2.0T FSI Drinking oil - should i worry?

2.0T FSI Drinking oil - should i worry?

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Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
quotequote all
Hello all.

I helped my father in law buy a 2011 Audi A4 fitted with the 2.0 T FSI engine and Quattro system.

He has just called me and told me that the car MMI asked him to top up the oil. He added 1 litre. He has driven the car about 200 miles and the car has again asked him to add a litre. I went over to see him this evening and the MMI is showing that the oil lvel is now maximum.

I have left him and asked him to keep an eye on the level. He is worried sick and cant sleep as he spent a lot of money for a pensioner on the car.

No obvious oil leaks under the car. No oil smells when running although the exhaust tips look a little black, but not oily black, more soot.

Any ideas what the issue could be, or how to resolve this please?

Duke147

629 posts

147 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
quotequote all
Hi, Ray

I did a quick Google on that year 2.0TFSI engine. One of the first responses was this one from an Aussie Audi owner...

http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/topic/127545-helpau...

Might be worth a check with Audi UK that all recalls etc have been carried out on that car.

Hope this helps, in a "hope this isn't right" kind of way... eek

Sheepshanks

32,529 posts

118 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
quotequote all
Thread from earlier this month: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... might have some useful info.

SuperchargedVR6

3,138 posts

219 months

Monday 28th July 2014
quotequote all
Has your Father checked the dipstick to verify the computer isn't lying?

These engines have a reputation for oil consumption and many folk find switching to a thicker oil and changing it more frequently helps.


Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Monday 28th July 2014
quotequote all
SuperchargedVR6 said:
Has your Father checked the dipstick to verify the computer isn't lying?

These engines have a reputation for oil consumption and many folk find switching to a thicker oil and changing it more frequently helps.
The car doesn't have a dipstick. Its all done on the on board MMI indicator. If you want a dipstick you can buy one for a smidgen over £100 from Audi (although I have found it here too - http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?id=20&am...

Anyways. I called up Audi today and explained the issue. They told me that the oil consumption was well over the figures expected by them. They have booked us in for an oil consumption test later this week. They will weigh the oil in the car, seal the oil cap and drain plug and then send us off to do 1000km or 600 miles. When we bring the car back, they will drain and weigh the oil. I hope that this will give us an idea of what is going on. Audi admitted a known problem with these engines, they told me that pistons and conrods may be needed at an estimated £5k inc labour. Worst case is a new engine (hold on) at over £10k. GULP!!

Once we get a diagnosis, I will establish what we need to do. I have doubts that any engine opened up and parts changed will ever be as good as an engine built in a dedicated engine plant. I am already siding with returning the car as 'not fit for purpose' for a money back guarantee.

I will keep this thread running as it may be useful to others.








NelsonR32

1,679 posts

170 months

Tuesday 29th July 2014
quotequote all
Batch of 2011 engines with excessive piston ring wear of which this is probably one. There is a two stage consumption check required before Audi will agree to replace them.

It's quite a common repair so I wouldn't be too worried about it. Especially as the parts are upgraded.

Edited by NelsonR32 on Tuesday 29th July 20:27

Laser Sag

2,860 posts

242 months

Wednesday 30th July 2014
quotequote all
Ray Singh said:
The car doesn't have a dipstick. Its all done on the on board MMI indicator. If you want a dipstick you can buy one for a smidgen over £100 from Audi (although I have found it here too - http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?id=20&am...

Anyways. I called up Audi today and explained the issue. They told me that the oil consumption was well over the figures expected by them. They have booked us in for an oil consumption test later this week. They will weigh the oil in the car, seal the oil cap and drain plug and then send us off to do 1000km or 600 miles. When we bring the car back, they will drain and weigh the oil. I hope that this will give us an idea of what is going on. Audi admitted a known problem with these engines, they told me that pistons and conrods may be needed at an estimated £5k inc labour. Worst case is a new engine (hold on) at over £10k. GULP!!

Once we get a diagnosis, I will establish what we need to do. I have doubts that any engine opened up and parts changed will ever be as good as an engine built in a dedicated engine plant. I am already siding with returning the car as 'not fit for purpose' for a money back guarantee.

I will keep this thread running as it may be useful to others.

If it is using a litre of oil in less than 200 miles does the above not introduce a risk of running the car on a very low oil level before the 600miles is up

Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Wednesday 30th July 2014
quotequote all
Yes, but Audi Swindon have asked to try nad do the miles locally. Once the oil light comes on, come back as soon as possible.

I have a feeling that the oil light will be on at the 300 to 400 mile mark.

I will keep you posted.

Laser Sag

2,860 posts

242 months

Wednesday 30th July 2014
quotequote all
Ray Singh said:
Yes, but Audi Swindon have asked to try nad do the miles locally. Once the oil light comes on, come back as soon as possible.

I have a feeling that the oil light will be on at the 300 to 400 mile mark.

I will keep you posted.
Fair enough, did seem a strange thing to do. OK sir your car is using a litre in less than 200 miles so we will seal your engine and get you to drive for 600 miles and see what happens.

Hope you get it sorted under warranty.

the-photographer

3,479 posts

175 months

Wednesday 30th July 2014
quotequote all
Ray Singh said:
SuperchargedVR6 said:
Has your Father checked the dipstick to verify the computer isn't lying?

These engines have a reputation for oil consumption and many folk find switching to a thicker oil and changing it more frequently helps.
The car doesn't have a dipstick. Its all done on the on board MMI indicator. If you want a dipstick you can buy one for a smidgen over £100 from Audi (although I have found it here too - http://www.sealey.co.uk/PLPageBuilder.asp?id=20&am...

Anyways. I called up Audi today and explained the issue. They told me that the oil consumption was well over the figures expected by them. They have booked us in for an oil consumption test later this week. They will weigh the oil in the car, seal the oil cap and drain plug and then send us off to do 1000km or 600 miles. When we bring the car back, they will drain and weigh the oil. I hope that this will give us an idea of what is going on. Audi admitted a known problem with these engines, they told me that pistons and conrods may be needed at an estimated £5k inc labour. Worst case is a new engine (hold on) at over £10k. GULP!!

Once we get a diagnosis, I will establish what we need to do. I have doubts that any engine opened up and parts changed will ever be as good as an engine built in a dedicated engine plant. I am already siding with returning the car as 'not fit for purpose' for a money back guarantee.

I will keep this thread running as it may be useful to others.
http://www.webuyanycar.com/

Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
An update on this situation.

The car managed 300 miles before the MMI oil warning light appeared.
We took it back to Swindon Audi who have diagnosed that the piston rings are shot.
Estimated bill at this time is £4.5k. If they take the engine apart and the bores are scored, then a further £2.5k will be required. All in all a bill of potentially £7k.

Audi are adamant that the car is out of warranty now - ran out in April and will not foot the bill. However a gesture of goodwill maybe available.

I will contact the garage the car was purchased from at 09:00 to see how they want to resolve the issue. At the time of purchasing the car, we (fell for) bought a RAC gold warranty for about £400. These guys are useless asking me to do all the leg work....

I will also call Audi HQ.



Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Audi HQ have come back this morning.

They will pay 100% of the parts. The labour will be discounted.
I now need to pay £1411 inc vat for the repair.

I will chase the garage selling the car to cover this or the AA warranty.


Sheepshanks

32,529 posts

118 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Ray Singh said:
I will contact the garage the car was purchased from at 09:00 to see how they want to resolve the issue. At the time of purchasing the car, we (fell for) bought a RAC gold warranty for about £400. These guys are useless asking me to do all the leg work....
It's not really a warranty issue - they're insurance policies against sudden and unexpected failures.

I got the impression you'd bought privately, but see you're saying you'll contact the garage you bought it off. You really ought to have approached them first - what sort of place is it? Getting your FIL's money back is probably the best option all round.

Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Thanks Sheepshanks - As you guessed the AA Waranty people will not honour this as it is an inherent design fault. Although annoyingly, Audi dont admit any design fault at all.

Im still left £1500 in the lurch....

I will be applying pressure to Sascron the garage where we purchased the car, next.

Sheepshanks

32,529 posts

118 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Hmmm....based on their reviews, good luck.

TBH, I'm amazed that Audi will do anything on a recently bought car from outside of their network.

roddyp

8,793 posts

115 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Audi say there's no design fault, yet the warranty company says there is. I'd ask the warranty company again, with some legal backup.

This sound very similar:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-new...



va1o

16,029 posts

206 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
I would go mental if that happened to a car of mine. £1411 is still a totally ridiculous sum of money to pay, even though its not quite as bad as it was previously quoted. On a 2011 I'd have thought they'd offer 100% goodwill, unless its been both purchased and serviced from outside the Audi network.

Sheepshanks

32,529 posts

118 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
roddyp said:
Audi say there's no design fault, yet the warranty company says there is. I'd ask the warranty company again, with some legal backup.

This sound very similar:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-new...
Pity Subaru didn't sue them for libel.

roddyp

8,793 posts

115 months

Thursday 7th August 2014
quotequote all
Ray Singh said:
I will be applying pressure to Sascron the garage where we purchased the car, next.
A lot may depend on how long since the car was bought, and how many miles it had done (and has done since). SOGA applies, and (unless it's been to the moon and back) a 3yr-old car with knackered rings isn't of "satisfactory quality".

Read this carefully :http://sogahub.tradingstandards.gov.uk/sites/default/files/OFT002_SOGA_explained.pdf

In particular, P22 puts the onus on the supplier to prove that the fault did not exist at time of sale, if you;ve had the car < 6 months.

Ray Singh

Original Poster:

3,045 posts

229 months

Friday 8th August 2014
quotequote all
roddyp said:
A lot may depend on how long since the car was bought, and how many miles it had done (and has done since). SOGA applies, and (unless it's been to the moon and back) a 3yr-old car with knackered rings isn't of "satisfactory quality".

Read this carefully :http://sogahub.tradingstandards.gov.uk/sites/default/files/OFT002_SOGA_explained.pdf

In particular, P22 puts the onus on the supplier to prove that the fault did not exist at time of sale, if you;ve had the car < 6 months.
Roddyp.

Car was purchased 28 days ago. Fault was noticed and reported to the garage 15 days after purchase. Car had 56k miles on when we bought it and now has 420 extra miles on the clock. 300 of these were requested by Audi main dealer as part of the oil consumption test.

I have now given the garage the car was purchased from seven days to respond to the request that they pick up the delta in re-build costs (£1400) plus expenses (oil consumption test and many litres of oil). so far no reply. If they dont reply within the allocated time, i will be rejecting the car as not fit for purpose.