Start up Dilemma.. Now What?
Discussion
sammc123 said:
Now regarding the 400 follows it actually did go surprisingly well but the "test business" just wasn't sustainable for the product otherwise I would have run for that! It was Exotic Wood Sunglasses imported from china but once I went through the numbers it would have been extremely hard to turn a profit. Regarding how many would buy out of the just under 400 followers I had 106 people ask me how they could order and when would they be made available
So even though your test business went surprisingly well all it proved was that it was extremely hard to make a profit. By contrast every £1 you get paid for driving a bus is £1 profit. And there will always be buses.How much will you earn every year driving buses, and how many bazillion social media contracts (which might conk out any day or fail to pay) will you need to match it?
Sam, sorry what I was getting at is why are you charging £60? What makes it £60 and not £50, or £20, or £400?
I get what you're saying about targeting small companies with maybe 5 employees or less and the price needs to be cheap, totally understand that. But what made you settle on £60?
Furthermore you need to understand from a marketing point of view why are people wanting their social media managed? Is it to build a brand, increase sales, be more responsive to customers?? Depending on what they want to do will dictate what you need to do.
For instance that bridal shop, what happens when somebody posts on there saying 'Hey I'm getting married soon, do you have XX dress in stock?' Are you expected to reply to that? As they will be thinking 'I pay him £60 p/m to manage my social media' so will that fall under your remit? Then you have to find out if that dress is in stock and reply back. Ignore it and the customer gets pissed off and doesn't buy from them - annoying your customer.
I would echo what has been said already, test the water and see how you go. But certainly do not give up a day job on the promise of this and gaining 50+ customers.
Imagine you do have 50 clients. There are on average 20-22 working days per month. That means that in each day you will need to update everything for 2.5 of your customers. That means you will only be able to spend 3 hours per month on each customer. They will expect their social media updated almost daily. There simply isn't enough time for one person to do that. Which means you need to hire somebody else. But generating £3000 a month is not enough to hire somebody else, so you need to increase the price. You do this and then it gets you into a whole different area.
In my honest opinion I think it's a non starter. You will spend far too much time for such little return. If you already had the track record of working for an agency, managing clients social media and you are looking to start on your own that is a different ball game. But sorry to be blunt about this, you don't have that experience yet to attract the type of customer that will pay you the money you need to make this a viable option. You'll just be working more and more on small customers who will expect too much for their money and ultimately not see any value in it as you'll be pulled from pillar to post by each client.
I get what you're saying about targeting small companies with maybe 5 employees or less and the price needs to be cheap, totally understand that. But what made you settle on £60?
Furthermore you need to understand from a marketing point of view why are people wanting their social media managed? Is it to build a brand, increase sales, be more responsive to customers?? Depending on what they want to do will dictate what you need to do.
For instance that bridal shop, what happens when somebody posts on there saying 'Hey I'm getting married soon, do you have XX dress in stock?' Are you expected to reply to that? As they will be thinking 'I pay him £60 p/m to manage my social media' so will that fall under your remit? Then you have to find out if that dress is in stock and reply back. Ignore it and the customer gets pissed off and doesn't buy from them - annoying your customer.
I would echo what has been said already, test the water and see how you go. But certainly do not give up a day job on the promise of this and gaining 50+ customers.
Imagine you do have 50 clients. There are on average 20-22 working days per month. That means that in each day you will need to update everything for 2.5 of your customers. That means you will only be able to spend 3 hours per month on each customer. They will expect their social media updated almost daily. There simply isn't enough time for one person to do that. Which means you need to hire somebody else. But generating £3000 a month is not enough to hire somebody else, so you need to increase the price. You do this and then it gets you into a whole different area.
In my honest opinion I think it's a non starter. You will spend far too much time for such little return. If you already had the track record of working for an agency, managing clients social media and you are looking to start on your own that is a different ball game. But sorry to be blunt about this, you don't have that experience yet to attract the type of customer that will pay you the money you need to make this a viable option. You'll just be working more and more on small customers who will expect too much for their money and ultimately not see any value in it as you'll be pulled from pillar to post by each client.
Okay so driving a bus will earn me around £16.5k a year before tax, If i had 30 contracts at £60 p/month that would be a turnover of £21k before expenses. I would be working from home so no office rent fee and the rest of expenses are from software etc so reasonably low. I understand buses will be around forever but I also dont want to be working for someone else forever. This is the reason im going to build slowly until I can run my business full time.
For me, the issue isn't the cost but the time you need to dedicate. I do my own SMM and it takes a good hour or so a day including:
-writing copy
-creating other media
-interacting with followers
-sourcing material of interest to my followers
-interacting on threads created by others to generate more followers without getting banned
If I were to offer your services and do what I'm doing for my business, I'd only have 5 or 6 clients and would have to charge £100-150 a week.
-writing copy
-creating other media
-interacting with followers
-sourcing material of interest to my followers
-interacting on threads created by others to generate more followers without getting banned
If I were to offer your services and do what I'm doing for my business, I'd only have 5 or 6 clients and would have to charge £100-150 a week.
Lee thank you for your response, the £60 figure was just a ballpark figure I believed was affordable to alot of small business' whilst gaining me some experience in this industry to create a "portfolio". I wasnt looking for a get rich quick business idea or anything of the sort. I am taking all of your comments into account and seriously thinking about the points you are making and I totally understand the stock example etc but I dont just want to throw in the towel. I understand the valid points regarding experience aswell but by working on small business' and outlining on the get go what they want doing with there SM and what my responsibilities will be regarding these accordingly would this not prove a viable way to gain experience?
Say the Bridal shop wanted to create more brand awareness, me and the client both come to a conclusion on where my responsibility's lie and what I will actually be doing rather than them thinking I should be keeping people up to date with stock etc without it to hand.
You have me thinking now Lee and as much as I dont want to throw the towel in I am determined to become my own boss, I have alot of thinking and planning to do.
P.S I am very jealous of your car!
haha
Say the Bridal shop wanted to create more brand awareness, me and the client both come to a conclusion on where my responsibility's lie and what I will actually be doing rather than them thinking I should be keeping people up to date with stock etc without it to hand.
You have me thinking now Lee and as much as I dont want to throw the towel in I am determined to become my own boss, I have alot of thinking and planning to do.
P.S I am very jealous of your car!
hahasammc123 said:
When you say writing copy, are you referring to Twitter here? And also yes I agree the mention feature and banning can be a problem for gaining new followers relevant to you especially when they don't even know you exist!
Twitter, Facebook, YouTube, Google+, any forums you might decide to post in.It's no problem at all. That's what these forums are for, helping each other out!
May I make a suggestion then? Perhaps you could draw up a fixed menu price structure and do it on a weekly, rather than monthly basis.
So for example:
Standard Package - £20 per week
2 Facebook updates
2 Twitter updates
Publication of relevant article of interest
General page tidy up
Enhanced Package - £50 per week
Daily Twitter & Facebook Updates
Linking with other relevant organisations
Publication of relevant article of interest
Commenting and promoting your page in others pages/accounts
Platinum Package - £100 per week
As above but with interaction with followers
Responses to questions
Platinum PLUS - £100 + TBA
As above but with Facebook (and soon to be twitter) adverts placed
You can arrange these and then place a markup on them for arranging them
I'm no expert so you'll have to come up with what is included and how much to charge, but something like that would suit you better. That way both you and the customer know EXACTLY what they are paying for and what they will receive. If they want more, they pay for it. This way you're increasing your earnings as your workload increases without a random price increase just because you are now busier.
Also I would personally put a weekly price as you WILL be doing work for them every week, so it makes sense to break it down weekly. Perhaps they want the top package but can't afford £400-500 per month, not a problem, you just do alternate weeks (depending on what you've included of course). It will give you and your customers more flexibility plus it has the added benefit of sounding less for a smaller amount.
Hope this has helped you. Do genuinely take on board what people have said as we are all talking sense! Take the job offer, work on this in evenings and weekends and see where it gets you.
Happy for you to drop me a line if you want any help
Oh, the car's gone by the way - but thank you! Need to update the garage when it's replacement turns up at the weekend....
May I make a suggestion then? Perhaps you could draw up a fixed menu price structure and do it on a weekly, rather than monthly basis.
So for example:
Standard Package - £20 per week
2 Facebook updates
2 Twitter updates
Publication of relevant article of interest
General page tidy up
Enhanced Package - £50 per week
Daily Twitter & Facebook Updates
Linking with other relevant organisations
Publication of relevant article of interest
Commenting and promoting your page in others pages/accounts
Platinum Package - £100 per week
As above but with interaction with followers
Responses to questions
Platinum PLUS - £100 + TBA
As above but with Facebook (and soon to be twitter) adverts placed
You can arrange these and then place a markup on them for arranging them
I'm no expert so you'll have to come up with what is included and how much to charge, but something like that would suit you better. That way both you and the customer know EXACTLY what they are paying for and what they will receive. If they want more, they pay for it. This way you're increasing your earnings as your workload increases without a random price increase just because you are now busier.
Also I would personally put a weekly price as you WILL be doing work for them every week, so it makes sense to break it down weekly. Perhaps they want the top package but can't afford £400-500 per month, not a problem, you just do alternate weeks (depending on what you've included of course). It will give you and your customers more flexibility plus it has the added benefit of sounding less for a smaller amount.
Hope this has helped you. Do genuinely take on board what people have said as we are all talking sense! Take the job offer, work on this in evenings and weekends and see where it gets you.
Happy for you to drop me a line if you want any help
Oh, the car's gone by the way - but thank you! Need to update the garage when it's replacement turns up at the weekend....
Thank you so much for that Lee! that has just made everything so clearer, looks like a late night of drawing up and editing for me then. If it is okay with you could I possibly email you in the future should I need any advice on where to take the business?
And I am defiantly taking the buses job but will put everything into building this into something bigger.
Thank you for your help everyone!
And I am defiantly taking the buses job but will put everything into building this into something bigger.
Thank you for your help everyone!
Fewer than 4 packages? If you wouldn't mind me asking how would you structure the packages whilst still reducing the amount? Im still trying to account for the fact that I will be driving a bus full time so cant just pull out my phone at any given moment. I need to make something where by I can set up scheduled times of the day for posting and promoting the clients business.
sammc123 said:
Fewer than 4 packages? If you wouldn't mind me asking how would you structure the packages whilst still reducing the amount? Im still trying to account for the fact that I will be driving a bus full time so cant just pull out my phone at any given moment. I need to make something where by I can set up scheduled times of the day for posting and promoting the clients business.
Too many packages might result in someone overly thinking which package to take and then just stumping for the cheapest.As to when to post, that depends entirely on the business. If it's aimed at other businesses, then it would make sense to post during the daytime. If the target is consumers based in the UK, then evening and weekend posts make more sense.
Yes I have had a look at Hootsuite along with buffer and have totally revised my pricing structure and plan as to how to tackle growing the business into a full time venture in the future. Hootsuite seems like an extremely viable options as I can do alot of my "post" work on the weekends/evenings. Freeing up a little more spare time spent away from work to grow this venture.
I grabbed a calculator and was thinking about how much I would charge if I were to do what I do for my own business. I'd charge a minimum of £100 a week but that would not include writing blog copy not answering questions that I'm not qualified to answer but simply forwarding them ("Do you have any teapots in blue?", "I've got sciatica, can you fit me in Wednesday?"). And could only realistically take on 5-6 clients. So my income would be £600 a week. Which isn't bad but isn't the road to an F458.
So to increase my income by taking on more clients, I'd need to employ someone. Could I get away with paying them £300 a week? How long before they'd start a rival company?
So to increase my income by taking on more clients, I'd need to employ someone. Could I get away with paying them £300 a week? How long before they'd start a rival company?
leemanning said:
There are on average 20-22 working days per month.
Not if you're self-employed. Weekends, evenings and bank holidays are all perfectly good working days; indeed, that's when you can get ahead of the pack.Anyway, it is all very well saying 'If I get X customers at Y pounds I will earn Z per annum. Great. But there are two damn big ifs there. Can you market? Do you have a USP? Can you sell? Can you handle the admin/bookeeping? Can you do the credit control? If you can answer all of those, then go for it.
Simpo Two said:
Anyway, it is all very well saying 'If I get X customers at Y pounds I will earn Z per annum. Great. But there are two damn big ifs there. Can you market? Do you have a USP? Can you sell? Can you handle the admin/bookeeping? Can you do the credit control? If you can answer all of those, then go for it.
Which reduces your working days to 3 a month. 
Okay so Ive been having a think myself and I do agree with you regarding the £100 min price but... Realistically lets say I have the 6 clients paying me for a basic package of publishing 1 relevant article, page tidy up and basic yet correctly worded posts to target the correct area. The post's I could spend a few hours on a Sunday afternoon writing them up wording them then scheduling them with buffer or hootsuite to upload on certain dates/times during the week. Now I have the problem of publishing 1 article for each of my clients thats 6 articles that now need to be written. I could do these at weekends/evenings and any extra spare time I may have. Could i justify employing somebody with 6 clients under my belt? the answer is no but £600 a week would allow me to leave full time work and focus on this business full time. Remember £100 a week would be for a limited package as you said so surely if I was working on this business full time I could find clients to take the more advanced packages. Eventually I agree I would need to employ someone but not until I felt 1) I could afford to 2} I couldnt possibly manage the work load myself no more and not being able to fully devote time to clients.
Also regarding the starting of a rival company this is one issue I havent thought through much right now but is there anything stopping any of us starting rival companies for any business' out there? Over the last few years PPI places have cropped up left right and centre, are they all using the same outlined business model? There all competing for the same clients?
What I am getting at is there anything out there to stop this from happening should I eventually employ someone?
regarding the F458 I can only dream of getting there! haha I would need lots of clients for that lets hope hardwork will pay off, if im pissing in the wind trying to make my fortune in this business well hey least I tried!
Also regarding the starting of a rival company this is one issue I havent thought through much right now but is there anything stopping any of us starting rival companies for any business' out there? Over the last few years PPI places have cropped up left right and centre, are they all using the same outlined business model? There all competing for the same clients?
What I am getting at is there anything out there to stop this from happening should I eventually employ someone?
regarding the F458 I can only dream of getting there! haha I would need lots of clients for that lets hope hardwork will pay off, if im pissing in the wind trying to make my fortune in this business well hey least I tried!
When I talk about charging £100 a week, I'd be expecting several posts on Facebook a day for the client. If you see how busy some people are on SM sites, you'll get what I mean. You can't just post 1 comment a week and charge £100. You're doing what they're too busy to do not what they can't be bothered doing.
Also you talk about tidying up their site - do you mean their website? Or their profile? That's a one-off, surely.
Also you talk about tidying up their site - do you mean their website? Or their profile? That's a one-off, surely.
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