Charles Morgan
Discussion
No, John Clark took over Stratstone Jaguar. As I understand it he didn't want the Morgan side. Some of the cars went to RPM in Perth and I believe one or two may have gone to Thomson & Potter in Burrelton, which is now part of the John Clark Skoda franchise. Thomson & Potter
were Morgan dealers previously.
were Morgan dealers previously.
andyps said:
Who are the shareholders/management that would be able to oust him?
All holders of Morgan shares are his family or the Family Trust. But there is no single person that has a majority of shares (including the Trust for which Charles Morgan was NOT appointed a Trustee by his father). So his ouster would require a coalition of everyone else, young and old. He was the first to form and lead such coalitions in the past, to wrest control from his Dad over the Aero development in the late 1990s and to oust the last Chairman, Alan Garnett, in 2006. However, in this case, it seems apparent that his co-managers and the staff supported the ouster.
I guess you could muse that what goes around, comes around.
Edited by StraightShooter on Thursday 17th October 00:39
Alex said:
Have you ever heard such vague, corporate, PR-speak bulls
t? These people do not understand Morgan customers. In an effort to make the cars more modern/reliable/better-made, they will obliterate every thing we love about Morgan cars.
It reads like quite a sensible statement. There's no evidence there that they've lost the plot.t? These people do not understand Morgan customers. In an effort to make the cars more modern/reliable/better-made, they will obliterate every thing we love about Morgan cars.SrMoreno said:
Alex said:
I'm amazed this isn't on the PH front page yet.
It is odd. However, Pistonheads seems to focus on Stuttgart and Munich these days, rather than Malvern, Gaydon or Hethel.juansolo said:
Frimley111R said:
Alex said:
These people do not understand Morgan customers. In an effort to make the cars more modern/reliable/better-made, they will obliterate every thing we love about Morgan cars.
So you think that 'more modern/reliable/better-made' is bad? I am sorry but the way cars used to be/are now is not the way they can remain. Doing so simply means a slow death. Morgan make some lovely cars but they must keep moving forward. They either have to step up or remain a tiny niche manufacturer and that simply means that competitors will end up so far ahead, what was once a quaint english car is simply an old english car that few will buy. Lotus made the Evora after the Elise and people love that just as much so don't assume this is 'the beginning of the end', its the start of the future.As to more modern/reliable/better-made being bad question. I've been looking at swapping my 190E for something more modern (less reliable/more cheaply made...) and I've found that with a few, usually expensive exceptions, they're all bland. Everything is the same now. Now I know legislation, CAD, etc is the cause. But nothing has any personality any more. Take the personality out of Morgan and what have you got? You lose your current customers whilst trying to seduce customers away from established brands that you're now going to be compared with... Have Morgan really got the might to pull that off when Lotus and TVR didn't?
In a way, I'm not entirely surprised at the announcement. I met him at an industry do and thought he was rather pompous. He told me that Morgans NEVER breakdown and there was no need to give customers a warranty or any aftersales back up. Morgans simply go on forever, as opposed to BMWs and Merc that simply get crushed, he went on to say... I thought that was a rather blinkered and misinformed comment from someone I had previously admired.
As has been said earlier in this thread, Morgans are a niche product, predominately sold to enthusiasts. That market is small and is getting smaller. The Aero cars are impressive, but very expensive and simply cant compete with the build quality of the competition. trying to expand a business on that basis is a recipe for disaster.
My Plus 8 was the worst car I've ever owned but it didn't stop me loving it because of it's unique character and ownership experience. If that gets lost, it's a slippery slope downwards in my opinion.
The removal of Charles Morgan must surely undermine the value of the company moving forward though?
As has been said earlier in this thread, Morgans are a niche product, predominately sold to enthusiasts. That market is small and is getting smaller. The Aero cars are impressive, but very expensive and simply cant compete with the build quality of the competition. trying to expand a business on that basis is a recipe for disaster.
My Plus 8 was the worst car I've ever owned but it didn't stop me loving it because of it's unique character and ownership experience. If that gets lost, it's a slippery slope downwards in my opinion.
The removal of Charles Morgan must surely undermine the value of the company moving forward though?
Gramrugby said:
Charles has run the Morgan Motor Company for some years. The family has run it since it’s inception more than a century ago. Morgan produces quintessentially British cars. They’re not cheap. Their joyfully silly Three-Wheeler (usually complete with RAF roundels and fake bullet holes) is the entry model at around £32,000. A top end Aero Supersport is £127,000.
.... And here is the danger lurking in the shadows. A Company like Morgan needs to remember that its customers are not buying a car, they’re also buying what it represents. It’s different, it’s fun, it’s very British.
.... The removal of Charles Morgan from the management team today is not, in and of itself, evidence that Morgan faces the same dangers, but combined with the tone of its communications it really is an indicator of dangers ahead, and that should alarm the family trust.
Morgan stands at a dangerous crossroads. It has clearly decided that growth and profits rely on change. In that it’s right, I’m sure, but between the excited MBAs now in charge, the talk of “market entry” and the flow charts mapping “the customer journey”, it needs to remember why people buy its cars. It’s because they are better than the competition, but not in a way you can illustrate in Microsoft Power Point.
A thorough and excellent explanation..... And here is the danger lurking in the shadows. A Company like Morgan needs to remember that its customers are not buying a car, they’re also buying what it represents. It’s different, it’s fun, it’s very British.
.... The removal of Charles Morgan from the management team today is not, in and of itself, evidence that Morgan faces the same dangers, but combined with the tone of its communications it really is an indicator of dangers ahead, and that should alarm the family trust.
Morgan stands at a dangerous crossroads. It has clearly decided that growth and profits rely on change. In that it’s right, I’m sure, but between the excited MBAs now in charge, the talk of “market entry” and the flow charts mapping “the customer journey”, it needs to remember why people buy its cars. It’s because they are better than the competition, but not in a way you can illustrate in Microsoft Power Point.
I have a fondness for the company, admire the obvious enthusiasm of the car owners, and am pleased that Morgan has managed to survive for over a century.
It was good to hear at a recent factory visit, that the order book is strong, and I was amazed to be told that more than 1,000 Three Wheelers are on order.
Just could not believe it, when I read today that Mr Charles Morgan has left.
A Morgan is not my type of sports car, as I discovered after driving one for a day, but they have such charm and many people do adore them and buy them.
Although the top models are priced above £120,000, if the 'new suits' think they can modernise their top products, by moving the design construction complexity towards McLaren or Aston Martin, they are dreaming. That type of manufacturing and product development costs mega money. Just look at how few years out of 100, Aston Martin has managed to make a profit, and how many times it has, or has nearly gone bust.
Morgan has it's own niche and has thrived for so long, simply by not changing too much. They may eventually run out of the present special breed of enthusiasts, but to frighten them away, would invite trouble far more quickly.
I had to laugh at the 'management speak' company statement and this extract in particular;
'reflecting the scale and complexity of an increasingly global business.
Really ?
Good luck Mr. Morgan. I am sure thousands of Morgan owners and potential customers, want you and need you, to be active within your family company.
Loyal Morgan customers might soon drift away, if their enthusiasm fades.
I've listened to Charles talk about his vision for the business and the types of cars he wanted to produce, mentioning carbon fibre in future production etc.
This to my mind isn't Morgan the R&D costs would bust the business. It's my guess that the time has come to decide the direction of the business and it didn't go in Charles direction. You'd need a far better set of accounts than MMC to be even contemplating this.
The press release is badly written, but I'd image the family have had to be very careful with what they say. In the end I dare say it'll all end up at an employment hearing and the family dirty laundry will be aired, and I'd guess one side won't come out covered in glory.
This to my mind isn't Morgan the R&D costs would bust the business. It's my guess that the time has come to decide the direction of the business and it didn't go in Charles direction. You'd need a far better set of accounts than MMC to be even contemplating this.
The press release is badly written, but I'd image the family have had to be very careful with what they say. In the end I dare say it'll all end up at an employment hearing and the family dirty laundry will be aired, and I'd guess one side won't come out covered in glory.
I don't know about carbon fibre but for the hydroformed aluminium panels used in most Morgans they outsource the manufacture, doing the same with the chassis for the Aero cars. No idea what the arrangements are but it is quite possible that this enabled them to share development costs with the supplier. Doing the same for carbon would make sense, but whether it is the right material for a Morgan I'm not sure - it would depend where and how it was used I guess.
Business needs are sometimes harsh and who knows what has gone on internally?
The larger issue here is not one of Charles being ousted but one of how the whole process has been "managed" and taking Charles company car back on the anniversary of his father's death? Surely this must raise a question around the ability and intelligence of the individuals concerned and if they have failed in a simple transition in ousting a board member and shareholder what hope is there for the business successfully evolving which is a driver for the actions that have occurred?
The larger issue here is not one of Charles being ousted but one of how the whole process has been "managed" and taking Charles company car back on the anniversary of his father's death? Surely this must raise a question around the ability and intelligence of the individuals concerned and if they have failed in a simple transition in ousting a board member and shareholder what hope is there for the business successfully evolving which is a driver for the actions that have occurred?
Statement (or rather declaration of no statement) from Charles Morgan : http://charlesmorganuk.wordpress.com/2013/10/18/st...
THAT is class.
His statement speaks volume about his family and possibly
his upbringing.
Always adored the path the company was following the
last decade. Top brand building in finding a winning
formula of combining history with state of the art
and even futurism. Very interesting objects those
Aeromax Coupes. The "new" threewheelers, dito.
Don't want this saga to end in shatters.
Hope all parties involved can solve this.
Martin
His statement speaks volume about his family and possibly
his upbringing.
Always adored the path the company was following the
last decade. Top brand building in finding a winning
formula of combining history with state of the art
and even futurism. Very interesting objects those
Aeromax Coupes. The "new" threewheelers, dito.
Don't want this saga to end in shatters.
Hope all parties involved can solve this.
Martin
Edited by Martin 480 Turbo on Friday 18th October 18:03
I consider this part to be an important achievement.
'I’m proud to say I leave with the company’s annual production volumes double what they were at the start of my tenure'
To me (not a Morgan owner) the recent upper range of cars, have added greatly to the status of the company.
I looked at another Morgan forum, and was most surprised at one suggestion
'perhaps BMW or VW are about to buy the company'.
Seemed crazy to me, because such a purchase would not even add one decimal point, to their profits.
Pure speculation of course, but is the creeping safety legislation going to be a major problem to Morgan? I could not even see a fitted airbag, when I last looked.
Edited by Jon39 on Friday 18th October 23:04
I have always been a fan of the Morgan Motor Company because they are so old school and very British. I have never owned, driven or even passengered in one. I am very middle aged so no youngster.
I watched the two Morgan videos on the drive channel. The first I thought Charles came across as a bit of a buffoon. The second with Matt Farah he faired slightly better.
So I am not overly suprised that Charles has been asked to leave. My guess is that he has become more of a liability than an asset. Perhaps making MMC look slightly foolish when dealing with the new emerging big money markets. Pure speculation on my part but just maybe he has outlived his usefullness.
Whatever the outcome I wish Morgan well. I would like to think that they will continue to flourish and still retain there individual character within an industry of bland look alikes and pokemon faces.
I watched the two Morgan videos on the drive channel. The first I thought Charles came across as a bit of a buffoon. The second with Matt Farah he faired slightly better.
So I am not overly suprised that Charles has been asked to leave. My guess is that he has become more of a liability than an asset. Perhaps making MMC look slightly foolish when dealing with the new emerging big money markets. Pure speculation on my part but just maybe he has outlived his usefullness.
Whatever the outcome I wish Morgan well. I would like to think that they will continue to flourish and still retain there individual character within an industry of bland look alikes and pokemon faces.
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