this stage I was pretty sure I'd wrecked the reflectors, but as there was nothing to be lost by pressing on I started to lay on more coats of lacquer and heavier ones at that. The first of these heavy coats came out milky looking so by this point I was ready to chuck my expensive reflectors in the bin.

But as the clear coat died the clarity came back, it was quite hypnotic to watch and started to give me real hope the process would work. As each additional coat went on the finish got better & better, the additional layers of clear coat started to pull out the sags and patchy adhesion effect. In the end I probably finished up hitting the reflectors with six or seven coats, each one delivering a better & better finish as I went.

The end result was excellent, I properly surprised myself with how good it was which was definitely more to do with the careful decreasing process and quality of clear coat than my skill as a painter. The secret seemed to be to leave it a day between lacquering sessions, up to 24 hours the next coats reacted with the ones laid down the previous day to pull out any inconsistencies and create a uniform and invisible clear coated finish.

After three days of this process I was totally satisfied, so I left the reflectors on top of my central heading boiler for a full week, when I checked them a week later the 2k clear coat had gone off as hard as nails so I polished and waxed them for the finishing touch.

I'm absolutely delighted with the end result but only time will tell if they last longer than an uncoated reflector, I'd be very surprised if they dont but who knows that clear coat could flake, crack, peel or even turn yellow over time so we'll have to see.

What I can say is I have used the HB Body HS-496 2k clear coat before, and although its in an aerosol it is a professional body shop quality product. In the past I've found the durability of HS-496 finish is beyond question but that's over a base paint, so I'm really hoping it'll perform equally well on the silvered reflectors???

As I say... only time will tell.

[ChimpOnGas]

OutlawFlat4 said:

I think you are close to me, i'm near Beaconsfield.

Yep, I'm Rickmansworth.

I will let you know once I've fitted the reflectors, if you'd like to see them with the LEDs your welcome to pop over, or meet up for an expensive refreshment at the Crazy Bear

[ChimpOnGas]

OutlawFlat4 said:

Dave, Im actually picking up the reflectors from Russ on Sat and he is going to drill them for me, so if you are about it would be good to see them working in the car.

J

Sorry J, I'm out of town for the weekend.

Another time. D.

[ChimpOnGas]

So I still haven't fitted my new reflectors yet

But a few weeks ago I did make some crude adjustments, which has been followed by hundreds of nighttime miles without a single flash.

Yesterday I popped into see my MoT tester for a chat, we discussed the lights and looked at the comments on here.

In his words not mine "all you nanny state wingers are a bunch of ghays"

Bit of a straight talker old school hot rodder my tester, and to be honest wouldn't know what "politically correct" was if it jumped up and bit him on the arsh

We had a mug of tea, discussed the various merits and demerits of positive displacement superchargers vs centrifugal, then looked at the new induction kit on his blown F150 pickup.

I don't think I'll have any issues with my ticket in the spring

[ChimpOnGas]

adam quantrill said:

What's the bit about "drilling the reflectors" to adjust the beam pattern - do you have any pics to explain what was drilled?

The original reflectors used by TVR were off a truck, the only ones available now are off a Porsche.

The holes for the mountings on the Porsche ones are in a slightly different place, essentially you have two options:

1: Use the new mounting holes and adjust to compensate

2: Re-drill the reflector in the correct spot

Option 1 isn't ideal, option 2 is better but you're going to be breaking through the silvering which is also less than ideal.

I went with option 2 followed by a number of protective coats of 2K clear coat.

[ChimpOnGas]

So as it turned out drilling a couple of holes in the rim of the Porsche reflectors was neither difficult or a significant issue for the silvering.

The post liked by SiliconeFlyd discusses a nasty hacked up reflector solution or the suggestion a reflector off EBay could be made to fit.

Neither of these are genuine options for someone looking to make a proper job of replacing the corrosion prone original reflectors while retaining the original look.

I looked at all this back to front and concluded the best option was drilling the almost identical Porche reflectors and 2k clear coating them to dramatically extend their life.

At the end of the day we're only talking about drilling two holes in the outer rim of the reflectors and about £20 in clear coat.

The whole project came in under £150 which is significantly cheaper than fitting Lupo headlights which are not to everyone's taste.

Actually there are other options, and ironically they come from the Porche world where the market value of a classic 911 can be anything from £45k to £250k so I doubt their owners will baulk at the £800 a pair being asked for these new light sets.

And to me they still look wrong anyway, have a look at the Singer Porsche website and you'll see what I mean.

I think I've done it the best way, way better headlights that should last well while retaining the original look, and all at a reasonable cost.

Merry Christmas to you all, Dave.

[ChimpOnGas]

adam quantrill said:

Ahh right, gotcha. Luckily us Wedgers have two advantages:

1. The Cibie reflectors are still available
2. Even if they weren't, when the lights are off they pop down (well usually) so the original look won't be spoiled.

I have been looking at another bulb off the same supplier site which is

http://www.dx.com/p/honsco-h4-24w-1800lm-5000k-l-h...

Which is more like the original H4 light levels and also less "blue". Any opinions of this one? Plus it's cheaper too ;^)

But Adam, the Wedge cars are either winking or suffer no headlight pop up at all

[ChimpOnGas]

Performing very well thanks, they just needed a small adjustment to eliminate the occasional flash from oncoming drivers.

I'm still on my marginal reflectors so I can only imagine how good they'll be once my new reflectors go in.

Hopefully the silvering will last a reasonable amount of time now I've 2k clear coated them?

[ChimpOnGas]

Right chaps these LED H4 bulbs are performing very well indeed, a small adjustment has made sure I'm not getting the occasional flash from oncoming drivers and I can only describe their performance on dip beam as game changing.

While the dip beams are beyond criticism the main beams are currently slightly disappointing in comparison, that's not to say they're not an improvement (they are), it's just the improvement over standard halogen incandescent bulbs isn't as big a margin on main beam as it is on dip.

However, this could easily be down to the fact my reflectors aren't in their first flush of youth, I have a new set ready to go in but it just too cold out there to start messing about with headlight right now.

As I pointed out at the very beginning of this post LED technology is currently very fast moving, my 3200 lumen H4 LED bulbs were at the cutting edge just a few months ago but the fact is they've already been relegated to yesterdays best.

Check out these bad boys at 6000 lumens per bulb for just £40 a set!!!

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2015-New-40W-6000LM...

Fek me, these things must be like looking at the sun!