That's what friends are for. MGF VVC with they all do that .

[MGJohn]

I have a Motor Trade Policy. Anyone can drive a car under my policy as long as I sit alongside them in the car.

[na]

MGJohn said:

I have a Motor Trade Policy. Anyone can drive a car under my policy as long as I sit alongside them in the car.

you were quite harsh with WO so . . .

nah, I'm not having this, you didn't say you had a Motor Trade Policy or include this point in your posts about insurance

unless I'm wrong (and I am many times) you got this wrong then pulled this Motor Trade Policy at the end to cover your actions rather than your words, you normally seem very reasonable

and I’m not even sure the MTP would cover you if it was your son’s car but I wouldn’t know

n.b. – I’m not trying to catch you out, the vid link doesn’t work on my computer and you can edit the OP at anytime

[Vince70]

I was enjoying this thread till it got off topic, who cares about the technicalities of car insurance can we go back to the topic in question.

[na]

Vince70 said:

I was enjoying this thread till it got off topic, who cares about the technicalities of car insurance can we go back to the topic in question.

it matters that those that read this thread don't misunderstand the technicalities, as you call it, of car insurance

what you want and what you get aren't always the same, you're entitled to your view and to contribute to the original topic and to ask for more on that original topic and I and no one else is stopping this

I'm sorry a bit of education has slipped in

[MGJohn]

It has always been up to the individual to ensure that he is insured to drive a car. Nothing changed there. It has always been so.

These various changes to the law are designed to stop cars being driven without insurance of the driver.

They do not do that. They are however, nice little earners for the sandal wearing, bearded types we entrust to the nation's well being who try to justify their existence and over rewarded salaries by coming up with legislation overkill. The men are just as bad or even worse.

If someone takes a car illegally, the Police see it showing as Insured on MID and so nothing is done although if that car were involved in an accident, there's no guarantee those who suffer as a consequence will have any Insurance to turn to. TWOC has seen a line of folks waiting at a Bus Stop taken out .... and numerous other hideous examples can be seen just about every week that goes by.

If that same Police observer checks and the car which is not shown on the MID, that would set the alarm bells ringing and effective action would be taken, unless instructed to ignore for some reason and yet another box gets ticked as a job well done.

Can you see the difference?

Those we entrust to the Nation's well being seem only to excel in getting far too many things quite simply wrong, always with the best possible motives and a lack of forward vision which would never justify their continued employment in a more reasoned sensible world.

Never mind the quality of Police servicing, feel the width of these ticked boxes.

Is it any bluddy wonder this Nation is the way it now is and with no signs of things improving, only more signs of getting worse.

It did not used to be like that. far from it. Legislation overkill is not the answer.

na..

Did you click on the vid in my OP? Had you done so you would have seen someone ask if the car was still insured .... and confirmation that it was as a simple check with MID will show.

... and another thing. On my property I have a small track and for years, I've allowed young lads including my own sons and their friends to drive reasonably powerful cars in a safe environment with little danger to themselves or perhaps more importantly, none to others. Driving cars which will never be used on the roads ever again. So, to do this now means that those cars would have to be insured!! Pathetic!! Here's my then schoolboy son some years ago doing just that.



Something I used to allow regularly but now it seems, not possible since those highly regarded and over rewarded bearded types have their all knowing way....

Any bluddy wonder!! A nation excelling at getting far too many things quite simply ... WRONG!

Still this legislation overkill will ensure no cars are ever driven without insurance. Guaranteed even ... You couldn't make it up.

Now BACK on topic. There has been some interesting developments with this nice little MG and when time allows, I'll put up some more information.

[na]

only to reply to (and possibly not be dismissed by) you and not to drag this out further

as I put in my previous (but one) post, yes I did try to view your video, twice, but it didn’t work and it was you that said Nathan hadn’t arranged insurance on it – there I must apologise and say I was wrong, in that post I put the last link referring to your son when I meant Nathan

[MGJohn]

You are correct to highlight the importance of Motor Insurance na. Far too many folks take the subject far too lightly. Some live to bitterly regret that stance on the subject. Life can be a hard teacher for some folks. The trick is not to be one of them.

[Rollcage]

na said:

sorry John but on this occasion you are wrong

. . . as you also have to take into consideration the law of the land and changes to it (June 2011)

if you had driven the car and your son (sorry I meant Nathan) had given you permission to do so then potentially you could both have been in trouble

http://www.mib.org.uk/Home/en/default.htm

http://www.mib.org.uk/Motor+Insurance+Database/en/...

and your son (sorry I meant Nathan) would be held responsible - https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-insurance/uninsured-veh...


You have interpreted that wording quite incorrectly in the case being discussed.

If the certificate states DOC cover then you are thus cleared to drive the car in question. What you have linked to isn't relevant to that argument.

Edited by na on Friday 1st March 22:32

[na]

well I'm lost then, excluding Motor Trade Policy which I didn’t know John had at the time

if I’ve quoted and linked to the wrong thing to back what I put then I apologise

if any one wants to continue this just say so and I'll start a new so that this thread can return to original topic and they can then delete their post saying so leaving the insurance subject end here on this thread

Edited by na on Saturday 2nd March 02:08

[MGJohn]

Since heard that this nice little MGF lost drive after a rapid gear change at maximum revs ~ which I think is about 7,200 rpm on these VVC K-Series. Coasted to a standstill and good old Dad and his trusty tow bar ( most of my cars have one of those ) to the rescue. Fortunately only a few miles from base. I have the technology .. :~



Initial thoughts being it must be gearbox or the cable linkage as it would select a gear and drive a little way then no way ~ total loss of drive.

Anyway, once again these lads have come up trumps. After checking the gearbox and various remote linkages ~ quite complex on these rear engine jobbies, all appeared in order. Removal of the starter motor and a peep at the clutch revealed the problem. Clutch had broken up. They fixed that today and it was again a case of :~

Son No. 1 said:

.
Dad, can I borrow your hose and funnel? We need to refill the gearbox oil.
.

Yes, my "ACE" special tool ... a plastic funnel and a short length of garden hose ...

This is my 'special mod' for filling PG1 Gearboxes. Here used on a Rover 620ti :~





This is what the other end of the garden hose looks like :~

[Masoogoo]

Helo MG John,

Rover 25 2003 1.4 Impression
I've recently purchased a Rover 25 with 60k miles that is forcing coolant out thro' the header tank cap when up to temperature. Despite the owner tellimng me that it's previously had a head-gasket change [20,000 miles ago], I believe that a head-gasket replacement is required. Also, on flushing the coolant system, I noticed a lot of bromze metallic material was present, which I'm sure is a head-gasket bodge attempt.
Anyhow, rather than scrap the car, I've armed myself with a new Haynes manual and I'm planning on replacing the head gasket and getting the head inspected at a local cyl head specialist firm, from where I will also purchase the latest MLS gasket kit.
Before starting, can you offer me any useful tips or advice?
Many Thanks in advance for your time,
Andy
Northampton

[MGJohn]

Masoogoo said:

Helo MG John,

Rover 25 2003 1.4 Impression
I've recently purchased a Rover 25 with 60k miles that is forcing coolant out thro' the header tank cap when up to temperature. Despite the owner tellimng me that it's previously had a head-gasket change [20,000 miles ago], I believe that a head-gasket replacement is required. Also, on flushing the coolant system, I noticed a lot of bromze metallic material was present, which I'm sure is a head-gasket bodge attempt.
Anyhow, rather than scrap the car, I've armed myself with a new Haynes manual and I'm planning on replacing the head gasket and getting the head inspected at a local cyl head specialist firm, from where I will also purchase the latest MLS gasket kit.
Before starting, can you offer me any useful tips or advice?
Many Thanks in advance for your time,
Andy
Northampton

Yes, of course. Firstly, renewing the cylinder head gasket ( CHG ) on any K-Series engined car is one of the easiest jobs on any DOHC engine. Even for someone who has never done a similar job to this before. The small size and flyweight engine components are a great help when working single handed.

Yes, the "bronze metallic material" is almost certainly cure all snake oil .. It could be remnants introduced before the CHG was done 20,000 miles ago. If it's been introduced since then, that's a bad sign but still no confirmation of a damaged cylinder head gasket. Could be worn spring Valve in the Expansion bottle cap allowing coolant to boil over at a lower temperature. Could be escaping coolant from a worn hose or loose fitting one. Lots of other likely suspects which cause coolant loss which if unchecked and not rectified, will allow over heating which will eventually damage the CHG. It's possible the CHG is still intact and the damage not yet done.

Meantime search MG-Rover.org for pointers on what to look for and 'how to' if it is a case where the CHG is damaged and needs replacing. Then, before starting if you have any further questions or need more advice, make a list and give me a ring. I'll help where I can. Far easier to cover such things verbally than in a long post. PM me for contact details.

[Masoogoo]

Thanks for that - will do.

Though I'll breifly summarise today's activity, as I thought I'd carry out a compression test and flush the cooling system before I did much else:

Compression Test results:
Cyl 1 = 14.0 Bar
Cyl 2 = 13.8 Bar
Cyl 3 = 14.0 Bar
Cyl 4 = 14.8 Bar
where Cyl 1 is nearest the water pump

Coolant Flush
I've also flushed the cooling systemn today with Holts Speed Flush - clear water swiftly turns murky grey / black in colour and smells of oil
Revving the engine see coolant surge in header tank with a certain amount of 'frothing'

Good Points:
No water in the oil [colour remains black]
Engine starts, runs and stops smoothly
Electric Fan cuts in
No external coolant or oil leaks
New Header Tank Cap fitted today - coolant is still being forced beyond it

Bad Points:
Coolant level erratic and being forced out thro' Header Tank Cap
After 6 or 7 miles, temp guage suddenly rises only to swiftly drop back to 'normal'

Next step is to replace / remove the Thermostat and see what happens.

Best Regards,
Andy

[MGJohn]

Provided the rest of the cooling system is in good shape, in my experience, a worn or wearing Water Pump on any K-Series is almost certainly the main cause of overheating leading to cylinder head gasket ( CHG ) damage.

When the W.Pump wears, coolant is lost through a small vent in the Pump Body directly underneath the Pump's Drive Shaft. A healthy cooling system operates at a higher pressure than atmospheric which allows coolant temperatures to reach well above atmospheric boiling temperatures. Any loss of that pressure results in premature boiling up which usually forces it's way out of the Bottle's sprung Pressure Cap Valve. If this condition is allowed to continue and car is driven on, the cylinder head gasket will be damaged by the excess of heat. Could be that damage has already happened meaning compression gasses are forced past the fire rings into the coolant passageways exacerbating the over pressurised condition. It is not unknown for a K-Series new Pump to be faulty. Aftermarket ones .. who knows? If as sometimes happens, the Pump is renewed and replaced with the uprated factory unit which includes the Evaporator ~ more on this later ~ that Evaporator protects the timing belt and works too well evaporating the first coolant losses from the wearing pump leaving NO Tell Tale damp patches under the car to alert the observant car user ( an endangered species IMHO in recent decades ) that something is not right.

Exactly this happened to my MG ZS bought new in 2003 when it was about seven years old. Car was losing a little coolant but ran faultlessly otherwise with no signs of leaks in cooling system. I wrongly assumed the coolant loss must surely be unseen via a worn CHG into the combustion chambers. Then out as an unseen mist through the exhaust. Continued regularly topping up the little losses and when my wife returned home after a fast run on a hot day, I noticed the fans running on fast and strongly far longer than is usual for the AirCon after engine switch off. Never done that before.

Lifted the bonnet to reveal an empty coolant expansion bottle ... Then noticed I was standing in a brightly coloured pool of coolant. There was a waterfall of coolant running from under the Water Pump location. How can that be? I did some web searching which revealed the uprated Evaporator version ( who knew? ... ) of the pump when all became clear. Replaced the pump with a new one WITHOUT the evaporator... Car continues to be faultless and will be eleven years old next month. By that time I had bought a MLS CHG but that will live on unused for another day ... If the replacement pump wears then there should be the tell tale damp patched under the car soon after engine switch off.

I have taken the time to post at length to alert anyone searching having been puzzled by coolant losses without any outward signs of where it's going. Could be the worn out pump wot did it ... ?

Taking the problem car to a garage more often than not results in a sharp intake of breath and an overly high quote to renew the CHG because as everybody now understands, "They all do that mate ~ it's a Rover. Well known fact .... mate... cost yah!" ...

I have recently purchased a tidy MG ZT 1.8t ~ I prefer Petrol turbos. Car drives well and is well equipped. Car is losing coolant. There is more vapour mist than is usual from the exhaust pipe. That new CHG still in its wrappings will come in handy after all... I look forward to tackling the job and I will renew the Water Pump anyway along with the Timing Belt. Three birds with one stone as all those components will become disturbed renewing the CHG. Pumps and Belts about twenty quid each.

Contrary to popular belief, it aint Rocket Science.

HTH you and anyone else faced with the same scenario.

[Masoogoo]

I think you're probably right - the CHG is knackered because the Water Pump is knackered and is likely to have been for some time.

The coolant wreaks of oil / combustion.

The only thing that puzzles me is that the compression on all cylinders appears to be in rude health...

[MGJohn]

Masoogoo said:

I think you're probably right - the CHG is knackered because the Water Pump is knackered and is likely to have been for some time.

The coolant wreaks of oil / combustion.

The only thing that puzzles me is that the compression on all cylinders appears to be in rude health...

A cold engine can give ideal compression readings. Things may open up a fraction allowing gas-coolant-oil interchanges with a hot engine.