I really need to sort the hot start snag out......garages SW

[silverback mike]

Hello folks. I really need to get my hot (lack) of start issues out. I've previously tried the kit, an auto electrician also had a look and apparently my wiring is completely different to others he has worked on. so....I guess I need someone that knows their way around. I've fitted it with a hi torque starter motor which helps generally however it's come to a point I just need it to be sorted!!!
I know Elberton garage has a thumbs up but is this for mechanicals stuff. Is Neil Garner a decent place for electrical work? The other place is webbs auto's in Nailsea but I have a little reticence.
Help gratefully received!
Mike

[TV8]

is the car an early Chim with the door release in the same area as the gearstick/handbrake? If so, they dont have the same alarm wiring as the later ones. You need to wire a relay to the ignition switch and starter motor but I got away with changing the ignition switch behind the key. Surprisingly easy thing to do, even for me!

[QBee]

Two possible causes of your ongoing problem:

1. Inadequate or worn out wiring from the battery to the starter motor - it degrades over time and with the heat of the engine and gearbox, over which it passes. Rep[lace the cable and hey presto, problem solved
2. Wrongly wired, and now knackered, immobiliser. TVR wired the ruddy thing wrongly in the first place, and once you get to your stage of the hot start problem, it frankly means you need tom replace the immobiliser.

For 1, yes, Neil Garner comes with a lot of good reports.
For 2, Carl Baker (www.tvruk.tv) is your man, though others can do a similar job. He replaces the immobiliser, or the entire system, with one he has developed with Meta, and you never have the problem again. He used to be south of Guildford, but these days he resides in south west france. Your choice is either to stay in his gite in SW France, or meet up with him at TaylorTVR in Kent on one of his regular visits to the UK.

He changed mine two/three years ago, it wasn't cheap (circa £600), but it was a full day's work and I have never had any alarm or immobiliser issues since. And he gives you two keys both with a separate boot plipper on, and makes the start up delay 60 seconds, not 15.

If you decide to use someone else, you need someone who knows TVR alarm systems.

[ClassiChimi]

Or speak to Chimpongas as he has a wiring mod, show that to a decent car sparky and they should be able to addapt it fairly easy. I'd defo replace the live starter cable for a heavier gauge as part of a general increase in performance of the circuit too. Dom at Powers can sort this too so if you can get to the midlands he's always a reliable choice with these things, give him a call. It's a combination of small issues combining.

[silverback mike]

Thanks for the replies chaps. The problem I have is that I did have the modwise kit, and have a good auto electrician look at it. He fitted the hi torque starter, took the dash apart. (He's done previous work on TVR's too). And according to him the wiring was completely wrong and different to any instruction on the kit. He removed the standard alarm as it was malfunctioning, fitted a large red engine/electrics immobilising key and binned the immobiliser completely, but also fitted a central locking set up.

Which, sadly left me with a car that starts beautifully when cold (if on trickle charge), centrally locks ok, but is immobilised with a hoofing great rally style cut off switch/key
But, doesn't start when hot...

So I guess I would like to just take it somewhere and say "Please fix it" and be safe in the knowledge they will do a decent job.

Neil Garner looks a good start I reckon.

Thanks for the input though chaps!!!

[silverback mike]

TV8 said:

is the car an early Chim with the door release in the same area as the gearstick/handbrake? If so, they dont have the same alarm wiring as the later ones. You need to wire a relay to the ignition switch and starter motor but I got away with changing the ignition switch behind the key. Surprisingly easy thing to do, even for me!

Indeed, it's a 1994 boggo 4.0

[WinstonWolf]

silverback mike said:

Thanks for the replies chaps. The problem I have is that I did have the modwise kit, and have a good auto electrician look at it. He fitted the hi torque starter, took the dash apart. (He's done previous work on TVR's too). And according to him the wiring was completely wrong and different to any instruction on the kit. He removed the standard alarm as it was malfunctioning, fitted a large red engine/electrics immobilising key and binned the immobiliser completely, but also fitted a central locking set up.

Which, sadly left me with a car that starts beautifully when cold (if on trickle charge), centrally locks ok, but is immobilised with a hoofing great rally style cut off switch/key
But, doesn't start when hot...

So I guess I would like to just take it somewhere and say "Please fix it" and be safe in the knowledge they will do a decent job.

Neil Garner looks a good start I reckon.

Thanks for the input though chaps!!!

Doesn't sound like he removed the immobiliser, sounds like he altered how it's triggered. Is there a box with M36T on a red label behind the radio?

[TV8]

silverback mike said:

Indeed, it's a 1994 boggo 4.0

I had a mod-wise set- up to fit and the wiring is like a different car on the early ones.

The terminals on the ignition switch were worn and I could have changed the starter wiring, relays and all that but the last switch lasted for years, so didn't bother. Switch was a few £ and super easy to change. I tried to modify it to allow for the non-ignition power on for the radio but that didn't work for me.

[silverback mike]

WinstonWolf said:

silverback mike said:

Thanks for the replies chaps. The problem I have is that I did have the modwise kit, and have a good auto electrician look at it. He fitted the hi torque starter, took the dash apart. (He's done previous work on TVR's too). And according to him the wiring was completely wrong and different to any instruction on the kit. He removed the standard alarm as it was malfunctioning, fitted a large red engine/electrics immobilising key and binned the immobiliser completely, but also fitted a central locking set up.

Which, sadly left me with a car that starts beautifully when cold (if on trickle charge), centrally locks ok, but is immobilised with a hoofing great rally style cut off switch/key
But, doesn't start when hot...

So I guess I would like to just take it somewhere and say "Please fix it" and be safe in the knowledge they will do a decent job.

Neil Garner looks a good start I reckon.

Thanks for the input though chaps!!!

Doesn't sound like he removed the immobiliser, sounds like he altered how it's triggered. Is there a box with M36T on a red label behind the radio?

Nope....All gone. It doesn't have any electronic immobiliser now....

[silverback mike]

TV8 said:

silverback mike said:

Indeed, it's a 1994 boggo 4.0

I had a mod-wise set- up to fit and the wiring is like a different car on the early ones.

The terminals on the ignition switch were worn and I could have changed the starter wiring, relays and all that but the last switch lasted for years, so didn't bother. Switch was a few £ and super easy to change. I tried to modify it to allow for the non-ignition power on for the radio but that didn't work for me.

Hmm maybe a plan. A new ignition switch, but how would that change a hot start? (Sorry for my lack of knkwledge) it starts perfectly when cold and also a hot re start after a couple of munutes ....

[Bluebottle]

Had the same issues went through modwsie kit and hi-torque starters etc with no effect. the problem is not the power to the starter (main) its the power to the solanoid from the ignition (in my case).
TVR wiring runs thru the ignition straight to the starter solenoid with tvr usual inferior wire.
I can't remember where, but there is a mod to use the ignition wiring to control a relay and run a heavier duty cable to the starter solanoid.

[AV8]

I had the issue a while back and sorted it with a couple of lengths of wire and a relay. It is perfect now.

Here's the thread I started at the time.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

[mk1fan]

If the electronics have been sorted then it sounds like a connection issue. Check the size of the main feed cable and earth connections to the starter. TVR fitted 16mm2 cable to my S and my T cars. I doubt they did any different to the Grief or Chimp.

The earth connections aren't well thought out either.

Simple thing to check and eliminate. Upgrading the feed and earth cables aren't going to be detrimental to further works.

[nawarne]

silverback mike said:

TV8 said:

silverback mike said:

Indeed, it's a 1994 boggo 4.0

I had a mod-wise set- up to fit and the wiring is like a different car on the early ones.

The terminals on the ignition switch were worn and I could have changed the starter wiring, relays and all that but the last switch lasted for years, so didn't bother. Switch was a few £ and super easy to change. I tried to modify it to allow for the non-ignition power on for the radio but that didn't work for me.

Hmm maybe a plan. A new ignition switch, but how would that change a hot start? (Sorry for my lack of knkwledge) it starts perfectly when cold and also a hot re start after a couple of munutes ....

^^I'd agree - can't see how a change of ignition switch will address the problem....Maybe clean up spade (male) terminals and 'nip' the female terminal to make better contact...that should be fine....Car starts from cold and after a cool down, starts from hot (or fairly hot!)

I'd agree with renewing heavy gauge cable to starter. (And you advise starter is fairly new...many folks overlook this bit of kit....its in a hot dirty environment and deserves some love from time to time!!)

I'd agree with wiring in a better relay ex ignition switch to the starter solenoid and consider using heavier gauge wire for this circuit.

Your "hoofing great rally-type switch" is just that - a switch. It does not effectively immobilise your car. I expect anyone with snipe nose pliers could turn it 'on'. You may not be covered for theft or loss from your car with this arrangement??

I'd call Dave at HF Solutions www.hf-solutions.co.uk who should be able to advise. He has taken on the TVR alarm business for day to day stuff. Very helpful bloke, is based in Northampton but I believe travels to TVR service premises.

Nick

[silverback mike]

Lovely job folks many thanks for your really helpful comments. All taken on board and inwardly digested!!!

[QBee]

I had my battery moved to the boot last year, and the car starts a whole lot better now, even though the cable is longer, since the geezer doing the work put in a heavier gauge, new cable direct to the starter motor from the battery.

Do you have some heavy duty jump leads?
If you do, research where the cable from battery to starter presently connects.

Then next time it won't start when hot, take the red jump lead directly from the battery to the starter and see if it will start. If it does, that's your problem identified.

As I am sure you remember from school Fizziks, heat in a cable causes resistance and thus drains the power over its length, and the bigger the cable the better it conducts.
Knowing these two facts, TVR wired a cheap, crappy, and rather long cable from battery to starter, and over the years, 20+ in the case of your car, this cable has suffered too much heat for too long, as it passes over the gear box and so gets really hot regularly. It will be nasty and crispy now, and not fit for purpose.

[silverback mike]

Makes absolute sense there.. good old TVR 😂

[pwd95]

Just give it to Carl Baker. He's done 2 of mine now. New Meta Alarm System, Hot Start cure & remote boot release all in one day, fit & forget.

[silverback mike]

Hello Wyn....where abouts is Carl boyo?

[roseytvr]

When you say it won't start when hot are we talking "hot start issue" ie is the car turning over ok and not firing or is it failing to turnover fast enough? If the immobiliser has been removed then obviously it ain't the dodgy relay!