The one to get, discovery or defender?
Discussion
Ok then does anybody that knows what to look for want to have a go at finding me one that:
A) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
A) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
sidekickdmr said:
Ok then does anybody that knows what to look for want to have a go at finding me one that:
A) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
I will have a look for you... best bet is to start with good foundation i.e galv chassis and bulkhead. With a budget of 5k, you will probably be limited to Defender 90's or 110 utilities. Station wagon's command a hefty premium.A) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
300tdi does not refer to engine capacity.
Land rover built several diesel's for the Defender listed below in order of age:
2.5 Non Turbo: Rock solid but underpowered
2.5 Turbo Diesel: The same engine as above but fitted with a turbo. Troublesome, avoid
200tdi: Arguably the best engine, but harder to source parts for these day's and quite noisy/agricultural
300tdi: Created as a refined version of the 200tdi to meet noise/emission targets
TD5: Troublesome electronics/injection system make this one to avoid
All engines displace 2.5 liters and all are 4 cylinder apart from the TD5 which is inline 5.
Newer engines and gearbox's are borrowed from Ford
Edited by skyrover on Tuesday 11th November 18:16
Okay a quick scan of the classified's and this one get's my attention. Will keep looking.
http://www.lro.com/detail/cars/4x4s/land-rover/def...
http://www.lro.com/detail/cars/4x4s/land-rover/def...
skyrover said:
TD5: Troublesome electronics/injection system make this one to avoid
Absolute ball cocks.The electronics in a Td5 are more complex that a Tdi but that doesn't automatically make them "troublesome".
Plenty of TD5s out there that are every bit as good as anything else. Like the Disco v Defender argument, there's a similar stalemate in the debate of TD5 v TDi.
Crossflow Kid said:
skyrover said:
TD5: Troublesome electronics/injection system make this one to avoid
Absolute ball cocks.The electronics in a Td5 are more complex that a Tdi but that doesn't automatically make them "troublesome".
Plenty of TD5s out there that are every bit as good as anything else. Like the Disco v Defender argument, there's a similar stalemate in the debate of TD5 v TDi.
Electronic throttle, ECU, poorer mpg, wiring loom prone to oil contamination, very expensive injectors, oil pump issues can cause ruined engine etc.
Personally i'm a big fan of inline 5 cylinder engines and would love to justify one for myself, but I just can't
Thankfully the aftermarket has provided solutions for many of the issues.... but I will stick with the 200/300tdi thanks
Here's a thing.....
I recently did the bulkhead on my TD5 90.....and everyone sucked their teeth and told me it'd never work again once I'd unplugged the main ECU.
So, rebuilt it all and, apart from needing a Testbook input to bleed the ABS modulator (which I knew about so was half-prepared for), everything worked perfectly at the first turn of the key.
Did a head gasket on a 300TDi Discovery, and it was never, ever the same again.
I recently did the bulkhead on my TD5 90.....and everyone sucked their teeth and told me it'd never work again once I'd unplugged the main ECU.
So, rebuilt it all and, apart from needing a Testbook input to bleed the ABS modulator (which I knew about so was half-prepared for), everything worked perfectly at the first turn of the key.
Did a head gasket on a 300TDi Discovery, and it was never, ever the same again.
I hope that TD5 serves you well...
But lets look at some basic costs.
New 300tdi Bosch fuel injector £81.60 each from paddocks
TD5 injectors are £300 each (and there's one more of them), then you have the ECM which is another £500
Then there's the electonic throttle vs a piece of wire on the 300tdi.. etc
But lets look at some basic costs.
New 300tdi Bosch fuel injector £81.60 each from paddocks
TD5 injectors are £300 each (and there's one more of them), then you have the ECM which is another £500
Then there's the electonic throttle vs a piece of wire on the 300tdi.. etc
Crossflow Kid said:
skyrover said:
Then there's the electonic throttle vs a piece of wire on the 300tdi.. etc
Yes.....what about them?My electronic throttle has now done double the mileage of the piece of wire it replaced.
We can play this game all day........
The British army gave up on the TD5 and went back to the 300tdi. Electronics and field repairs don't mix.
skyrover said:
If it breaks, your knackered. Can't fix it with a spare bit of wire.
The British army gave up on the TD5 and went back to the 300tdi. Electronics and field repairs don't mix.
I'm by no means an expert, but did the army even bother with the td5 or just stick with what they knew?The British army gave up on the TD5 and went back to the 300tdi. Electronics and field repairs don't mix.
sidekickdmr said:
Ok then does anybody that knows what to look for want to have a go at finding me one that:
A) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201410248465588/sort/default/postcode/bh152qj/usedcars/keywords/300tdi/radius/1501/model/defender/make/land_rover/page/3/onesearchad/used?logcode=pA) Looks smart
b) Low milage or a recent rebuild
C) 90 4 seat or 110 5 or 7 seat
D) Prehaps a Station wagon so it has the sound deadning etc.
E) A good solid engine, people keep mentioning the 300CDI but most I see have the 2.5.
Happy to spend £15,000 for a fully mint and upto spec newish one, or £5,000 for an older one as a good starting vehicle to modify/upgrade.
Have a look at this. Shame it has the chequer plate in silver but it looks good from the pics.
You could do the interior, seats, cubby, Wheels, LED lights etc etc with the money left over
abbotsmike said:
skyrover said:
If it breaks, your knackered. Can't fix it with a spare bit of wire.
The British army gave up on the TD5 and went back to the 300tdi. Electronics and field repairs don't mix.
I'm by no means an expert, but did the army even bother with the td5 or just stick with what they knew?The British army gave up on the TD5 and went back to the 300tdi. Electronics and field repairs don't mix.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_Rover_Wolf
Yes, because the average civvy wagon gets put to the same use in the same circumstances as a Wolf doesn't it?....
Honestly, any more straws you wanna clutch at?
Besides, the Army didn't "reject" the TD5, Land Rover never offered it:
You think an electronic throttle is beyond the British Army? Really? Been inside....say....a Challenger 2, or an Apache?
Td5 is no better or worse, it's just different. In years to come people will look at the Puma engine, suck their teeth and go "Oooh, too complicated, give me a Td5 any day".
It really grips my proverbial s
t when people criticise a perfectly good product because of their own self-perpetuating myths about the white man's magic known as automotive electronics and the idea that it can't be repaired with a paper clip.
Honestly, any more straws you wanna clutch at?
Besides, the Army didn't "reject" the TD5, Land Rover never offered it:
Wiki Wolf page said:
When the Wolf was designed the engine in the civilian Defenders was the Td5. Land Rover preferred the 300Tdi for the Wolf because the electronics in the Td5 were more complex to manage in the field.
Note it says the TD5 is MORE complex not TOO complex. Also bear in mind a Wolf is significantly heavier than a Defender so the lighter 300TDi lump would've kept the weight down. It also would've fitted better with existing in-service support so there is far, far more to it than just saying "yeah, 'lectronics were rubbish so they binned it".You think an electronic throttle is beyond the British Army? Really? Been inside....say....a Challenger 2, or an Apache?
Td5 is no better or worse, it's just different. In years to come people will look at the Puma engine, suck their teeth and go "Oooh, too complicated, give me a Td5 any day".
It really grips my proverbial s
t when people criticise a perfectly good product because of their own self-perpetuating myths about the white man's magic known as automotive electronics and the idea that it can't be repaired with a paper clip.Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 12th November 08:03
Crossflow Kid said:
Is now a good time to mention the 300TDi's delicate cooling requirements?
Not known the 300TDi to have 'delicate' cooling requirements...The only common cooling problem I've come across is dodgy wiring to the temp sender, which makes you think it's overheating (when it isn't).
M
camel_landy said:
Not known the 300TDi to have 'delicate' cooling requirements...
The only common cooling problem I've come across is dodgy wiring to the temp sender, which makes you think it's overheating (when it isn't).
M
To be fair it's more a problem with tuned ones, and half-arsed tuned ones at that but there are plenty of them about. IIRC Turners won't offer a warranty on replacement heads for anything other than a standard car.The only common cooling problem I've come across is dodgy wiring to the temp sender, which makes you think it's overheating (when it isn't).
M
Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 12th November 08:10
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