Intrax 4 way Shocks vs. Intrax 1k2 vs. Stock AVOs

Intrax 4 way Shocks vs. Intrax 1k2 vs. Stock AVOs

Author
Discussion

radicalracer

Original Poster:

31 posts

168 months

Saturday 18th June 2011
quotequote all
splitpin said:
radicalracer said:
At 140 hours I put on new pads .......
scratchchin
I knew some wise guy would point this out. I will clarify and say I put on the second set up pads at 140 hours. I get about 70-80 hours per set. wink

dsl2

1,474 posts

200 months

Saturday 18th June 2011
quotequote all
Even at 70-80 hrs per set is incredible, you must have a lot less corners on your circuits in the US of A!

radicalracer

Original Poster:

31 posts

168 months

Saturday 18th June 2011
quotequote all
dsl2 said:
Even at 70-80 hrs per set is incredible, you must have a lot less corners on your circuits in the US of A!
Or you guys across the pond use your breaks more than the throttle. We see a direct correlation to decreasing your lap time the more you press the gas smile

splitpin

2,740 posts

197 months

Saturday 18th June 2011
quotequote all
radicalracer said:
I knew some wise guy would point this out.
Thanks for the honour, knew that little bit of Italian in me would paydirt sometime, I'm Made Up biglaugh

gixermark

742 posts

186 months

Tuesday 21st June 2011
quotequote all
dsl2 said:
Your very welcome to get a 7 & come and have a go if you think you'd be up to challenging me in my more natural environment on the hillclimbs, bring it on!
Hey Darren - bring that beast over to Craigantlet (6th Aug) - its a round of the Britsh Hill Climb Championship.... I hope to be there with my machine for the first time..

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Thursday 17th November 2011
quotequote all
dsl2 said:
Koni / Ohlins /Penske all top bifta compared to the Intrax.
Anyone know how Nitron shocks compare with these?

dsl2

1,474 posts

200 months

Thursday 17th November 2011
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Judging by the set I had on my Caterham badly, best thing about them is the way they look......

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Thursday 17th November 2011
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Thanks for the info.

dsl2

1,474 posts

200 months

Friday 18th November 2011
quotequote all
Saying that Martin, those were a basic single adjustable from 2005, and not a direct comparison as they were WELL under half the price of the Koni / Ohlins.

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Friday 18th November 2011
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Were your Nitrons the older twin tube variety or the newer mono tube version?

What do you think their 3 way adjustable versions would be like, any gut feeling?

mbm5

219 posts

162 months

Friday 18th November 2011
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I share DSLs findings ....a friend of mine put a set of Nitrons (single adjustable) on his Caterham this year and they looked fantastic but were totally rubbish. Not stiff enough, and limited adjustment.....would have been better putting some ropey old AVOs on the car and saving himself a fortune....(hope he isnt reading this...)

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Friday 18th November 2011
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Guess I will be keeping my ropey old AVOs then smile

Anyone tried Quantum dampers?


gixermark

742 posts

186 months

Friday 18th November 2011
quotequote all
I had quantums on a kit car couple of years back.... Very tasty bits of kit.. Not much in it lap time wise but felt much better on the limit, and didn't 'go off' like some of the cheaper dampers

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Friday 17th February 2012
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I had my first taste of a set of Koni 2812s on my car today and quite frankly they are bloody incredible!
They seem to soak up the bumps whilst maintaining composure. I had only run AVOs on it before and have gone for softer springs to compensate for the in-built rate in the damper (they extend on their own due to the nitrogen pressure etc)but it wasn't bottoming out or pattering over bumps like it used to. Superb.

dsl2

1,474 posts

200 months

Saturday 18th February 2012
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What did I tell you!

BioBa

317 posts

152 months

Monday 20th February 2012
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Martin B said:
I had my first taste of a set of Koni 2812s on my car today and quite frankly they are bloody incredible!
They seem to soak up the bumps whilst maintaining composure. I had only run AVOs on it before and have gone for softer springs to compensate for the in-built rate in the damper (they extend on their own due to the nitrogen pressure etc)but it wasn't bottoming out or pattering over bumps like it used to. Superb.
What size springs did you go for?

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Monday 20th February 2012
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With the old AVOs I ran 350 front, 600 rear. With the Konis I currently have 300 front and 500 rear as a starting point.

LCM

444 posts

196 months

Monday 20th February 2012
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Martin B said:
I had my first taste of a set of Koni 2812s on my car today and quite frankly they are bloody incredible!
They seem to soak up the bumps whilst maintaining composure. I had only run AVOs on it before and have gone for softer springs to compensate for the in-built rate in the damper (they extend on their own due to the nitrogen pressure etc)but it wasn't bottoming out or pattering over bumps like it used to. Superb.
As you've changed 2 things, how do you know which contributed what?

Not wanting to be a miserable old git, it's just that my scientific training makes me think that way...................

Martin B

244 posts

194 months

Thursday 23rd February 2012
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Unfortunately if I had put the same springs on the konis it would have been even less of a direct comparison as the wheel rate would have rocketed. The thing is, with the AVOs there is no additional spring rate, where the shock stops without a spring fited is where it stops even mid stroke, the konis, even without springs fitted extend fully and take considerable pressure to compress, even without springs fitted (yes I know I repeated this bit but it is the crucks of the whole matter here!). This is not the valving, it is the mono tube design with the nitrogen charged piston at the base causing this. To get the same wheel rate you need to compare like this:
Front
Avo wheel rate = (spring rate 350lb + inbuilt damper rate 0lb) x 1.1 nik link ratio = 385 lb wheel rate
Koni wheel rate = (spring rate 300lb + inbuilt damper rate 50lb) x 1.1 nik link ration = 385 lb wheel rate

Rear
AVO wheel rate =(spring rate 600lb + inbuilt damper rate 0lb) x 0.87 non nik link rear end = 522 lb wheel rate
Koni wheel rate =(spring rate 500lb + inbuilt damper rate 50lb) x 0.87 non nik link rear end = 478lb wheel rate.

Right, yes I know the rear ended up slightly softer sprung but I wasn't sure what the actual poundage of the damper was and just made a guess, in reality the front is still a little stiff although the rear is about right, so maybe the damper rate is nearer 75 lbs rather than 50 lbs.

The other issue is that I was running a more stable front tyre on the test so have no issues going down slightly more on spring rate at the front as the tyre is now doing less of the suspension deflection work.

Over the last few years I have run the AVOs at all sorts of settings and springs and never did it feel as composed as this first test on the konis.

Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:55


Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:56


Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:57

LCM

444 posts

196 months

Saturday 25th February 2012
quotequote all
Martin B said:
Unfortunately if I had put the same springs on the konis it would have been even less of a direct comparison as the wheel rate would have rocketed. The thing is, with the AVOs there is no additional spring rate, where the shock stops without a spring fited is where it stops even mid stroke, the konis, even without springs fitted extend fully and take considerable pressure to compress, even without springs fitted (yes I know I repeated this bit but it is the crucks of the whole matter here!). This is not the valving, it is the mono tube design with the nitrogen charged piston at the base causing this. To get the same wheel rate you need to compare like this:
Front
Avo wheel rate = (spring rate 350lb + inbuilt damper rate 0lb) x 1.1 nik link ratio = 385 lb wheel rate
Koni wheel rate = (spring rate 300lb + inbuilt damper rate 50lb) x 1.1 nik link ration = 385 lb wheel rate

Rear
AVO wheel rate =(spring rate 600lb + inbuilt damper rate 0lb) x 0.87 non nik link rear end = 522 lb wheel rate
Koni wheel rate =(spring rate 500lb + inbuilt damper rate 50lb) x 0.87 non nik link rear end = 478lb wheel rate.

Right, yes I know the rear ended up slightly softer sprung but I wasn't sure what the actual poundage of the damper was and just made a guess, in reality the front is still a little stiff although the rear is about right, so maybe the damper rate is nearer 75 lbs rather than 50 lbs.

The other issue is that I was running a more stable front tyre on the test so have no issues going down slightly more on spring rate at the front as the tyre is now doing less of the suspension deflection work.

Over the last few years I have run the AVOs at all sorts of settings and springs and never did it feel as composed as this first test on the konis.

Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:55


Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:56


Edited by Martin B on Thursday 23 February 22:57
Ah, I see.

For aero reasons, I run with spring rates and suspension frequencies that may make one's eyes water (they do mine) so tend to eschew significant damping on bump (dampers just can't react fast enough due to viscous effects) and only apply some on rebound.