DSG reliability

[lambada]

SMB said:

I assume you mean will it hold and not roll?

No that's not what I meant - sorry for not being clear. Some DSG owners have reported juddering when reversing uphill. Was just wondering if this is standard DSG behaviour.

[Glosphil]

lambada said:

No that's not what I meant - sorry for not being clear. Some DSG owners have reported juddering when reversing uphill. Was just wondering if this is standard DSG behaviour.

Mine is reluctant to reverse if this is the first movement after the car has not been used for some time (e.g., over-night). It either needs a steady throttle input and wait a few seconds before it moves or a small forward movement before selecting reverse. However, there is no juddering in reverse. If I am impatient and increase throttle when waiting for movement in reverse to start then there will be a jerk when it suddenly starts to move. Mine is the 6-speed wet-clutch DSG. Two friends with the same gearbox report the same 'fault'.

[SMB]

lambada said:

No that's not what I meant - sorry for not being clear. Some DSG owners have reported juddering when reversing uphill. Was just wondering if this is standard DSG behaviour.

All I can say is mine doesn't judder. There is a slight delay between releasing the brakes and the clutch engaging ( normal) I think some people fill this gap with more throttle and you then have more of a Grand Prix start. Then of course you lift off, the revs and speed drop, the car dips the clutch to stop a stall and the process can start again etc. Of course some may have a real mechanical issue, but some of those comments may come from a lack of mechanical finesse.

[BE57 TOY]

Glosphil said:

lambada said:

No that's not what I meant - sorry for not being clear. Some DSG owners have reported juddering when reversing uphill. Was just wondering if this is standard DSG behaviour.

Mine is reluctant to reverse if this is the first movement after the car has not been used for some time (e.g., over-night). It either needs a steady throttle input and wait a few seconds before it moves or a small forward movement before selecting reverse. However, there is no juddering in reverse. If I am impatient and increase throttle when waiting for movement in reverse to start then there will be a jerk when it suddenly starts to move. Mine is the 6-speed wet-clutch DSG. Two friends with the same gearbox report the same 'fault'.

Same here. I have to put it in reverse and wait for it to move by itself before applying gentle throttle otherwise the car will jerk backwards suddenly.

Regarding someone else's comments about these boxes needing constant input, I rarely use my paddles and normally use it as a "full auto"

[SMB]

Glosphil said:

Mine is reluctant to reverse if this is the first movement after the car has not been used for some time (e.g., over-night). It either needs a steady throttle input and wait a few seconds before it moves or a small forward movement before selecting reverse. However, there is no juddering in reverse. If I am impatient and increase throttle when waiting for movement in reverse to start then there will be a jerk when it suddenly starts to move. Mine is the 6-speed wet-clutch DSG. Two friends with the same gearbox report the same 'fault'.

You're looking in the wrong place for a fault, it's not the gearbox. It's just the brake pads binding on the discs.

[SMB]

Glosphil said:

You "suspect"? Does this mean you have never driven a DSG and hence are just guessing?

"drive mostly in manual mode", "flip into manual mode as required"? That would be required by the driver not by the gearbox. The DSG is quite capable of always being driven in Auto (Drive) mode. Although I make use of the manual mode (my car has the steering wheel 'paddles') I have two friends who have DSG and have never used manual mode. They still think it is a great gearbox and one is on his third DSG-equipped car. It is no more necessary to use manual mode on a DSG than on any other auto gearbox.

I've been driving dsg for 18 months daily so, I was trying to be polite and say that some of the negative comments come from people not using the gearbox fully. If you just want to use auto fine, but for the higher powered turbo cars using manual makes far better progress without hitting the red line in sport every time. It also means you can be in the right gear at the right time to drive round a corner balanced without the car deciding to change mid corner.

[catso]

SMB said:

I suspect those that get the most out of dsg drive mostly in manual mode rather than auto, or at least flip into manual mode as required regularly.

Don't know what others do but I've had an A3 DSG for 10yrs/80k and whilst my original 'plan' was to use mainly manual, in fact I rarely use it as the auto mode is just right most of the time. I only use 'playstation mode' if wanting to downshift early into a bend otherwise it's easier just to let the car decide - it's not like it needs to be in manual to extract the performance, and all lots of shifting does is increase the fuel consumption. Mine is not a peaky turbo engine though, so maybe that makes a difference?

As for hill-holding and reversing, mine doesn't hold itself on a hill in either forward or reverse but that's what the brake pedal is for, the only criticism I have of reverse is that it takes a little while to engage (in reality it's only a split-second but can seem a long time if in a hurry). The only minor issue I've noticed (but have got used to) is that 'creeping' up to, say a wall, forwards can be tricky as the clutch take-up can be grabby, especially when the engine (gearbox?) is cold, it is less grabby in reverse.

Otherwise I've been very happy and wouldn't want to go back to a conventional box.

[SMB]

catso said:

. Mine is not a peaky turbo engine though, so maybe that makes a difference?

.

Quite possibly , mines in a scirocco r so after 3 rd in auto mode the up shifts drop the engine below ideal revs for boost to liven up the engine. Changing up at 1800rpm probably is perfect in a diesel, but not a k04 turbo petrol.

[Flibble]

Reverse delay might be because the box has first gear selected. Reverse and first are on the same clutch pack so it has to do a proper change to go from first into reverse or vice versa, rather than a quick clutch pack swap as for an odd-even shift.

As for manual vs auto, I use mine in D mostly, sometimes M on a nice twisty B road. Being able to downchange for overtakes with the paddles is very useful even while in D though. FWIW mine is a fairly peaky turbo petrol, but it doesn't really drop it out of the power band. I've noticed D mode holding gears longer recently (up to 4-5k in some cases), I'm not sure if the box has adapted a bit to my driving, or I'm just subconsciously booting the throttle a bit harder to make it do that.

[IainT]

BE57 TOY said:

Regarding someone else's comments about these boxes needing constant input, I rarely use my paddles and normally use it as a "full auto"

I drive my A5 almost entirely as an auto, sometimes shift to 'S' for overtakes. Mostly use manual to shift down on downhill stretches to moderate speed rather than constantly sit on the foot break.

Barring that it's just so much less hassle when commuting.

Re: Reversing... I've noticed it can be a bit sluggish to respond to being popped in reverse but nothing jerky about it.

[KarlMac]

07 plate Golf GTi on 61k here. About the only thing that hasn't given me any trouble is the gearbox.

It does take some getting used too and there have been a few 'kick down' moments in traffic which are slightly embarassing. This can be overcome by not being lazy and putting it into manual. It can also be a bit slow witted if you coast up to a round about then apply some throttle.

[fangio]

Avoid the pause from foot-brake to throttle by using the handbrake; the brake pedal has a switch that I think de-clutches.

[fangio]

Glosphil said:

Mine is reluctant to reverse if this is the first movement after the car has not been used for some time (e.g., over-night). It either needs a steady throttle input and wait a few seconds before it moves or a small forward movement before selecting reverse. However, there is no juddering in reverse. If I am impatient and increase throttle when waiting for movement in reverse to start then there will be a jerk when it suddenly starts to move. Mine is the 6-speed wet-clutch DSG. Two friends with the same gearbox report the same 'fault'.

That's the cold oil.

Also the reason gears change at higher revs.

If you thrash about for a while, the car thinks 'OK' and changes gear at higher speeds, but if you potter about it will get into top much sooner. Like 6th at 40mph.

Edited by fangio on Monday 16th June 15:08

[IainT]

One interesting difference I've spotted between our two DSGs is the Auto Stop/Start... it works much more sensibly on the A3 (brand new) than on the A5 (early 2012).

In the A5 stopping on the foot brake will stop the engine, you then engage the handbrake and lift off the foot brake and the engine restarts.
In the A3 the engine stays off when you lift your foot off the brake - only restarting if you prod the throttle.

Annoying feature on the A5 as you sit in traffic with your foot on the peddle blinding the person behind you!

[va1o]

BE57 TOY said:

Glosphil said:

lambada said:

No that's not what I meant - sorry for not being clear. Some DSG owners have reported juddering when reversing uphill. Was just wondering if this is standard DSG behaviour.

Mine is reluctant to reverse if this is the first movement after the car has not been used for some time (e.g., over-night). It either needs a steady throttle input and wait a few seconds before it moves or a small forward movement before selecting reverse. However, there is no juddering in reverse. If I am impatient and increase throttle when waiting for movement in reverse to start then there will be a jerk when it suddenly starts to move. Mine is the 6-speed wet-clutch DSG. Two friends with the same gearbox report the same 'fault'.

Same here. I have to put it in reverse and wait for it to move by itself before applying gentle throttle otherwise the car will jerk backwards suddenly.

Regarding someone else's comments about these boxes needing constant input, I rarely use my paddles and normally use it as a "full auto"

Yeah this seems to be a common thing with Reverse, does take a few seconds to engage. Reversing uphill can be extra challenging as its difficult to make small and precise movements like you can with a Manual.

I thought the paddles were cool when I first got mine but I never use them as the Auto mode works so well.

[Glosphil]

SMB said:

You're looking in the wrong place for a fault, it's not the gearbox. It's just the brake pads binding on the discs.

You could be right but won't the problem then also show itself when moving forward?

[SMB]

Glosphil said:

You could be right but won't the problem then also show itself when moving forward?

Well normal wear pattern from moving forward or the position of the pads in the capiler could mean the release is easier, just like a ratchet effect.

[lambada]

How does the cost of replacing a DSG's clutch pack compare to that of replacing a manual's clutch?

[xjay1337]

Clutch packs are about £1000.

but where as a normal clutch may last about 100k, the DSG clutchpacks can last double that easily and also have higher torque limits for tuning.

My GTI is at 107k now, regularly had DSG oil/filter changes, and is pretty smooth. Doing a DSG Reset/Adaption via VCDS every 6 months helps as well.. I need to re-do mine actually.

[SMB]

I have noticed more and more taxis now that are Skodas with dsg , given a taxi would void a standard warranty you have to presume they are reliable in those cars.