Living with a Defender

Living with a Defender

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Discussion

glynny

Original Poster:

28 posts

135 months

Monday 20th April 2015
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I've enquired about getting a new Defender 90 Station Wagon XS as my new daily, purely due to how much I love the look of them (and because I kind of live in the countryside wink )

Was just wondering how they are to live with day to day?

Its the only thing that is putting me off...I have test driven one and I am aware of the poor mpg and the fact it's not exactly a fun car to drive.

But I am smitten with the look of it and always desperately wanted one.

Therefore, is there anyone on here who uses theirs as a daily or can shed any personal honest opinions on the matter?




bakerstreet

4,755 posts

164 months

Monday 20th April 2015
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glynny said:
I've enquired about getting a new Defender 90 Station Wagon XS as my new daily, purely due to how much I love the look of them (and because I kind of live in the countryside wink )

Was just wondering how they are to live with day to day?

Its the only thing that is putting me off...I have test driven one and I am aware of the poor mpg and the fact it's not exactly a fun car to drive.

But I am smitten with the look of it and always desperately wanted one.

Therefore, is there anyone on here who uses theirs as a daily or can shed any personal honest opinions on the matter?
You can live with any car. It just depends on what you can tolerate. Yes, MPG will be crap, but what do you expect?? They will leak, be noisy and the heater is a bit weak. You can add heated seats though. Seating position is quite upright and comfort will depend on how tall you are. People will come on here and say 'they are really comfortable.

I would also set aside money for repairs and maintenance. People will come on here and say they are amazingly reliable...I'm not with that statement on any Land Rover. Just look at how busy Land Rover forums are. Getting the chassis treated for rust prevention is a good idea.

Of course there are plus points. You won't loose money on a decent Defender. Production ends this year and LR still have no answer on a replacement and I don't think they will replace it. Because of this, prices are rising.

FraserLFA

5,083 posts

173 months

Monday 20th April 2015
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Horrible in every sense. And you'll love it. I got a lift in a mates and found out how awful they are to be in for a long time (2 hours ish) but I left only wanting one more.

Griffithy

929 posts

275 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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You will love it.
... and there is loads of aftermarket stuff available
to make it your perfect one.

SimesJH

768 posts

150 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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I recently drove a new 90 and hated it.

However, I've owned a 300Tdi 110 for nearly 10 years and love it.

I found the TDCi variant hateful for the following reasons:-

1. Throttle response is terrible. Vague at first and difficult to modulate.
2. Engine response terrible. Flat initially and then it takes off. Combine this with the throttle and it wasn't pleasant.
3. The 6-speed 'box is good but I hated the 1-2 shift. 1st is too low. 2nd too high to be used as a 1st-gear. The rest was fine.

Compare that to my 300Tdi where it's all very linear and responsive with well-spaced gear ratios and no flat spots. OK, so my Tdi is tuned and I have Discovery gearing but my 110 easily knocks spots off a TDCi in almost every respect. The 90's heater was good, though.

So... my recommendation is to go Tdi. Buy the best you can and slowly improve the engine and enjoy simplistic servicing, better residuals and the same glorious shape and a better, more classic and spartan, dash with those lovely front vents. You can play with the suspension just the same and change the wheels / tyres and improve stuff you would do in any Defender.

They all rust, even the new ones. You'll change the chassis eventually if you keep it long enough, so buy old and change it anyway. Or just spend each year or two having it sprayed with Dinitrol. You'll do the latter with a new one anyway.

These are highly addictive machines. I really urge you to try an older one, though.

kinghottinger

185 posts

140 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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I've been daily driving a 2015 110SW for a few weeks now. Think of it as a classic car* which is capable in the winter and you're close to the experience. Yes they are noisy (can be improved) but the Puma (2.2) is much quieter than they used to be. The 6 speed gearbox is great, I don't have an issue with 1st to 2nd spacing. They're not great city cars as you have to work the heavy clutch and the box, but you can idle along in 1st or 2nd anyway. Fuel is much better than they used to be - my brand new engine is giving very nearly 30mpg, it will surely loosen up a bit.

In summary, the 2.2 Puma is more refined, quicker and more economical than previous engines, and has the 6th speed for very nice motorway lolopping at 70mph. The heater is outrageously hot, and offers little adjustment. It's 1 step for cold and about 14 for hot or hotter. It does have windows which can be opened however. It does leak in various places and has a terrible turning circle (can be tweaked a bit).

If you've always wanted one then get one before you can't buy one any more. There's no 'show-stopper' in my kind unless you just want to trundle about in London/another city traffic all day. They are charming to drive and even my very sceptical wife has been quickly won over by it, the kids love it of course, as does every other road user apparently.

(* I used to daily drive a 1982 E28 for years so my expectations were not very high for the Defender)

GetCarter

29,358 posts

278 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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I've owned two 90 XS SWs

Bad: They are hopeless on the motorway, really loud, rubbish in-car entertainment, bloody cold in winter, pathetic MPG

Good: Will go most places without a blink, classless, classy, great for dogs, you can hose them out, great driving height.

Mrs Get now owns an Evoque. Does 95% of what the defender does, but SO much more comfortably.... but with MUCH less space. (Hosing out isn't an option either).

Davel

8,982 posts

257 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^

Got to agree with this.

I loved my 90 XS County but the wife and quite tall kids hated being in the back.

It leaked quite badly and the clutch was very heavy in serious traffic congestion.

I'd have another as a daily driver but it just depends what you need it for.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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We have a 2013 110XS SW as our family bus, which my wife uses as her daily-driver. By any modern standard it is slow, noisy, uncomfortable and uneconomical but we all love it and intend to keep it forever as there is nothing else that does the same job. It doesn't leak, has a heater that will melt your socks and the heated screen and seats make it very liveable in winter. The radio is actually very good with uprated tweeters, subwoofer and bluetooth, but when you stop you realise how loud you had cranked it up to overcome the background noise level! Ours has rubber mats throughout and has had drinks spilled in it and carried all manner of crap to the tip and being able to hose it out without getting any of the seats wet is brilliant. When the rain is tipping down, the roads flooded with standing water then the feeling of invincibility and visibility is great.

As long as you aren't in a hurry and enjoy the process of driving something very mechanical that requires some practice and skill to drive smoothly, then you'll love it. If you're always in a hurry and want to be isolated from the outside world and the process of driving as much as possible (as all modern cars do too well) then you'll hate it. I don't personally understand the rose-tinted views of the older diesel engines; most people who've moved from TDi/TD5 to TDCI say that the vehicle as a whole is improved. The diesel particle filter is a necessary evil these days and LR seems to have an implementation that copes with stop/start driving without getting blocked. You can get a remap to liven it up a bit of you feel the need. With the 6-speed 'box it will sit at 75mph quite comfortably without deafening you and can go quicker if your ears are up to it.

One downside is that some LR dealers are not great and simply aren't capable of diagnosing/looking after old-fashioned, mechanical vehicles any more. Servicing is stupidly expensive for what is done, but ours will be done elsewhere once out of warranty. The turning circle is bad and parking can take some planning, but you get used to it. Headlights are rubbish, but can be changed in half an hour. Underbody rust proofing is somewhat lacking, but there are plenty of companies out there that can apply your preferred product, or you can DIY as I did. I suppose it is also worth bearing in mind that although they do have ABS and TC these days there are no airbags or crumple zones.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 21st April 16:07

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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glynny said:
not exactly a fun car to drive.
Ballcocks.
One of the best driving experiences out there because you really do have to drive it. Your driving will probably improve as you become more aware of what's happening around you, and more capable of anticipating switched-off tts in Euroboxes and cocks in Barnstormers.

wormus

14,509 posts

202 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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Never owned one by my Dad had every generation from S1 to a 110 county. Very cool things but horrible to travel distance in and as others have said they leak and rust like nothing else on the road.

I bought a D3 which I loved, felt like part of the family. Traded in 7 years later for a D4. Much, much better cars and well worth a look.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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glynny said:
not exactly a fun car to drive.
Ballcocks.
One of the best driving experiences out there because you really do have to drive it. Your driving will probably improve as you become more aware of what's happening around you, and more capable of anticipating switched-off tts in Euroboxes and cocks in Barnstormers.

Lefty

16,131 posts

201 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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One thing to consider - you really, really don't want to crash it. The whole thing is a crumple zone.

I love Defenders and have had loads of them (6 I think) but wouldn't put my family in one unless it were beefed up with external roll cage and some really good chassis-mounted Rock sliders to give a little side-impact strength.

I saw a 110 that had rolled once, the body above the bonnet line was gone.

2.5pi

1,066 posts

181 months

Tuesday 21st April 2015
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I never intended it to be a daily driver but I've now now culled our generic German SUV because we just stopped using it and I'm now using the defender 90 for nearly all local trips, great for the dogs and remarkably compact for parking .

It also gently improves your driving and second gear is your first gear unless you're towing or climbing Snowdon.

In short it is the perfect antidote to brain out, Bluetooth streaming boredom

billywhizzzzzz

1,989 posts

142 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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I have a 2014 USW which I use daily and adore it. I had a 300tdi before fore many years. The switch takes a little getting used to but the TDCi is better in every way for proper journeys - I use june for long distances, and think nothing of jumping in and doing several hundred miles. I'd never do that in the 300tdi, much as I loved it (and that had discovery gearing too). I have much faster cars to use - but end up using the Defender for most things. I love the way it drives - get one - you won't regret it!

100SRV

2,126 posts

241 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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Hi,
interesting thread as I'm in the process of replacing my Focus daily driver with a 110 County. Primary reason is that although the family enjoy going green laning in the 88" Series One, the lack of seat belts worries me when combined with modern driving attitudes. The enabler for car change is that I've gone from a weekly 110 mile trip to and from an office / B&B near Basingstoke to working from home with intermittent trips North.

I learnt to drive in an 88" Diesel Series One and have owned a 100" Bowler since I built it in 1998. The 110 is an interesting mix of these two with some of the comforts of the Focus (i.e. seats are covered in fabric, the roof doesn't flap when it is windy and you can "lock" the doors).

I've had this 110 for a few weeks but only this week have I used it instead of the Focus. It is nice to drive, I'm sure a trip to Scotland for work will take much longer than the 4 or so hours in the Focus but I don't think it will be too bad - maybe an hour extra if cruising at 60 to 65. With the advent of "managed" motorways it'll reduce the risk of a speeding ticket a little ;-)

Main thing I've noticed is the abysmal lack of stowage for everyday things like demisting cloth, pen, map etc. There is the disappearing dash where items placed therein slip to an alternate dimension when required only to reappear when you are seeking something else. Also the underseat lockers - great for the battery to live and wheel changing tools.

Time to get busy with tape measure and notepad, pretty sure I can work out some improved stowage with folded aluminium, map nets etc. I'll post photos if this works out well.

Stick with a Defender if you want one - our 110 allows the family to have bigger adventures and combine geocaching, green laning, cycling walking etc. Few places are inaccessible with the correct technique, it won't depreciate like other cars and you'll always be "entertained" by something it does/doesn't do.

philcray

845 posts

202 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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I have a 56 plate 90 XS td5 which I use every day, slow & noisy but fun to drive. Not the best for long distances but if you have another family car then ideal for pottering around.

Heater not great and you tend to roast in summer, the XS has air con but it is quite primitive. Mine has the opening flaps which give some air flow but also ensure you get the full benefit of the engine noise...

Highly recommended!

anonymous-user

53 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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Heater not great? My TD5's heater is like a furnace. Super toasty.

Hooli

32,278 posts

199 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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100SRV said:
and you'll always be "entertained" by something it does/doesn't do.
This sums it up for me. LRs are like pets, you learn to enjoy their faults & laugh about it while patting the bonnet & saying 'poor thing' when with a car you'd be swearing & calling the scrappy to collect it.

andyxxx

1,164 posts

226 months

Thursday 23rd April 2015
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I am on my third Defender. It has the 2.2 Puma engine.

The vehicle is a massive improvement over the earlier model in every way (the only thing I kind of miss is the primitive vents in the bulkhead which are now not possible)

My car has had the engine remapped and had loads of options fitted including soundproofing. The car is not loud on the motorway and unlike my previous models it can and is comfortably used as a daily vehicle.

The heater now does work well and the xs has heated seats and aircon.

I really can’t comment on the safety aspect of a rolled Defender compared to a rolled family hatch, but I would think in other safety comparisons (for the inhabitants not pedestrians or other road users)I would have thought it is a far safer place to be?

There are indeed bad points – very poor turning circle, rusting underside, some awful main dealers (but that is even more galling on a £85K Range Rover!)

It’s rather a shame it’s taking early retirement.